ForumsWEPRLeft wing economics

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thelistman
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thelistman
1,416 posts
Shepherd

Everyone that I know who calls themselves a "Socialist" or "Communist" is an extreme hypocrite. A simple definition of Socialism is where âproperty and the distribution of wealth are subject to control by the community.â Socialism also calls for Workerâs Councils to take over the means of production. It is a working class movement. I can respect an organized working class. I am going to be a teacher in the future and will make crap for a salary. But that is my choice. Capitalism gives me equal opportunity to pick my career. I could have been an engineer making at least $50K first year. But because of Capitalism, I have a choice. And I decided to become a teacher. I believe in the Capitalist system because it makes people work for their money. Socialism is an oppressive system that tries to stop the natural order of economics.

Something I have seen lately is the number of âSocialistsâ who have appeared amongst the youth of America. Are they here to go against their parents? Maybe. Every generation has children who do not agree with their parents. Are they here to start a revolution? Possibly... All generations have their âwanna-be revolutionaries.â Or are they here because they want to stir things up? This is what I think they are after. From what I have seen the average left-economist has been a spoiled, rich, drugged up, white kid who wants to rebel against society.

All of my friends who claim to have left-wing economic values are all white and are from wealthy families. I find it a bit weird that they continually talk about how the "white race" oppresses everyone. Even as they argue this, they continually do things to bring down the working class and minorities.

One of my college friends who labels himself as a âleftist socialist revolutionaryâ grows marijuana and sells it for a huge profit. I noticed most of his customers were of ethnic minorities as well. When I asked how this was compatible with Socialism and racial equality, he ignored me at first. He later explained that marijuana was a symbol for the leftist movement. He never explained how selling it for huge profits was compatible with his beliefs though. I continued to press him on the issue, and all he could come up with was âIâm spreading the love equally like Socialism calls for!â His hypocrisy was so evident that I did not even have to continue questioning him.

Another friend of mine who claims Socialism is the greatest thing ever continuously shops at Wal-Mart, a massive corporation. She apparently has no problem with Wal-Mart and her economic beliefs, because she is ill-informed. I asked her if it was okay for a Socialist to shop at Wal-Mart, and she said it was no problem. She did not see the problem with it.

Another example of economic leftist hypocrisy that I have is within the gay community. I know several gay people from college. Many of them wear âCheâ t-shirts. If you do not know who Che is, then look here: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Che_Guevara, His photo on the right side is a symbol for Socialists and Communists across the globe. In fact, most Historians agree that it is the most important photo of all time. You can see his image on shirts like this: http://www.geocities.com/socialist_action/che.gif). Ernesto âCheâ Guevara was one of the most devoted Communists I have read about. Yet he had thousands of Christians killed for their beliefs. He had hundreds executed for owning large plots of land. More importantly for this argument, Che had thousands of people executed for being homosexual. Now how could any homosexual wear a t-shirt with Cheâs image on it? Economic left wingers love Che for his devotion to Socialism and Communism, yet they blind themselves to the fact that he was a ruthless killer of homosexuals, religious people, and those who owned land. This is yet another hypocrisy of left-wing economists.

The best example I have is of my geography teacher in college. He was a devout Communist. He denied the Cambodian and Bosnian genocides (both committed by Communists). He denied the purges of Stalin and the Ukranian Famine he caused. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_terror, and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor). Stalin killed more than Hitler, yet this teacher claimed Stalin was one of the most democratic rulers ever. This teacher stuck by his die-hard Communist ideology. But one day, I found him shopping in a Wal-Mart. Just like my friend who claimed to be a Socialist, this man was shopping in a Wal-Mart. I did not have to say anything to him, but once he saw me there, his face turned red and he walked away. The next class he kicked me out when I argued that the Bosnian genocide was real. In fact, I had just seen a video of Bosnians being killed, execution style, by Communist forces. He told me that the video was fake, and then he kicked me out of class. He could not deal with the truth, so he got rid of me... typical Socialist thought.

I know that we live in a Capitalist society. Socialists and Communists have to live by making money in the society that exists. But when they shop at Wal-Mart (instead of local âMa and Paâ stores), or when they sell drugs for unbelievable profits, or when they support a mass killer like Che, they are being complete hypocrites. I have to wonder about the devotion of these so called âSocialistsâ and âCommunists.â They can claim to be economic left-wingers all they want, but by their actions, they cannot deny their love for Capitalism.

  • 134 Replies
VoteSocialist
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VoteSocialist
950 posts
Nomad

You sure can. I mean, the moderators might disagree as it's a private forum & they set the rules - but I won't stop you. On the flip-side of the coin, I'm only exercising my right to inform you that I dislike it when people 'speak' in all-caps. Do what you like.


My freedoms ARE resricted in a private system then. Socialism is better than capitalism if you want more rights!
VoteSocialist
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VoteSocialist
950 posts
Nomad

So.. you didn't read it. Okay, here are the bits you needed to pay attention to:
That's one of the reasons why there are decibel limits to how loud you can be doing something, even on private property because the sound becomes public.
That was me saying you're not allowed to play heavy metal as loud as you want in your own backyard.

You can, however record a heavy metal album and release it on the internet, or on CD for people to listen to it if they *choose*
That was me saying that you can cut records in a studio and sell them or distribute them as you please so that people can freely buy/pick it up and listen to it. You'll note I don't mention a 'backyard' in that sentence.


So there ARE limits to how you can say something in capitalism? Gee, a more regulated media was just rationalized in a flash!
donpiet
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donpiet
755 posts
Peasant

My freedoms ARE resricted in a private system then. Socialism is better than capitalism if you want more rights!


both systems limit freedoms in some sort of a way. otherwise living in a society is not possible. the difference is, that socialism, tries to take peoples private properties away(companies, means of production etc.) wheares in the capitalistic systems you are allowed to use them as you wish
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

My freedoms ARE resricted in a private system then. Socialism is better than capitalism if you want more rights!


And what about a person's rights under a capitalist society to amass a significant amount of wealth? Under socialism, their rights are being taken away. In their case, you could easily argue that socialism is more restrictive, and capitalism offers them more rights.
VoteSocialist
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VoteSocialist
950 posts
Nomad

*** forgot all the quotes!!***

So.. you didn't read it. Okay, here are the bits you needed to pay attention to:
That's one of the reasons why there are decibel limits to how loud you can be doing something, even on private property because the sound becomes public.
That was me saying you're not allowed to play heavy metal as loud as you want in your own backyard.
You can, however record a heavy metal album and release it on the internet, or on CD for people to listen to it if they *choose*
That was me saying that you can cut records in a studio and sell them or distribute them as you please so that people can freely buy/pick it up and listen to it. You'll note I don't mention a 'backyard' in that sentence.


So there ARE limits to how you can say something in capitalism? Gee, a more regulated media was just rationalized in a flash!
VoteSocialist
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VoteSocialist
950 posts
Nomad

And what about a person's rights under a capitalist society to amass a significant amount of wealth? Under socialism, their rights are being taken away. In their case, you could easily argue that socialism is more restrictive, and capitalism offers them more rights.


That's because if they get wealthy and powerful they end up restricting the rights of even more people. It's just wrong. Why should my rights be crushed for some butthole who got rich? He has more money than me, does that really make him better than everyone else? I think not!
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

That's because if they get wealthy and powerful they end up restricting the rights of even more people.

Provide proof, with examples please.

He has more money than me, does that really make him better than everyone else? I think not!


Better at making money, for sure.

So there ARE limits to how you can say something in capitalism? Gee, a more regulated media was just rationalized in a flash!


Dude.. there's limits to everything under a government. By your logic, we should throw socialism & capitalism out the window because anarchy offers people more rights.

With any government that has *laws* you have restrictions. You can't blame that on capitalism. Also... why have your previously decent arguments devolved into this? You seem to be disintegrating rapidly. Either post something intelligent or lose with some dignity dude.
VoteSocialist
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VoteSocialist
950 posts
Nomad

Either post something intelligent or lose with some dignity dude.


See what I mean? Did you really need to post that? I think you're taking this too far. If my posts are so bad then just don't respond anymore because as far as your concerned they're just spam.
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

See what I mean? Did you really need to post that?


I don't see what you mean.

Did I need to? I don't *need* to visit this site at all. Did I want to? Yes. Your more frequent posts in this thread have fallen off in terms of quality. It used to be a good debate, but it feels as though you don't have anything else to bring to the table, and instead of providing an interesting argument you're just throwing out any comment you possibly can to try and keep your head above water - so to speak. So.. I was encouraging you to either admit defeat, or come back with something good.

Really, I was hoping you would rally; I was enjoying the discussion. I guess not.
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

I also wanted to say - I find it amusing that you take objection to my post, and yet in the Socialism Vs. Capitalism thread you're complaining about *other* people being too sensitive. *rolls eyes*

VoteSocialist
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VoteSocialist
950 posts
Nomad

Really, I was hoping you would rally; I was enjoying the discussion. I guess not.


No, you just argue for personal gain.
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

No, you just argue for personal gain.


So I should be arguing from a sense of self-sacrifice? Why does anyone argue about anything?
VoteSocialist
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VoteSocialist
950 posts
Nomad

Debating just out of spite and to make yourself feel better isn't the way.

HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

Debating just out of spite and to make yourself feel better isn't the way.


Right... I get a huge ego boost from debating on an internet forum.

I'm not doing this out of spite. If you think I am, that's your mistake.
thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,824 posts
Shepherd

*looks in thread*

*is surprised at the OP*

*checks post-date*

*facepalms at debate*

. . . . . . .

I debate because it's an intellectual exercise, and I can't get a sufficient challenge from the other kids at my school.

Arguing out of spite just. . .doesn't happen.

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