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Animal Cruelty

Posted Dec 24, '12 at 3:04pm

blk2860

blk2860

3,686 posts

I eat meat all the time, I'm pretty much just saying Intentionally harming pets unless it's in self defense (Which 98% of the time it's not)

people who actively watch and bet at dog/rooster fights.

Which is a horrible from of animal cruelty.

 

Posted Dec 24, '12 at 3:21pm

Devoidless

Devoidless

3,553 posts

Then you need to choose your words more carefully
Simply saying "intentionally harm an animal" is nowhere the same as saying "intentionally harming a pet."

You need to better define what points you are supporting. As such...
Does this now mean harming non-pet animals is fine? Or is there a certain line where there is a separation between the two?

Your definition is still far too broad and vague.  Narrow down your views or else there are going to be pages of these questions and no discussion.

 

Posted Dec 24, '12 at 5:11pm

pangtongshu

pangtongshu

8,236 posts

Well okay. Animal Cruelty Is intentionally harming an animal in any other way than self defense.

You ignored my other question

What if the animal has just destroyed something of mine and I wish to spank it as punishment?

 

Posted Dec 24, '12 at 9:33pm

tegan190

tegan190

614 posts

What if the animal has just destroyed something of mine and I wish to spank it as punishment?

I think that spanking a pet, as long it doesn't hurt the animal too bad is just a form of discipline. I don't think that would be classified as animal cruelty, but you never know there's always people who feel differently. *cough* PETA *cough*

 

Posted Dec 24, '12 at 9:46pm

Kasic

Kasic

5,570 posts

I think that spanking a pet, as long it doesn't hurt the animal too bad is just a form of discipline.

Spanking is abuse to animals, and children...giving pain as a form of teaching is unnecessary and animals won't understand the reasoning behind it anyways, all they'll know is that you're giving them pain.

but you never know there's always people who feel differently.

There's also people who don't understand psychology. Young children and animals don't have the reasoning faculties that adults do. Spanking a child doesn't teach them that something is bad to do, it teaches them that it's bad to get caught doing it. It doesn't teach them the why behind anything and it also doesn't take into account that they simply might not have known that they did anything wrong to begin with. If you want to argue that you would tell them the whys during/after the spanking, there is no reason for the spanking to have taken place at all. I'm not going to go further on this as it would be derailing...

What if the animal has just destroyed something of mine and I wish to spank it as punishment?

Define "just" because unless you caught them while they were doing it or having finished it not 3 seconds ago, they aren't going to link any punishment with that particular action. Spanking won't teach them not to do it either, it will just make them hate you.

 

Posted Dec 25, '12 at 12:33am

pangtongshu

pangtongshu

8,236 posts

Define "just" because unless you caught them while they were doing it or having finished it not 3 seconds ago, they aren't going to link any punishment with that particular action. Spanking won't teach them not to do it either, it will just make them hate you.

Catching them in the act is fine..if not...showing them their result is quite sufficient. Animals aren't idiotic

Spanking is abuse to animals, and children...giving pain as a form of teaching is unnecessary and animals won't understand the reasoning behind it anyways, all they'll know is that you're giving them pain.

Negative reinforcement. They did something wrong, and a minor amount of pain shows gives a negative association to what they did wrong

 

Posted Dec 25, '12 at 12:59am

pangtongshu

pangtongshu

8,236 posts

My views on the 3 main form of punishment for an animal/child (since Kasic clumped 'em together..I shall as well). Scolding, "time-out", and spanking

Scolding
Easily the weakest of the 3. This one is dependent completely on the morals of the animal/child. If child/animal feels bad/remorse due to your scolding..then negative reinforcement will take affect. If the child/animal does not feel so (as in..relatively low morals) then there will be no negative association to the actions that said child/animal did.

Time-out
For animals, this is usually done by placing them in a kennel for some time. This one may work very well, as they could associate the action taken to having to take "time-out"...however, if the child/animal received a good amount of "thrill" (such as an adrenaline rush) then that thrill might give the actions taken a positive association, and having a time-out would just be a cost to that thrill

Spanking
Now keep in mind, this is not punching the child/animal here..just a reasonably measured spank. This gives an association of pain (although it is a minor amount of pain..it is pain nonetheless) and pain is a great reinforcer. Whether the child/animal received a "thrill" or not..or has low morals or not..they will still associate pain to that action, and that pain will override that thrill or morals (now, there are extremes out there that will show otherwise..but again..those are extremes)

 

Posted Dec 25, '12 at 11:22am

nichodemus

nichodemus

11,853 posts

Knight

I don't think animals will adhere to your command just after one round of scolding or time out. And really, time out? It seems pointless. Dogs will just sleep in the kennel, cats will just sleep in their baskets. And birds? It's not like you can take them out of the cage most of the time.

 

Posted Dec 26, '12 at 9:19pm

blk2860

blk2860

3,686 posts

What if the animal has just destroyed something of mine and I wish to spank it as punishment?

So, basically this is your logic "If I hit something it will do what i tell it to." Does that make very much sense?

 

Posted Dec 27, '12 at 3:34am

pangtongshu

pangtongshu

8,236 posts

So, basically this is your logic "If I hit something it will do what i tell it to." Does that make very much sense?

You do know what negative reinforcement is...right?

 
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