I should've worded that part differently, sorry. What I meant is that the suggestion that it is not fair for the poor to be receiving the same protection and services despite paying for less of them is preposterous. Also, it makes sense that the poor would be paying less, because living isn't free, a good deal of them couldn't afford it, and I think food is more important than paying for services like armed forces protection.
Just because it is capitalist doesn't mean the system shouldn't try to balance between the rich and the poor. Why do you think a system of progressive taxation has been in place for years? Welfare is nescessary. Obama is not socialist nor are his policies, and saying so demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of the ideology.
President Obama's social reforms are exactly that socialist, and are corrupting the American Dream
The American Dream is exactly that-a Dream. My dad came from an immigrant family who owned and operated a run-down bar. He enrolled in the University of Washington, ranked the 14th top university in the world, and earned his B.S. From there, he enrolled in the University of Connecticut, another world-class university, where he earned his Master's Degree and PhD. He became a tenured professor and a leading researcher in his field. Currently, he supervises a marine laboratory which is run by the Department of Energy.
Compare this to the life of Rush Limbaugh, who was born into an American, white, middle-class family, scraped through high school, and was kicked out of college for slacking off. He came upon his current position with minimal promotion and effort. The man who talks so fondly of the American dream makes $32 million a year. My dad, who quite literally worked his way up from the bottom, works 50 hours a week and earns .02% of Rush's salary.
Just because it is capitalist doesn't mean the system shouldn't try to balance between the rich and the poor.
Yes it does. Let me rephrase some of your points so you can see what you've said in a different context. Lets call your rich the "bourgeois" and the poor the "roletariat." So your saying that Barrack Obama needs to take the money from the bourgeois and redistribute it to the proletariat so that there can be
balance between the rich and the poor.
In fact somebody did such a thing back in 1917! He was called Vladimir Lenin and he overthrew his country's ruling class in something called the "Red Revolution" and founded a great nation which was formerly called the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. (Please get the sarcasm.) I think we know how that turned out, and I'd rather not see it happen again in the USA.
To: thisisnotanalt
Once again, improve your reading comprehension. I'm saying that its not fair that the government is charging people different amounts for equal benefits and protection. There, I cut out all of the big words this time, so maybe you'll finally get what i'm trying to say. Read it over twice to fully grasp what i'm saying before posting another response to an argument I didn't even make.
Yes it does. Let me rephrase some of your points so you can see what you've said in a different context. Lets call your rich the "bourgeois" and the poor the "roletariat." So your saying that Barrack Obama needs to take the money from the bourgeois and redistribute it to the proletariat so that there can be
One of the key reasons there has been no severeclass conflict in the West is because of reforms such as these welfare chemes. So ironically, even though you seem to dislike welfare schemes and government intervention, that is the a key factor in the survival of capitalism.
One of the key reasons there has been no severeclass conflict in the West is because of reforms such as these welfare chemes.
I'd like to offer a differing opinion. The key reason as to why there has been little class warfare in America especially has been the ease of social mobility. People knew that with a little luck and hard work, the sky was the limit. Therefore a messy revolution would be unlikely to garner support because people believed in the American dream. There ARE no distinct social classes in America. People are free to move in and out of perceived social classes at will. The American Dream itself has been the reason that there has been no class conflict. And I think I've already made myself clear as to what President Obama's social policies passed off as a stimulus package are doing to that...
Yes, those are the "erceived" classes that I was talking about. There is nothing stopping anybody from moving in between them, so they are not really social classes in the classical sense like formerly India's were.
I'd like to offer a differing opinion. The key reason as to why there has been little class warfare in America especially has been the ease of social mobility.
Are you not aware of the situation which sparked the October Revolution? People were poor. Dirt poor. They saw the wealth which the Tsar had, and wanted it. Thus the revolution. Welfare keeps people from getting to that state, and in desperate times such as the present, the poor are getting poorer and need the extra boost.
Yes, those are the "erceived" classes that I was talking about. There is nothing stopping anybody from moving in between them, so they are not really social classes in the classical sense like formerly India's were.
Percieved? They look real enough to me. You say there's nothing stopping people from moving between classes and tax brackets, but you obviously don't get how the real world works. Sure, in an ideal capitalistic society you can do whatever you want and still earn money.
But here in real life, you're limited by your education, your ability to interview, the area in which you live. All of these are factors that tie into how much money you make. For the average American, once you find a career, you're stuck there. There's no going back to school-there's working and taking care of a family.
Exactly how many self-made millionaires do you know again?
Yes, those are the "erceived" classes that I was talking about. There is nothing stopping anybody from moving in between them, so they are not really social classes in the classical sense like formerly India's were.
i agree with what zootsuit said to that. and the average person cannot move so easily from one class to another. it takes hard work and determination to move up..and to move down...well u must be a complete moron and no idea what ur doing with ur parents money...
Exactly what I said. Why is it my fault some people don't want to put in the hard work and determination.
well u must be a complete moron and no idea what ur doing with ur parents money...
I'll admit that my parents paid for my bachelor's degree, but I took out loans to get my M.E. (Nearly done paying them back!) And since I moved out of my parent's house I've been basically self sufficient (my parents co-signed on my apartment, but I pay the rent.) So exactly why am I being punished for working my butt off to get a Masters of Engineering, find a good job and make the money I feel that my hard work entitled me too?
But here in real life, you're limited by your education, your ability to interview, the area in which you live. All of these are factors that tie into how much money you make.
Education is a personal choice. I CHOSE to go to graduate school to make more money. Your ability to interview? Are you serious? Take any entry level business class and they'll teach you how to do it. Area in which you live? There are plenty of decently paying jobs available all over the country. All I see are excuses from people who made bad decisions and then expect myself, who didn't make aforementioned bad decisions to pay for them. And I do actually know a self made millionaire, I work for him. I'm not saying that in an ideal capitalist society that you can do whatever you want and make money. I'm saying that the capitalist system is based on free market trade of goods, and that also means skills. My skills are valuable, therefore companies will pay me what their worth. Why is it my fault that I'm more desirable to a potential employer than a man who is simply qualified to flip burgers? Just to let you guys know, I don't make a million dollars a year, I make around $80,000... I'm taking this rather personally because tax day is coming up and I'm getting slightly pissed about how much I'm having to pay...
Education is a personal choice. I CHOSE to go to graduate school to make more money.
I know SO many people in my class that aren't going to go beyond earning an AA because they can't afford college, or don't meet the standards for the FAFSA. THIS is where those tax dollars of yours are going towards; making college cheaper at state universities so that the kids who normally wouldn't have an opportunity to make more money.
And don't give me crap like "They can earn scholarships if they tried harder." I'm ranked 30th in a class of 270 people with a 3.93. Add the fact that I'm white, in the wrong tax bracket, and that it's impossible to stand out in my class whatsoever, I'm shot for scholarships or federal aid.
The government is simply an enabler, and if anything is to be done to make the country safer, better educated, and more prosperous, the government has to help it's people before the people can start giving back.
Area in which you live? There are plenty of decently paying jobs available all over the country.
You live around Detroit? Close to a 20% unemployment rate; people can't apply for other jobs because there simply aren't any more in the area, and they don't have the money to move due to being fired or laid off. Recently in Florida, an estimated 450 people applied for 15 Fire fighter jobs. They could of course apply for the cheaper, menial jobs that pay $10 an hour, but that's not realistic either, due to the huge change in lifestyle that would be required.
It is also extremely likely that they will be turned down for being "overqualified".
And don't give me crap like "They can earn scholarships if they tried harder." I'm ranked 30th in a class of 270 people with a 3.93. Add the fact that I'm white, in the wrong tax bracket, and that it's impossible to stand out in my class whatsoever, I'm shot for scholarships or federal aid.
Its called loans buddy, its not terribly hard to apply for student loans, and the best part is, they don't even expect you to have decent credit to get them! And come on dude, 30th out of 270 isn't that impressive, you're not even in the top 10%. So why should MY tax dollars go to help pay for OTHER people's schooling? Are they going to pay me back somehow? No. You're robbing me and then saying that its alright because your using my money for a good cause. I still miss MY hard earned money. I'm fine with paying for services like the police and schools, but to say that your going to take my money and then give it to somebody else just because they make less is preposterous. From your statements, it seems as if you're still in high school, so i'll forgive your naivety, but when you do get out of college, (you said your parents were in the wrong tax bracket so I'm assuming they'll at least help you pay for some of it), you'll start making some money. And then the government is gonna take that money and give it to people who didn't go to school. And you will be pissed, and you'll think exactly what I'm thinking now... just give it about 6 more years. Government shouldn't be in the business of charity... that's charities' job.
And come on dude, 30th out of 270 isn't that impressive, you're not even in the top 10%.
I have a 3.93 GPA. 24 people in front of me have 4.0's. I participate in Honor Society, sports, community service, and all that jazz. I've taken Honors courses throughout all of high school, and should have a higher GPA, but I transferred in from the 7th worst high school in the nation my sophomore and had to overcome a HUGE learning curve just to maintain what could be called a suitable GPA.
From your statements, it seems as if you're still in high school, so i'll forgive your naivety, but when you do get out of college, (you said your parents were in the wrong tax bracket so I'm assuming they'll at least help you pay for some of it), you'll start making some money.
I have a job; I have for the past two years. I only work weekends during the school year due to my busy workload, but I still earn $5,000 a year, and out of my paychecks, most of it goes towards social security and Medicare that I probably won't receive in my lifetime. I understand your frustration, but you need to man up. Seriously.
Government shouldn't be in the business of charity... that's charities' job.
Give me a charity that will fund millions of children's college educations, that people will be willing to donate to on a regular basis, and I won't expect the government to help it's people with school anymore.
Its called loans buddy, its not terribly hard to apply for student loans, and the best part is, they don't even expect you to have decent credit to get them!
Have you lived under a rock since September? It's impossible to get loans, whether they're for school, houses, or a car. Over ten states have canceled their student loan programs, and others are increasing the interest rates on the loans by roughly 14% each year.
