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Theism and Atheism

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 12:18pm

09philj

09philj

2,547 posts

Why would a benevolent God create us if He knew we would cause such widespread suffering and destruction? There is no benefit to God in creating such beings unless God has some requirement that we can fulfill, God must create beings, or God did not create us. This would suggest that the creation of the human race was a selfish act for God's benefit only or God is not our creator. (You can't argue our creation was for our benefit as it is only beneficial to us if we had already been created.)

Anyway, why should God be our master? What can he offer us that is not attainable in life? Due to humanity's endless capacity to be bored, eternal bliss is something I do not believe is attainable. (furthermore, what is bliss worth without a lack of it?) There is of course, the threat of an eternity hell, but this seems to be an overreaction to a mere lifetime of misdeeds. (And what sort of love is that?)

The final thing I have to say is this. Why does God need worship? If you follow his rules and recognize that He is there, what good is it prostrating yourself sycophantically before Him every day? It could be that proof denies faith and without faith He is nothing. However, that would mean all that would be required to destroy God would be to prove he exists.

 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 12:20pm

pangtongshu

pangtongshu

10,090 posts

Convincing the fanatics too.


And you couldn't do so without delving into their belief system as if it were law?

Dude, you're the one that has to prove me, considering how there is no evidence of God even existing.


As Moe has stated, which is a larger reiteration of what I stated, because of your gnostic stance you must also prove your position.

In case you are wondering how...a picture:
http://i.stack.imgur.com/yX0vu.png

While atheism is the disbelief in a deity, which is inherently a position which does not need to be backed (as same with agnostic theism), gnostic atheism is the belief there are no deities. A key difference, if you can catch it.
 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 12:22pm

Fiends

Fiends

114 posts

pang also mentioned that you're taking on a gnostic atheist position. That means that you're claiming knowledge of the proposition that God doesn't exist. This stance requires some serious justification - the same sort that would be required by a gnostic theist. Since you haven't provided an argument, your position has no grounding.


I don't need to give justification because at least science is capable of giving evidence of the creation of the world, unlike religion

How did god get here? Do you think god just appeared out of nowhere? What is this a fairy tale? Come on, get real. God isn't going to pop out of no where like that, someone had to create him right?
 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 12:22pm

09philj

09philj

2,547 posts

The question of intelligent design also works against God in that were I an omnipotent, omniscient being who could create any life I would build something better than humans.

 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 12:25pm

09philj

09philj

2,547 posts

God isn't going to pop out of no where like that, someone had to create him right?


There is always the possibility that God has a God who has a God who has a God who has a God ad nauseum.
 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 12:25pm

Fiends

Fiends

114 posts

Anyway, why should God be our master? What can he offer us that is not attainable in life? Due to humanity's endless capacity to be bored, eternal bliss is something I do not believe is attainable. (furthermore, what is bliss worth without a lack of it?) There is of course, the threat of an eternity hell, but this seems to be an overreaction to a mere lifetime of misdeeds. (And what sort of love is that?)



Listen to this guy, with hard work you can get everything you want, without having to waste your time begging for a non-existent being to change your life around.
 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 1:15pm

FishPreferred

FishPreferred

2,057 posts

@Fiends; who exactly are you trying to convince, and how do you intend to convince them?

How is the universe popping out of nowhere any more logical than a god doing so? There is no evidence of the creation of the world by any means. If only for that reason, your argument is not self-sufficient.

 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 3:57pm

pangtongshu

pangtongshu

10,090 posts

I don't need to give justification


Except, you do. Because, as stated multiple time, you have asserted a -gnostic- stance
 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 4:10pm

Fiends

Fiends

114 posts

How is the universe popping out of nowhere any more logical than a god doing so? There is no evidence of the creation of the world by any means. If only for that reason, your argument is not self-sufficient.


The big bang theory makes more sense than a divine entity that coincidentally never exposes itself.
 

Posted Feb 5, '14 at 4:12pm

Fiends

Fiends

114 posts

Except, you do. Because, as stated multiple time, you have asserted a -gnostic- stance


Too bad you didn't answer the other things i wrote.
 
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