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Women in Combat

Posted Dec 13, '13 at 6:13pm

danielo

danielo

1,396 posts

I will say again, Israel have female as soliders, some even in fighting rules, and its just fine. I dont see your problem at all.

I dont know about your army Nich, but i serve with female soliders. And they get what they need just like i do. They have a Gynecologist coming once a week, the "shekem", a military operated shop, sell higyenic materials (and candies, toothpaste and anything else you need), we get 3 meals a day (free afcours) and life in general is good.
But even more, the Karakal soliders (a unit mixed with males and females) are operating. And the females live just like any other solider, sleep in the dirt and running and etc.

You need to understand - the modern solider dont need to be extra strong. He need to be diciplaned, hard working and with will power. Sure most females dont start working out from teenage years, so you may low a little the demands at first, but when they get in they also get in shape. And befor the recruitment, like a year or two befor, any girl that intending to be in a fighting rule, start to work out. My friend went to a project while in school, kind of "befor the army",in which they ran long distances, carried "injured", made field food and in general got ready to the army. And less then half of them were girls. I know some which became fighters.

Summary for my confusing rambeling : There are Women in combat. And they are doing well.

 

Posted Dec 13, '13 at 9:26pm

nichodemus

nichodemus

12,164 posts

Knight

Do you think it would have been different if it wasn't such an unequal proportion of males to females?

No I don't. I think it'll get worse in fact. They didn't target the women because there were so few of time, they did it because they just wanted to.

@Danielo - No, I don't mind individual units if they can get along well. But not all units/men will be that understanding. It messes up the dynamics. It brings up the issue of feminism pretty sharply - we recently had an army song banned because a feminist group found it offensive, and there was much angry murmuring in the army.

I do not dispute that the modern solder does not need to rely solely on his or her brute strength, however, other factors come into play that tip men over women, naturally. Take aggression for instance. More testosterone means more aggression, which translates to a tougher, fiercer soldier who is more willing to engage in combat.

 

Posted Dec 13, '13 at 10:34pm

Kasic

Kasic

5,591 posts

No I don't. I think it'll get worse in fact. They didn't target the women because there were so few of time, they did it because they just wanted to.

Then the next question. Do you think the harassment would go away after it became "normal" for women to be there?

And the next one, isn't the fact that there's harassment occurring demonstrate that there's a problem to begin with?

 

Posted Dec 13, '13 at 11:35pm

nichodemus

nichodemus

12,164 posts

Knight

Do you think the harassment would go away after it became "normal" for women to be there?

Nope.

And the next one, isn't the fact that there's harassment occurring demonstrate that there's a problem to begin with?

There is a problem. It's not just in the army too, but when you put it in the context of a work place where testosterone is meant to be up and running, it gets worse.

 

Posted Dec 14, '13 at 12:12am

Kasic

Kasic

5,591 posts

Nope.

And why is that? According to Danielo, things aren't the same way in Israel. I would also think that, based on what I know of people, that once it was seen as normal for women to be in the army and men knew they wouldn't get away with harassing the women, it would no longer be a problem.

The exact same arguments on keeping women out of the armed forces can basically be compared with those on segregation. Less able to perform, causes conflicts, etc...

 

Posted Dec 14, '13 at 12:48am

nichodemus

nichodemus

12,164 posts

Knight

And why is that? According to Danielo, things aren't the same way in Israel. I would also think that, based on what I know of people, that once it was seen as normal for women to be in the army and men knew they wouldn't get away with harassing the women, it would no longer be a problem.

Because in the States, the number of sexual assaults per year numbers near 19,000, yet because of the slow, bureaucratic processes, coupled with the stigma, means that few of these cases are prosecuted, or even when they are, reach a general court martial.

I would argue that segregation and keeping most women from the army, or at least from the front lines are different issues. One was built on ignorance and misled bigotry, the other built on biological issues of which we can only control to a certain extent. Segregation was formed on the idea that other races were inferior intellectually, when we know that more or less this is hogwash, rectified once we pulled down the dams blocking them from proper education; yet we know for sure that in combat, men are on the whole far more effective, purely due to how they are born.

 

Posted Dec 14, '13 at 12:49am

nichodemus

nichodemus

12,164 posts

Knight

Caveat - This does not mean I would not like to see more women in the army if need be; I would merely not favour them on the front lines. I know many capable logistics, supply and admin female soldiers. Auxiliary roles.

 
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