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gun controle gone wrong again.

Posted Sep 28, '12 at 9:33pm

NoNameC68

NoNameC68

5,071 posts

Knight

i was wondering if you guys knew about this. and what your though on it is.

for me it's just clear that this couldn't have happend if gun were not on the public market.

The same can be said for people who become abusive after they get drunk. They wouldn't have gone on a drunken rage if alcohol was illegal.

I'm sure gun prohibition would have prevented this horrible, heartbreaking, accident. However, it was just that, an accident.

On the flip side, there's a story where a crook broke into a family's house and began to strangle the mother. The daughter grabbed the family pistol (it was sexy pink) and subdued the criminal. She protected her mother from being beaten, and perhaps saved her mother's life.

Link

The father who accidentally shot his own son is a sad story, and it must be horribly heartbreaking, but you have to look at what happened. It was a masked man holding a shiny object (perhaps a weapon?) that was breaking into a family member's home.  I don't know why they didn't reveal what the object was.

This wasn't a simple accident, it was a misunderstanding. It was an awkward scenario that rarely happens. Most people who break into homes while wearing ski masks are burglars. What are the chances that the burglar in this case turned out to be the man's son? This is one of those very unrealistic scenarios that rarely happen.

You can't blame the gun when the kid was dressed like a criminal performing a what seemed to be a criminal activity. If it had been criminal, and the father never fired his gun, who knows what would have happened?

 

Posted Sep 28, '12 at 9:40pm

NoNameC68

NoNameC68

5,071 posts

Knight

but as this case shows. there are people who instantly start shooting when they have the idea, they see a burglar.
so there could be some life spared.
even if it was a real burglar. i still don't see why he should be shot dead for it but w/e.

Furthermore, the father thought the masked man had a weapon and was going to use it. In most situations, when you see a masked man who tried to break into your house walk towards you wit ha weapon, you don't want to hesitate!

i'm just going to tose this in because it's the only 1 i know whitout searching. it's the top 3 homicide rating of 2011 per 100,000 citizens:
1. mexico - 18.3
2. estonia - 5.3
3. usa  - 5.0
4. forgot who - 3.7 (or something close (under 4.0 above 3.5))

Looking at countries as a whole can lead to misleading results. When you compare America to other countries where guns are completely outlawed, it seems like America has more violent crimes. However, when you look at cities and states within America, you'll often find that areas with the strictest gun laws have more violent crimes.

Furthermore, you also have to look at the number of crimes committed with guns, not the number of crimes as a whole. Then, you have to determine what kind of crimes those guns were used in. Were they gang related crimes? Were the crimes related to illegal trade, such as black market drugs?

There's just so much more you have to look at.

 

Posted Sep 29, '12 at 10:04am

danielo

danielo

1,394 posts

Yes you can. This thing almost only happen in USA. maybe as partydevil said, its a cultural diffrunce or something.

i just saw a week ago in the news that in kensas, a police man shot and killed a mental illed man, who lost his left hand and leg in a train accident. the officer claimed that this poor man "threat" him and his parthner, and stabbed his parthner with a pen. so he shot him. 2 times.

You in USA live like guns are natural. its not. in places were there are no guns for the mass there are no more crimes than in USA. wher i live, there is no one with gun. no one. and yet, there are no wild west here. the Lakota dont assult us every week, and the rapers dont **** everything that move.
Why its only happen in USA, all of these cases of 'gun saved my life"? why everywher else people go along without guns, and yet can protect themselve?

Its not the wild west peoples! yoo passed it! you dont need to arm yourself against the british! not everyone need a gun in his house!

a civilan guard? sure! this is ok. but when every house have a enough wepones to make a regional militia its not normal to me.

oh, and isnt that iileagal to kill? so why not everyoen kills, even if they realy want? isnt that ileagal to steal? as you say, you cant sstop someone from getting what he want. if you say "no wepones", there will be no more wepones. its take time and corporetion from the citizens, but tis work.

accident happen, sure. but you can stop them.

 

Posted Sep 29, '12 at 1:08pm

Kasic

Kasic

5,572 posts

Yes you can. This thing almost only happen in USA. maybe as partydevil said, its a cultural diffrunce or something.

This thing? What, accidental shootings? Those happen all over the world.

i just saw a week ago in the news that in kensas, a police man shot and killed a mental illed man, who lost his left hand and leg in a train accident. the officer claimed that this poor man "threat" him and his parthner, and stabbed his parthner with a pen. so he shot him. 2 times.

Link please. And again, even from an article, they aren't including everything...

in places were there are no guns for the mass there are no more crimes than in USA.

Yes there are. It depends on the situation inside the country for a great deal of it. Let's see...you were arguing stuff like this doesn't happen in Israel, that there's less crimes? The U.S.A has a population of 311.5 million. Israel has a population of 7.76 million. With each having similar numbers in assualt and Israel having many times more in rapes despite a much larger police force, all in terms of percentages...your argument is invalid. There ARE more crimes of the type that guns prevent occurring in Israel. It's just not focused on by the media.

but when every house have a enough wepones to make a regional militia its not normal to me.

Not every house...not even close. The people who have multiple guns and multiple types of them are not that common except in specific areas.

oh, and isnt that iileagal to kill? so why not everyoen kills, even if they realy want? isnt that ileagal to steal? as you say, you cant sstop someone from getting what he want.

It is illegal. People still kill and steal. You can make laws against things and they still happen. Calling the police isn't going to help every time either, because it takes time for them to respond if you're even able to contact them.

if you say "no wepones", there will be no more wepones

There will always be weapons. Whether someone decides to shave down a table leg or illegaly purchases firearms, if someone really wants to kill someone, they're going to try. All making weapons illegal does is make the law abiding non-crazy citizens unable to have a chance at defending themselves.

accident happen, sure. but you can stop them.

You can try and prevent accidents yes. They still happen.

Cars kill more people a year many times over than guns. Why aren't you arguing that we should all ride bicycles because some people are inept drivers? I know this is a semi red herring, but it's the same logic. Guns are a tool. How they are used is determined by the people who have them. Arguing that guns cause violence is retarded, because guns just sit there unless someone loads a bullet and pulls the trigger.

People cause violence. Not guns. People use guns as means to inact their violence, if they cannot get a hold of a gun they will use something else.

 

Posted Sep 29, '12 at 2:07pm

Drink

Drink

1,571 posts

and it also wouldnt of happened if the kid wasnt sneaking around with a ski mask on neither

 

Posted Sep 29, '12 at 3:15pm

NoNameC68

NoNameC68

5,071 posts

Knight

Yes you can. This thing almost only happen in USA. maybe as partydevil said, its a cultural diffrunce or something.

You mean gun crimes? This is true. If cars were illegal where you lived, then you wouldn't see car accidents either. Heck, if you banned pens, you wouldn't see pen stabbings.

and stabbed his parthner with a pen. so he shot him. 2 times.

Even though the police should have easily been able to subdue him, he did try to stab one of them with a pen.

I'm not saying that guns aren't abused, I've seen plenty of videos where cops do abuse their power (one cop shot a homeless man out of the blue, the homeless man literally did nothing wrong).

You in USA live like guns are natural. its not. in places were there are no guns for the mass there are no more crimes than in USA. wher i live, there is no one with gun. no one. and yet, there are no wild west here.

That's funny, same here! I grew up with guns!!

Its not the wild west peoples! yoo passed it! you dont need to arm yourself against the british! not everyone need a gun in his house!

Accidents happen, and not very often at all (considering the size of our population and number of people who own guns). If you're smart and you know how to handle guns, and you teach your children about gun safety from a young age, you shouldn't really have to worry as long as you keep your guns out of their reach and a clip of ammo hidden elsewhere for good measure.

You're saying accidental deaths wouldn't happen without guns, but you have to look at all the crimes in which guns have been used on criminals. I just linked a video where a daughter saved her mother's life by pulling a gun out on a criminal.

oh, and isnt that iileagal to kill? so why not everyoen kills, even if they realy want? isnt that ileagal to steal? as you say, you cant sstop someone from getting what he want. if you say "no wepones", there will be no more wepones.

This is worded really funny so I might not have understood it properly.

It's already illegal to steal and kill, yet people already do this, DESPITE these activities being illegal. I think you're saying people will still kill with guns, despite murder being illegal. But you need to understand, people will also own guns if they're made illegal as well.

It is illegal. People still kill and steal. You can make laws against things and they still happen. Calling the police isn't going to help every time either, because it takes time for them to respond if you're even able to contact them.

"When seconds count, police are only minutes away."

 

Posted Sep 29, '12 at 3:18pm

EnigmaX

EnigmaX

100 posts

Yes you can. This thing almost only happen in USA. maybe as partydevil said, its a cultural diffrunce or something.

You can't look at one nation and assume what (doesn't) work there can work in another nation. Take for example, Chicago and Washington DC. These two cities have some of the strictest gun laws in the nation. But both have disproportionate numbers of violent crimes and gun related deaths to area with less strict gun laws. Shouldn't such strict laws mean that theres be less crime?

i just saw a week ago in the news that in kensas, a police man shot and killed a mental illed man, who lost his left hand and leg in a train accident. the officer claimed that this poor man "threat" him and his parthner, and stabbed his parthner with a pen. so he shot him. 2 times.

Because the correct response would have been for the police officer to politely ask the attack to cease stabbing his partner, and if he wouldn't mind putting on these handcuffs while he's at it. -_-"

oh, and isnt that iileagal to kill? so why not everyoen kills, even if they realy want? isnt that ileagal to steal? as you say, you cant sstop someone from getting what he want. if you say "no wepones", there will be no more wepones. its take time and corporetion from the citizens, but tis work.

So first you say that the US should make fire arms illegal because people are getting murdered. Than you say that murder is illegal, and so no one gets murdered in the US. lolwut?

Actually, if you say "no weapons" not only would you be the laughing stock of every self-respecting criminal, but you'd be off to court for violativ the constitution. And when it's all said and done, you can take pride in knowing that you made absolutely no difference because criminals are still going about with guns.

And I have a question for everyone: Drugs are illegal in the US, and the Feds can't stop anyone from getting or doing them. So why would you think it'd go any differently with drugs?

 

Posted Sep 29, '12 at 5:33pm

HahiHa

HahiHa

5,033 posts

Knight

And I have a question for everyone: Drugs are illegal in the US, and the Feds can't stop anyone from getting or doing them. So why would you think it'd go any differently with drugs?

You mean, "any differently with guns"? And no. It wouldn't be any different. However people don't want to make guns illegal. They just want to increase the control/restrictions. After all even if drugs weren't illegal, they'd be controlled.

 

Posted Sep 29, '12 at 5:53pm

EmperorPalpatine

EmperorPalpatine

4,978 posts

for me it's just clear that this couldn't have happend if gun were not on the public market.

What if he got the same result using a homemade sling or a bow and arrow? How could such things be regulated?

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 1:41am

Masterforger

Masterforger

1,633 posts

If you make a bow do drive off burglers. well, i hope you will aim to the knee. maybe the ******* will becume a policeman.

We'll have that deleted until you can come up with something on-topic.

Anyway, the man had the right to shoot. The teenager was dressed in black, masked, and holding something. Heck, in that situation, I would have shot. You have to understand that when people are in the line of fire, or believe they are, they will attack without a thought. Shoot first, ask questions later. And why the hell was the son masked, in black, holding something, and breaking in?

 
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