Forums → WEPR → whats the difference?
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so,just about everybody has ruled out the possiblity of their being spcific Gods for a element.Such as the greek Gods,what is the difference however between believing in "mythology" and say for instance a Christan religion.Why is it more beliveable?Does anybody have a answer to why it is more believed that their is one God and not many? Why do people who believe in a God not realize that they are believing in the same thing that they also call rubbish?
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You're going to lose most people here if you go into epistemology.
I don't know if this is relevant or not to the topic at hand, But is Christianity's approach to knowledge, Christian epistemology a revelational epistemology? God supposedly created the Universe if we hold Scripture to be true. He created all our scientific facts. The human mind. The laws of science. The impress of God's plan is upon his whole creation. Should we bring evidentialism here since it's regarding religious epistemology? Treading very thin ice here.
Anyway in more layman terms, if we're going to talk about the nature of religious knowledge, then Christianity definitely seems much more constrained and restrictive; it's extremely mutually exclusive due partially to it's strict rules system and monotheistic nature? On the other hand, Greek religion seems much more fluid; they had a main pantheon but it was quite flexible, different city states even had different deities. Does this difference in nature spawn more fervent and dogged believers in the former?
Not that I think both can be proved though. Major caveat is that I'm swimming into dangerous pseudo philosophy.
Ok but deviating horribly. As to my earlier point, would like to add that Christianity seems to offer a much more idealized and appealing picture to adore. Which might explain the differences.
Though christianity has also changed quite a bit over time, mostly had to adapt (like heaven and hell not being physical places anymore). Maybe monotheism offered enough possibilities for the religion to idealize over time compared to other religions. Not that the Abrahamic religions were the first monotheistic religions, but probably the first to be able to establish themselves.
Another thing I find funny is that in certain mythologies, the very origin and nature of the deities are different. In christianity, god was always there and always had inherent powers. In Greek or Norse mythology, the gods were born early on during the birth of the world itself, they're kinda not the biggest powers out there. And in Norse mythology, the Aesir rely on Idunn and her apples to keep their youth, for without her they would grow old. This would never happen to the christian god.
Yea Christianity has changed. But increasingly we see the rise of fundamentalists. But we're going off.
Then again, is there any difference that makes Christianity such a force vs other religions? Why has it been so vasty established?
Then again, is there any difference that makes Christianity such a force vs other religions? Why has it been so vasty established?
It probably has to do with it's ability to highjack and incorporate other cultural traditions and beliefs. In this way they can say "Oh you believe X, well we offer X over here so come join us."
One big example of this assimilative behavior can be seen in the Celtic cross. It's whole existence is based on integrating pagan beliefs and symbols into a Christian form in order to get converts.
It probably has to do with it's ability to highjack and incorporate other cultural traditions and beliefs.
So these kinds of points, as well as nichodemus's points about the attractiveness of Christianity, can help us explain and track the transition from ancient gods to our modern spirituality. And there is a sense in which belief in Christianity is more 'attractive' that many other kinds of religious belief. But is sense of attractiveness what we're looking for when we say that X is somehow better to believe than Y?
Let's take 2 competing scientific explanations of some phenomenon. X does a very nice job of explaining it, although in a circuitous way. Y has all the explaining power of X, but Y is more simple, more intuitive. In this sense, Y is more attractive than X as an explanation. It fits certain epistemic criteria we have for what makes something worth accepting or believing. But I don't think this is the kind of attractiveness in play with Christian belief.
Certainly there is some relevant sense of attraction in the notion of having 1 god control the universe instead of many. It is certainly more elegant. But it seems to come up short under even minor scrutiny when we look at other epistemically favourable factors (e.g., predictions, verifiability, etc.).
Rather than focusing on why people accept Christianity, perhaps we should focus on a higher level of assessment. In other words, is there something that makes Christian belief more attractive - as a belief (or set of beliefs)? If the answer is yes (and I think it is) do these attractive features of Christian belief imply that it is somehow epistemically better off that its ancient predecessors?
Meh.. if christianity is so much more attractive and elegant in having a monotheistic religion, why then was Akhenaton's henotheism centered around Aton abolished after his reign? The ancient Egyptians had cults for each deities and the priests of the different cults didn't exactly love each other, yet they didn't want to unify under a single deity.
Akhenaton's henotheism centered around Aton abolished after his reign?Probably because people don't like religion forced upon them, when Jesus first founded Christianity the Jews had the choice of whether or not to convert.
The difference between Christianity and Greek mythology is like what someone else said, in greek mythology you have Zeus, who sleeps with any maiden he comes across, he sentences prometheus to have his liver eaten everyday by a bird forever because he stole fire, traps odysseus in the middle of nowhere for ten years, and various other mischievous deeds. The Christian God is forgiving and is always willing to take you back, that is one huge difference between the two.
Actually, wouldn't god go against this, anyway?I fail to see how.
okay, give me an example of when someone has created matter or energy, and I will give in.
If God is so forgiving, why does the NT God sanction genocide? Why does he ordain that non believers must burn in Hell?
In many senses, the Greek Gods showed themselves MUCH more akin to men. Zeus had lust, Aphrodite vanity, Hera jealousy, Persephone grief, Dionysus joy, Hades bitterness. Compared to the Christian God who seems to hide behind a statuesque benevolent facade, the Greek Gods seem a much more human like bunch.
Man is at the threshold of creating matter. Two photon physics ; go check it out.
The difference between Christianity and Greek mythology is like what someone else said, in greek mythology you have Zeus, who sleeps with any maiden he comes across
Yawheh is based on Zeus. He even gave birth to a demi-god you know as the Christ.
he sentences prometheus to have his liver eaten everyday by a bird forever because he stole fire,
Which was the basis for the forbid fruit in Christianity. The fire represents knowledge, before it man had been primitive beings that lived in caves and ate raw meat. Prometheus stole something he was not supposed to, knowledge that is, and gave it to man. Man then became powerful, building chariots and swords and towns and cloths using their new knowledge they had stolen from the gods. That is pretty much Adam, Eve, and the Serpant, except in this case Hercules rescued Prometheus once humanity figured out that knowledge was good for them.
It gets better: in the Greek myths, humanity was going to be punished as well as Prometheus. So the gods got together and created a woman, named Pandora. Then they gave the humans a box and told them not to open it, since it had everything bad in it, from death to disease. However they had given Pandora a great curiosity, in order to assure that their punishment would happen. So Pandora, the first women, opened to forbidden box and brought sin into the world. Sound familiar?
traps odysseus in the middle of nowhere for ten years
Trapping someone in the middle of the ocean? At least he was on a boat. Remember Jonah and the whale?
various other mischievous deeds
Like turning women into salt? Like demanding the sacrifice of a little girl, and going threw with it? Like killing all the first born of Egypt? O wait. Wrong god.
The Christian God is forgiving and is always willing to take you back, that is one huge difference between the two.
Hardly, he killed most of his enemies and tortured them forever...
okay, give me an example of when someone has created matter or energy, and I will give in.
Give me an example of when someone created a god, please. Or where did your god come from?
Persephone griefI think you mean Demeter, which is supposedly the reason for winter.
Like demanding the sacrifice of a little girl, and going threw with it?Two theories on that, one is that she was sentenced to eternal celibacy, the other that it was punishment for Jephthah making such a stupid oath.
Like turning women into salt?Like chaining people to have their liver eaten time and time again.
Like killing all the first born of Egypt?That was partially to show that he was real and the other gods were fake, and partially because pharaoh refused to let the Israelites go.
Hardly, he killed most of his enemies and tortured them forever...What are you talking about, hell? if so, hell is punishment for sinners, compared to heaven which is a reward.
Give me an example of when someone created a god, please. Or where did your god come from?You are dodging the question, God has always existed, and is not bound to scientific laws, the universe, except in the case of miracles, is bound to scientific laws.
p.s. nichodemus, what in the nt are you talking about, and could you give a source, that doesn't involve creating matter from energy.
Two theories on that, one is that she was sentenced to eternal celibacy, the other that it was punishment for Jephthah making such a stupid oath.
By killing her? The Greek gods once had a human sacrificed to them. They got pissed off that they had eaten a human, brought him back to life, and killed the man who had sacrificed him. Yawheh 0 Zeus 1
Like chaining people to have their liver eaten time and time again.
...Yeah...Exactly. So you see what I am saying? You are really similar.
That was partially to show that he was real and the other gods were fake, and partially because pharaoh refused to let the Israelites go.
So of course the logical thing to do was KILL THEIR CHILDREN. Really, that should never even be considered.
What are you talking about, hell? if so, hell is punishment for sinners, compared to heaven which is a reward.
He killed his enemies often, with everything from floods to hemorrhoids. And he sent them to hell, where they are tortured forever. At least the Greek gods do it on a case to case basis, good people get rewarded, people who angered the gods get punished in a special way, and people who did neither are just left in a neutral zone. They are so similar that some people think your heaven/hell was based on the Greek version...
You are dodging the question, God has always existed, and is not bound to scientific laws, the universe, except in the case of miracles, is bound to scientific laws.
No I am not. Why couldn't the universe just always be here? If everything needed to be created, then Yawheh would need to be created. If not, then he was unnecessary.
Your religion is extremely similar to the Greek version, which is the point of this post if I remember correctly. Are you trying to help me prove this?
That was partially to show that he was real and the other gods were fake, and partially because pharaoh refused to let the Israelites go.
you know that this "all 1st borns die" can be explained by science, history and biology.
and that there is no god required for that to happen.
I think you mean Demeter, which is supposedly the reason for winter.
Persephone wasnt exactly the willing bride you know.
No I am not. Why couldn't the universe just always be here?Because it is against the laws of science.
He killed his enemies often, with everything from floods to hemorrhoids. And he sent them to hell, where they are tortured forever. At least the Greek gods do it on a case to case basis, good people get rewarded, people who angered the gods get punished in a special way, and people who did neither are just left in a neutral zone. They are so similar that some people think your heaven/hell was based on the Greek version...Have you read greek mythology, They destroyed the world with a flood not long after pandora letting evil free. ((sarcasm) greek gods never punished the whole world. (/sarcasm))
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