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KnightDeclan
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KnightDeclan
479 posts
Peasant

http://fisheaters.com/traditionalcatholicism.html

This has basically everything you need to know about the true religion.

http://www.traditionalcatholicpriest.com/2013/02/27/traditional-popes-vs-new-popes/

And this is exactly what i was talking about the popes.

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Wyrzen
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Wyrzen
326 posts
Shepherd

Don't take my word for granted, because I'm just an amateur ;:P Jesus gives Peter 'leadership' (I couldn't think of another word, my vocabulary is not very large) over the Church in Earth.


I appreciate the attitude; many Christians on here are arrogantly sure their blind faith proves all.

I'm just not seeing him given any leadership, other than saying he is blessed for knowing who He is, and that this is the rock of His church.
KnightDeclan
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KnightDeclan
479 posts
Peasant

The name Peter means Rock, in the original aramaic or hebrew, the bolded words were the same, the belief that Peter and the rock that the church was built on didn't start until the mistranslated greek, which used the masculine version of the world Petros instead of Petra (or whatever the words were), which in one dialect of greek, Petros means pebble and Petra means boulder.

Does this change anything at all? Do you think they used the exact words from every translation. If you put on English subtitles on an English dub over anime, they don't match. The subtitles are direct translation, but the dub is put in the dubber's own words. I only responded to this because it's the only comment here that actually tries to argue with what I'm saying with a valid point, rather than random mockery.
Wyrzen
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Wyrzen
326 posts
Shepherd

Does this change anything at all? Do you think they used the exact words from every translation. If you put on English subtitles on an English dub over anime, they don't match. The subtitles are direct translation, but the dub is put in the dubber's own words. I only responded to this because it's the only comment here that actually tries to argue with what I'm saying with a valid point, rather than random mockery.


Uh. It actually changes a lot.

Translating actually can cause a lot to be left out or misinterpreted. Obviously. Look at the massive amount of different christian sects.
Salvidian
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Salvidian
4,229 posts
Blacksmith

The following argument(s) do not reflect my personal ideals or beliefs

Translating actually can cause a lot to be left out or misinterpreted. Obviously. Look at the massive amount of different christian sects.


Translating is one thing and different interpretations are another. When considering the Bible in its entirety, what real difference does it make if Peter was really a rock or a pebble or a boulder? I don't think it does.

I don't think there is much logic in saying different sects are created through different translations, when each sect thinks of the Bible differently. But maybe they're related, who knows? Interpretation and translation I mean.

I am filling in for another role
EmperorPalpatine
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EmperorPalpatine
9,427 posts
Jester

This is the part where I'd go into detail and point out that written communication from word-of-mouth is a terrible channel for a 'erfect' being to use, but I'm tired.

Freakenstein
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Freakenstein
9,554 posts
Bard

This is the part where I'd go into detail and point out that written communication from word-of-mouth is a terrible channel for a 'erfect' being to use, but I'm tired.


Good thing no proper courthouse uses this as admissible testimony!*
EmperorPalpatine
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EmperorPalpatine
9,427 posts
Jester

Well, there's not much point in giving a long-winded semi-rant about it if the other side wears earplugs.

Wyrzen
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Wyrzen
326 posts
Shepherd

Well, there's not much point in giving a long-winded semi-rant about it if the other side wears earplugs.


Yeah, that sums up this situation pretty nicely.
Jacen96
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Jacen96
3,113 posts
Herald

I'm just not seeing him given any leadership, other than saying he is blessed for knowing who He is, and that this is the rock of His church.


in Matthew 16:19, Jesus says that he will give the keys to the kingdom to Peter, and whatever he binds/looses on earth will be bound/loosed in heaven.

In the book of Acts, i believe, there is an argument about whether the gentile converts need to follow abrahamic laws (such as circumcision). After calling a counsel to discuss it, there is argument for each side until PETER stands up and decrees that circumcision is not necessary (all of this is if i remember correctly)

Peter was really a rock or a pebble or a boulder?
To some Protestants it makes all the difference on the subject of Peter being the leader of the church. Using different words to describe Peter and the church indicates that it is unrelated, while by using the same word shows how important Peter is.

~~~Darth Caedus
OperationNilo
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OperationNilo
3,988 posts
Farmer

Adoration and reverence has nothing to do with truth value.

I don't know what you want to prove with that. Ah, well then. Back to business.

I appreciate the attitude; many Christians on here are arrogantly sure their blind faith proves all.

I'm just not seeing him given any leadership, other than saying he is blessed for knowing who He is, and that this is the rock of His church.

(Thanks mate)
Well, the point of scripture is trying to find out what each part means and how it can be applied to real life (that's what I try to do ;:P). I've also felt God (as odd as it may seem to be to you, but there aren't any words to describe it, if you know what I mean. Not directly, of course, just a feeling). I don't know how to explain it, I just feel it in my gut that he's out there doing something. That's proof enough for me. If I couldn't trust myself, then who could I trust?

Answering your second point, the Pope is Christ's representative on Earth (Caution-keep the word 'representative' in mind). So that kinda makes him a 'leader' as well. That said, a rigorous process is made to elect him, so not any regular Joe can walk into the Vatican and become the Pope.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,498 posts
Blacksmith

Well, the point of scripture is trying to find out what each part means and how it can be applied to real life


Sounds like a good way to make something vague and have it say pretty much whatever we wish it to.

I've also felt God (as odd as it may seem to be to you, but there aren't any words to describe it, if you know what I mean. Not directly, of course, just a feeling). I don't know how to explain it, I just feel it in my gut that he's out there doing something. That's proof enough for me.


Would you consider a child's gut feeling that there is a monster under his bed as proof that there was? It's really no different. Further more there are plenty of people who can describe similar feeling about not just the existence of whatever deity they may believe in but of all sorts of things. Not to mention how we have been able to artificially generate such feelings.

If I couldn't trust myself, then who could I trust?


Your emotional state on something can be misleading and even your memory of something can be false. So internally, no you can't trust yourself. This is why it's so important that we cross examine with an objective source.
OperationNilo
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OperationNilo
3,988 posts
Farmer

Sounds like a good way to make something vague and have it say pretty much whatever we wish it to.


Understanding scripture is not a matter of convenience. Your opinion on Christianism is somewhat distorted, but many christians don't exactly follow God's will very well, so I don't blame you.

Would you consider a child's gut feeling that there is a monster under his bed as proof that there was?


But would the child believe in the monster? That is the important matter. Sure, you could tell the child that there is no monster and that he was just imagining or something, but the child would never forget that feeling, nor trust the flooring under his bed.

Further more there are plenty of people who can describe similar feeling about not just the existence of whatever deity they may believe in but of all sorts of things.


I understand that very clearly. But these kinds of feelings are something you must experience to know their true value, not something you read from a science book. I can't even explain what I felt.

Not to mention how we have been able to artificially generate such feelings.


I don't remember being plugged into a machine when I felt that.

--

Your emotional state on something can be misleading and even your memory of something can be false. So internally, no you can't trust yourself. This is why it's so important that we cross examine with an objective source.


There's a quote I like very much. I think, therefore, I am.
Kasic
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Kasic
5,598 posts
Scribe

but many christians don't exactly follow God's will very well,


This is what every religious person thinks, about every other person in their religion and any other religion. It's all personal interpretation with absolutely not backing of any sort. Anyone can say anything and be just as right as anyone else.

but the child would never forget that feeling, nor trust the flooring under his bed.


Yet the monster is still not real.

There's a quote I like very much. I think, therefore, I am.


Note that it doesn't mean, "Everything I think is true is true."
OperationNilo
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OperationNilo
3,988 posts
Farmer

This is what every religious person thinks, about every other person in their religion and any other religion. It's all personal interpretation with absolutely not backing of any sort. Anyone can say anything and be just as right as anyone else.

Are you new to planet Earth? Are you in need of an introduction?

Yet the monster is still not real.

Yet that was a metaphor.

Note that it doesn't mean, "Everything I think is true is true."

When did I say it meant that?
OperationNilo
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OperationNilo
3,988 posts
Farmer

And with metaphor I mean hypothetical example.

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