Debate_Morality2
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View all comments »bbyers9113 says:
Posted at 7:31pm on 5/12/2008
First of all only a "%5" increase in violent crime is remarkable considering the hugely increasing world population plus the advancement of technology. Secondly, of course you are going to find counterexamples to any statement I make. Of course not all criminals eligible for capital punishment are not horrible people, but the vast majority of them are. Pointing out a scant few that are not surely is not a sturdy argument. Who is getting paid, you ask. The community is getting paid with capital punishment as well as with community service. The people that have done these atrocious acts are removed from the community making it a safer place. It is not safe to put those people to work back in the community. It is impossible to have constant supervision on these people. Plus, a large amount of community service is done with person to person contact. I would not want a serial killer working a soup kitchen. The reason we kill through capital punishment, is to exemplify that punishment will be received for crimes of this degree and to make room for criminals of more minor offenses.
Lastly, you point out minor flaws such as my word choice and throw meaningless statistics around without actually discrediting the core argument. You even go so far as to partially agree to my original statement when you state "'I believe capital punishment is humane in the most extreme cases.'
Humane? Maybe. The most economical and efficient decision? No."
The argument here was only over the humanity of capital punishment, not its economic value nor its efficiency. If you are going to debate against an issue, then actually debate against the issue itself instead of using circumlocution without a firm argument.
ubertuna says:
Posted at 7:50pm on 5/11/2008
I see a number of flaws in that argument, let me address them one by one.
"This will then encourage the most deranged of our society into committing similar crimes with less hesitation."
So, we're making examples out of people in hopes that it will dissuade others from making the same mistakes? No offense, but it doesn't seem to be doing us any good. Over the past few years, violent crime has increased by about %5.
"they are horrible people"
Not necessarily. Sure they have done wrong, but does that make them "horrible"? There are many people that have done far worse things than criminals that mot people do not see as horrible. I'd like to go into that further, but it strays into the realm o politics, which is irrelevant to our current discussion.
"Community service simply is not enough to pay for the horrible crimes they have committed."
You say "pay," but who is getting paid? No good comes from killing somebody, while a great deal of good comes from putting those people to work.
"We kill for a legitimate reason, they kill for no reason whatsoever"
First of all, what is that reason? Second, how do you know that they kill for no reason? There is always a reason, it could be love, hate, greed, fear, or jealousy. There are many, many reasons. Criminals may not be justified in doing what they do, but they have reasons.
"An eye for an eye system would be killing everyone who does anything wrong."
No, that would be the crazy psycho tyranic dictator government. An eye for an eye is killing somebody that kills, or fining somebody that steals. I am not against the latter example, but killing somebody serves no purpose. It's wasteful, you are eliminating the potential for labor.
"I believe capital punishment is humane in the most extreme cases."
Humane? Maybe. The most economical and efficient decision? No.
bbyers9113 says:
Posted at 11:42pm on 5/9/2008
Having someone spend time doing community service is not an appropriate punishment for criminals in the most extreme cases. The purpose of any sentence whether it be community service or a life sentence is to show the person and other people that what they did is wrong. If you take and sentence them to community service other people will see that they are not being punished for their crimes. This will then encourage the most deranged of our society into committing similar crimes with less hesitation. Yes, these criminals are still people, but you have to remember that they are horrible people. I would not want someone like that loose in my community whether or not they are doing community service. I want to feel safe. Also, surely the friends and relatives of the victims want to see some justice. Community service simply is not enough to pay for the horrible crimes they have committed.
And we are better than they are when using capital punishment. We kill for a legitimate reason, they kill for no reason whatsoever hence why it is against the law. Ours is justified, while theirs is simply wrong. And this is also not an "eye for an eye" system that you speak of. An eye for an eye system would be killing everyone who does anything wrong. As the original argument stated, I believe capital punishment is humane in the most extreme cases.
ubertuna says:
Posted at 2:56pm on 5/8/2008
It is not our place to take away human life. If we decide to play god and put criminals to death, we are no better than they are. They kill, and we kill. It is this "eye for an eye" system of justice to which I am highly opposed. The way that you talk about these people makes them seem like objects, things that can be done away with just to create more room for other objects. These objects are people. People that have done many bad things, but people all the same. These people, instead of being imprisoned in a ell for their life, or put to death, could be used to better the community and make up for what they have done. Many criminals guilty of lesser crimes have been sentenced to complete a number of community service hours, I do not see why criminals of more serious crimes could improve the community in the same way.
bbyers9113 says:
Posted at 7:55pm on 5/5/2008
The original argument was that "capital punishment is a humane way to deal with criminals in extreme cases." This is true because obviously, these criminals would not be released. They would either be given the death penalty or given a life sentence. With the overpopulation of the country, prisons and penitentiaries are overcrowded as well. Simple logic leads one to this assumption, with more people, come more criminals. The amount of overcrowding has even led some states to exporting criminals to other jailing facilities. (http://www.newser.com/story/5024.html)
By using capital punishment, the worst of the criminals can be eliminated thus opening room for less serious offenders. Some argue that it is inhumane, but it is a lesser of two evils. When faced with the choice between releasing less serious offenders, like those in sexual offensive cases, and taking up that valuable room with people like serial killers. This alone should explain the necessity of capital punishment.