ForumsGamesPoor Observation vs Game Clones

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EndlessMarrow
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EndlessMarrow
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This has been a problem for all video games of old or new genres in the gaming industry, were crazy fanboy wails "oh this game is a minecraft clone" or when somebody is discussing a game of a different genre "Whoa, counterstrike Global Offensive is a rip-off of call of duty".

Listein these are statements or assumptions that are made everyday by a gamer that has not bothered to research the game and just assumes that its a rip-off no matter what you try to tell them. A good example of this would be for example: "Plasma burst is a clone of Raze since both of these games are set in the future but they only thing that separates Sir Raze from Sir Plasma Burst is that their entirely different in terms of gameplay and game mechanics. What i am trying to tell you is that we need to stop assuming and start gathering our facts about a game before we jump the gun on a game that could or could not be a copy, its just the game clones are setting up a new genre of gaming.

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EndlessMarrow
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EndlessMarrow
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White noise has 4 maps, 20 selectable characters with there own perks and has an actual story instead of just simply spawning you with no idea how you got there in the first place. If your going to keep assuming that white noise is a rip off then I'm just going to ignore you since you do not bother and I mean bother to actually do research on a game which you are failing miserably at so come back with some facts. By the way the monster is not Slenderman and it growls when it closes up.

ihsahn
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ihsahn
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None of those differences is substantial. Like I said earlier in the thread:

what a lot of clones do is merely repeat the clichés adding only very superficial differences in setting and gameplay but leaving all the core elements and tone untouched.


White Noise adds very shallow elements of story, there's no core difference between the characters, gameplay is still very much the same as Slender, the maps are similar and don't change the objective.
The essence of the game is completely untouched.

I'm sorry bro, this is a rip-off. Putting different clothes on me doesn't make a different person, any more than putting a few extra options in Slender makes it a different game. At best they can be said to have made a more complete version of Slender, but it's still someone else's game.
EndlessMarrow
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EndlessMarrow
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Okay true, but I like it because it was the only horror game I could get on Xbox. I couldn't get Slenderman because I had no idea on how to install it. Literally I couldn't understand how to extract the file or even run it?

I got mad at you and I'm sorry I was being ignorant

Mr_Sand
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Mr_Sand
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just simply spawning you with no idea how you got there in the first place.


Im pretty sure that Slender the game is based off of some people that created horrific monsters and the marblehornets series. The game has a backstory somewhere, actually I think it is in the Readme.txt before you play the game. So its not all just madness.

And White Noise may have more content than Slender but really, it was just an excuse to get Slender on the Xbox because the Developer of Slender was taking his sweet ole time in making any updates.
ihsahn
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ihsahn
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Okay true, but I like it because it was the only horror game I could get on Xbox. I couldn't get Slenderman because I had no idea on how to install it. Literally I couldn't understand how to extract the file or even run it?

I got mad at you and I'm sorry I was being ignorant

No worries mate, it happens
KentyBK
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KentyBK
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I feel this raises an interesting point: what about clones that are on a different platform than the original game? You still probably won't win any originality awards, but at the same time, you're introducing new people to the concept. I'd be willing to bet that's a large part of why such games become popular in the first place.

Also, I have no clue how Darksiders is supposedly the ripoff here, since it clearly has more than just God of War influences. Not to mention the sequel also plays quite differently from the first one.

Mr_Sand
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Mr_Sand
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I think if there is justifiable cause then its reasonable to make a clone/ripoff remake whatever. Then it should be made
First it should have at least 70-80 percent original content. The other 20 percent can be the part that seems to be a rip off
It should be better than the game it is similar to
If it is trying to be a gamestyle for a console that isn't on the current console then it should go above and beyond the other game.

ihsahn
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ihsahn
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Also, I have no clue how Darksiders is supposedly the ripoff here, since it clearly has more than just God of War influences. Not to mention the sequel also plays quite differently from the first one.
I haven't played Darksiders II, but I feel the first one draws very heavily from GoW. It's obviously not a glaring ripoff, but it's very much a trend follower.

I think if there is justifiable cause then its reasonable to make a clone/ripoff remake whatever.
See, I don't. I don't think it's ever reasonable to copy another game outright. That's uncreative and dishonest, no matter who you're "introducing" to the concept. It's like taking a song your friends haven't heard, changing the lyrics and showing it to them as your own. It doesn't make you some generous entity that introduces people to new experiences, it just makes you a thief. Besides, there's no shortage of good game ideas out there, as if we had to steal them to make any games at all. The vibrant indie scene proves that much.

By continuing to buy the same games remade over and over, gamers teach the industry it can get away with that, and we all lose, because new and interesting IPs are thrown aside to make way for First Person War Shooter 4. If you like a certain game so much, just... play it a million times, I don't know what else to tell you. There's no need for a bunch of re-treads when you have it already, is there?

First it should have at least 70-80 percent original content. The other 20 percent can be the part that seems to be a rip off
It should be better than the game it is similar to
But how would you quantify those things? It's very open to interpretation.
Mr_Sand
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Mr_Sand
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t's like taking a song your friends haven't heard, changing the lyrics and showing it to them as your own.

You just explained Dubstep :P

But how would you quantify those things? It's very open to interpretation

You just simply need to be honest, I know that is unrealistic nowadays but just some originality some original graphics some original ideas and some new things. It shouldn't matter to much if you throw in some of the same Call of Duty weapons because they are weapons from real life. Just don't blatantly copy something
KentyBK
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KentyBK
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I haven't played Darksiders II, but I feel the first one draws very heavily from GoW. It's obviously not a glaring ripoff, but it's very much a trend follower.


I can't deny that the combat is very similar to games like GoW and DMC, but the rest of the design is fairly Zelda-esque, right down to an overworld, dungeon maps and heart containers. And that I feel is an interesting combination in and of itself. The second one has more Prince of Persia-style climbing with Diablo loot.
It may be a trend follower, but I feel that combining different inspirations like this can lead to some unique experiences.

But even the combination of previous ideas seems downright offensive to some people of the internet, which is something I just don't get.

The vibrant indie scene proves that much.


That same indie scene also has innumerable amounts of pixel art games to "be retro". It's not just the big budget games that are guilty of this.

There's no need for a bunch of re-treads when you have it already, is there?


Even the most amazing game can get old after a while. With a sequel comes a new round of advertising and potentially new customers.
And let's face it, aside from various Nintendo IPs, COD (which is really what most of these discussions seem to revolve around) is probably the most well-known series to Non-gamers, because it's the one breaking records and attracting mainstream media coverage as a result.

As such, it *is* an important franchise, just not for the reasons most people like it to be. My guess is that COD will start to decline once the mainstream outside the industry gets tired of it. That or if everything crashes because of the economy. Whichever comes first I guess.
ihsahn
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ihsahn
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That same indie scene also has innumerable amounts of pixel art games to "be retro". It's not just the big budget games that are guilty of this.
I'm not absolving the indie scene from fads, just saying that there's an abundance of indie games proving there's always loads of interesting new game concepts to explore. They're really outdoing themselves out there if you look hard enough.

Even the most amazing game can get old after a while. With a sequel comes a new round of advertising and potentially new customers.
And let's face it, aside from various Nintendo IPs, COD (which is really what most of these discussions seem to revolve around) is probably the most well-known series to Non-gamers, because it's the one breaking records and attracting mainstream media coverage as a result.

As such, it *is* an important franchise, just not for the reasons most people like it to be. My guess is that COD will start to decline once the mainstream outside the industry gets tired of it. That or if everything crashes because of the economy. Whichever comes first I guess.

I guess that's all true. Doesn't make it less frustrating though
Mr_Sand
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Mr_Sand
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It seems to be a hit or miss situation for game developers. They have the option to create something they know for a fact works even if it is going to be similar to other games. Or they can completely outshine other games and come out with entirely new ideas and content with the possibility that yes, its new and maybe it won't work.
There is usually a lot of time spent making a game so people want to know if they can sell it.
Why make new content that could potentially lose money and bring them out of Business, when they can remake something that worked in the past.
The reason why games like call of Duty and Halo, mainstream game types, Mario. The reason they are becoming less popular is because they are getting getting old and people are tired of seeing the same thing.
It was great in the past because it seemed new and people liked how it was so they didn't mind seeing the same thing come out

pangtongshu
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pangtongshu
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Im pretty sure that Slender the game is based off of some people that created horrific monsters and the marblehornets series


Slender the game is based off of the MarbleHornet's "slenderman" (AKA The Operator).

MarbleHornet's The Operator is based off of Slenderman..but has key characteristics that make it different. I won't delve into the details as this is off-topic enough as it is.

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Moment of truth

Is Angry Bird's a rip-off of Crush the Castle (and speaking of..is Crush the Castle a rip-off of that other one I don't care about enough to find out what the name of it is)...or is the genre so specific/narrow in gameplay details that it's unfair to call it so?
samiel
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samiel
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Let me express many problems with the thing you are speaking of.
#1 Diablo is just a rip off of some other dungeon crawler
#2 Any fututristic shooter is a rip off of Halo for example Mass Effect

#3 Sleeping Dogs, Yukuza, and The Godfather are all GTA clones
#4 Painkiller is a Doom clone
#5 Hitman Is a Splinter Cell clone (or the other way around not sure)
Any certain methods of observation can be used to manipulate a subject and the one you speak of is called Selective Observation if I am not mistaken were you only look at what you want to look at.

ihsahn
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ihsahn
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Again we see a lot of confusion around the difference between "ripping off" and "taking influences". All forms of art take influences. All works of art build off of previous works of art.

Any certain methods of observation can be used to manipulate a subject and the one you speak of is called Selective Observation if I am not mistaken were you only look at what you want to look at.
That's why we use arguments and debate to get to the truth of things. Thanks for adding exactly nothing to the discussion.
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