"I've tried in the past to do my best to detach myself and argue for religion from an outside perspective, but obviously that is difficult and I'm not that good at it, so I apologize to you and any others if I offended anybody."

I get the impression we stand a far better chance of seeming offensive than you to us.

Anyway just a suggestion you might want to try some time. Try playing devils advocate and arguing for the atheist side for a while. It could give you a different perspective on things.

I've had this idea in the back of my mind for a while for a thread where the theists have to argue the atheist side and the atheists have to argue the theists side. Unfortunately I don't see how that could be pulled off without it just turning into poor caricatures of each position. Though on an individual basis I've seen it work.

Well if you have a Force vs. Time graph how would you find work?

Another benefit of the internet, at the very worse people only leave in a huff. In real life you risk either side getting mad enough to start a fight.

"Atheists don't despise religion, we just want proof. We hate faith, not religion. It just happens to be that one cannot exist without the other, but I digress."

^Just going to say this is a general thing. There are some who do. Atheism is really only defined by the lack of a belief in a god, anything more than that is individual.

I've heard about how the mission changes people. From my experience, living in a different country (or state if you've only lived in one place all your life) itself can also do that. Why do you think rich people travel the world? Believe it or not, I've been all over SE Asia, and lived in Korea for 5 1/2 years. I learned a lot about culture and custom there, and these experiences have made me a better man for it.

Satan losing his sanity may be possible, but he certainly seems clear as a bell when he tries to tempt eve. I don't really think sanity is the matter to discuss, but maybe what he gets out of this might be a better angle to approach it at. As far as I can tell, all he gets is about a few billion souls tops, but that clearly isn't enough reason to go after this wild run in the spotlight. Obviously, there is a key piece missing here that nobody in Christianity seems to be able to divine. It isn't vengeance because he will still lose, pettiness is viable but it makes the entire concept silly, and rebellion for rebellion's sake is pointless.

I'm glad to see you acknowledging that point is moot. Apparently, he is perfect, but he has laws he must follow that he can easily change at any time. It's like saying, "I'd love to help, but I cannot break my rules, even though I can." That is the essence of this argument, how can god be god if he has constraints?

Atheists don't despise religion, we just want proof. We hate faith, not religion. It just happens to be that one cannot exist without the other, but I digress.

This talk of a lack of biblical knowledge brings me back to my first religious debate. I distinctly remember it because at the very end, after countering all of his points (he was better versed than most, and pioneered a Christian in touch group that meets every Friday at a grocery store across from the school we go to. He was a tough nut to crack), he said, "if that's the case, just kill me now. If you're right, then I have nothing to live for." After that day, I've treated him more as a friend than a rival, and now he is more mellow because of it. Fun fact: we did this debate in my school auditorium while watching transformers 2.

But they still had the curse, which is the heart of the problem here. Sure, their lives aren't what you would consider terrible, but they were still cursed. Still spurned by their cousins because of what their ancestors did. Over time, wars were started just because of what seems like divine pettiness.

I still plan on going to the event because it's a rare opportunity ( I love analyzing rhetorical styles) to hear someone speak in a way that can sway millions of people in person. However, I plan to also use my bishop's dealings behind my back against him, and finally break this attack on my core beliefs (or lack thereof).

Trust me, it took a lot of work to get myself to be able to think in this way. True, you have to be good at multitasking naturally, but it takes a lot extra to be able to apply it to thought.

(If you were trying to reconvert me, I would know, and we wouldn't be sharing these tangents with eachother. I'm not trying to deconvert you, but I am testing your mettle) I can understand how you feel. Before I hit 16, the church made me feel whole, as if I could always rely upon god. That did change overtime, but I'll never forget how I felt back then, and how I could always rely on the people around me. I'm pretty sure I couldn't have survived middle school without that, but unfortunately it wasn't cut out for high school.

It isn't always the feeling the church gives you that keeps you in. Sometimes, it may involve tradition, and how you might just be in it because your parents were. Sometimes, the believers are so rooted into the faith that their minds will actually reject anything that could shake their faith. This has happened in almost every religion, and it is why Catholicism will always be able to recover from an altar-boy scandal.

Thinking about it, when you go on your mission, you won't be able to contact me anymore. That actually makes me kinda sad. Who knows, I might just decide to give you my mailing address so that we could continue this even after you leave. I don't know how long we'll be doing this, so ill hold off until the mission plans have been finalized.

-Blade

Do you use  dy/dx? Do you go from acceleration to velocity using integration?