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Theism and Atheism

Posted Jan 25, '13 at 7:27pm

MageGrayWolf

MageGrayWolf

9,814 posts

Knight

At this point we can jump into the saltatorism vs. gradualism debate, never to come out of it again ^^ Though this might be one of those cases where both are right in some way.. at least it seems 8my were enough for a complete marine ecosystem to evolve after the end-permian extinction events (link). Of course, there's still a huge difference between 8my and a few thousand years...


I doubt it's one or the other. I would also expect abrupt transformation to occur if the Earth underwent a global flood. We would see new ecosystem form in a relatively short period of time. However this still couldn't account for the amount of diverse species we have without having more time. Given what we have seen from things like nylonase and the Italian wall lizards this process of rapid evolution takes about 35-50 years. in 4,000 years that could allow for only having a little over 100 species per. That would also require the process to be continuous and not hit a point of stasis.

But as you stated even one of our better examples of an entire ecosystem developing still required millions of years.
 

Posted Jan 29, '13 at 12:55am

EmperorPalpatine

EmperorPalpatine

9,475 posts

Well, since things have slowed down a bit, I'd like to hear an explanation from Christians and others who follow the Abrahamic God for why He kills a baby (context). Unlike most deaths in the bible that God either directly causes or commands against those who are evil/disobedient/blasphemers/sinners, this child was entirely innocent.

 

Posted Jan 31, '13 at 2:05pm

Kasic

Kasic

5,746 posts

This response was prompted by thebluerabbit's post in a different thread...

I always love how theists simply...assume, that whatever god there may be is one that is benevolent, kind, fair, or whatever. Else. HAVE YOU EVER READ ANY SORT OF THEOLOGICAL TEXT? Almost ALL of them, in nearly EVERY story, are about humans being punished by gods. Most of the time, for petty reasons, or for things gods did to one another.

How do you know that your god is loving/fair/kind? Because some book tells you so? I think I would read that book again and see exactly what it is your god does, because the word "loving" certainly doesn't spring to mind when I look at the bible. Bloodthirsty, Fickle, Murderer, Instigator, Dictator, Narcissistic, and more certainly leap out, but not Kind, Loving, Thoughtful, Benevolent, Savior, or anything of the sort.

 

Posted Jan 31, '13 at 10:54pm

Kasic

Kasic

5,746 posts

More from the wonderful world of religion.

Waitress gets fired after a pastor refuses to pay tip

 

Posted Feb 1, '13 at 5:47am

wearemonkeys

wearemonkeys

5 posts

i have heard so many of these once in a life time moments or magical feelings that have converted non-believers. you people are a dime a dozen and it always seems to be a feeling you get. i dont understand how you can base your entire belief around a feeling? i doubt some of these stories are even true.
what about me i went to church when i was younger i didnt really believe but i always thought there was a god but after going to church for about 2 years i realized it was all a bunch of crap! church drove me to atheism! you try and take someone seriously when they apparently spoke in tounges and they got the holy ghost at church camp and their eyes rolled in to the back of their heads and they felt light headed when the holy spirit was entering their body (my ex). christian protestant by the way. not buying any of it for a second.
yes we can comprehend a perfect being and the one described in the bible is not perfect. create us with free will and immediately restrict us by instituting fear and guilt. give us free will and original sin. how sick is that. not to mention the hissy fits god throws in the bible for worshiping another god i know people who have gotten over jealousy and would not **** them to hell for liking another. (within the guidelines by the way). fact of the matter we cannot prove or disprove god because it is untestable and the only thing we can rely on is logic or the "feelings" we get. you should look up all the harm religion has done to the world, your jaw will drop. i would say more but this is too long for people to read and lord knows (ha) most wont. good for you if you did lol.

 

Posted Feb 1, '13 at 8:31am

thebluerabbit

thebluerabbit

5,392 posts

i also find it extremely funny that they say that non-christians go to hell. i asked a person, what if he never ever heard about christianity? he told me that in that case they would go to heaven because he wouldnt know about it.

so do tell me, why the hell do people keep talking about christianity. you know, if christianity was a secret religion, if people stopped talking about it and only teach family members about it (or simply not even that and just let it die) then everybody would automatically go to heaven. in a way, the religion just calls out for its destruction with this stupid rule

 

Posted Feb 1, '13 at 11:43am

EmperorPalpatine

EmperorPalpatine

9,475 posts

free will

I found Gen 19:15-16 in which Lot was told to make haste and leave the city of Sodom before it was destroyed. He hesitated, disobeying the order to leave quickly, he and his wife and daughters were dragged out. That's not free will.
 

Posted Feb 1, '13 at 4:46pm

MageGrayWolf

MageGrayWolf

9,814 posts

Knight

Well, since things have slowed down a bit, I'd like to hear an explanation from Christians and others who follow the Abrahamic God for why He kills a baby (context). Unlike most deaths in the bible that God either directly causes or commands against those who are evil/disobedient/blasphemers/sinners, this child was entirely innocent.


I think the same can be said for the first borns in Egypt. They did nothing. They were put to death by God for something someone else was doing.

God is Not Good from "God on Trial"
 

Posted Feb 1, '13 at 4:55pm

Salvidian

Salvidian

4,299 posts

I always love how theists simply...assume, that whatever god there may be is one that is benevolent, kind, fair, or whatever. Else. HAVE YOU EVER READ ANY SORT OF THEOLOGICAL TEXT? Almost ALL of them, in nearly EVERY story, are about humans being punished by gods. Most of the time, for petty reasons, or for things gods did to one another.


Actually about half of most American Indian religions have gods that do nothing but teach and create. Example: The Cherokee's god, Maheo
 

Posted Feb 1, '13 at 5:08pm

EmperorPalpatine

EmperorPalpatine

9,475 posts

I think the same can be said for the first borns in Egypt. They did nothing. They were put to death by God for something someone else was doing.

Some go with "They were unbelievers, worshipping false gods. If they were good, they would've put the lamb's (?) blood on their doors. They had a way to be spared and they chose not to."
 
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