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AnaLoGMunKy
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AnaLoGMunKy
1,573 posts
Blacksmith

Just read an article that states

[url=http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/p2p_not_to_blame_for_content_industry_failures_says_eu.php/url]

Im all for free P2P sharing to a point. If a new filmaker comes along with his product, he should be able to make a living from it if people want to see it and deem it worthy of attention. I do not, however, endorse giving george lucas and co my hard earned money for an average piece o crud like Indy and the kingdom of the crystal pile of poo. Sure the special effects were shiney... but FX does not make a good movie.

At every turn we are threatened with the law, warned of viruses (when its the film companies etc that actually release the fakes onto torrent sites) and guilt tripped about the destruction of the industry.

Im worried about our diminishing rights, internet nutrality, restricted content and the lies that get spewed about internet speeds, with which we are all being conned by the communications industry on.

One example of the way we are mislead about DL speeds is this:

Im on a 10Mb connection... and I get a usual 100KB a sec DL speed, or about 250-500KBsec if its a good night. The Highest Iv ever had is 1.1MB a sec... and this was only once... so really Im paying every month for a service I got on ONE particular DL. Not even for a day. It was a 150 meg file for 3 mins... £26 a month for 3 mins of 10Mb service???

Does anyone else see this as misleading or are you happy to be told you pay for a higher speed than you actually get becausebservers, other people, not being close to the exchange etc. slows your connection.

So overall what are your views on P2P sharing, and the restriction of content on the internet?

  • 57 Replies
Spyton
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Spyton
63 posts
Nomad

I dont like Piracy, unless it includes boats... But i do think that P2P is great. It lets you find stuff that otherwise would be impossible to find.

I redownloaded warcraft 3 as I bought it before but lost the disk and it tells me I have to have a disk to play it. I burned an ISO but it still didn't work so I have to try a different site.


If you have the CD-Key Blizzard has a program that will allow you to redownload the game legally. You just gotta make an account on their new Battle.net setup, input CD-Key, and then redownload it.
balerion07
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balerion07
2,837 posts
Peasant

That is convenient. And think I still have the CD key that my failed dl came with.

AnaLoGMunKy
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AnaLoGMunKy
1,573 posts
Blacksmith

You can watch most movies and television today online without pirating.


But whats the difference. So its OK to stream something, because the goverment says its legal, but its not ok to DL something for purly personal use. Not getting directly at you because you are right, but its like a frikkin Bi-polar nature of people against P2P.

They say the same stuff, its illegal, its theft, its destroying industry, its taking jobs, its denying money to small producers/actors who deserve the money etc...

None of this is true.

The only suggestion I would have in this scenario is to be more discerning on what you decide to spend your money on. Pay attention to what directors or what studios, or companies put out high quality products & which ones don't, and then don't buy anything from the companies that put out crap.


I do... but why is there a multi billion pound business that is conning people out of hard earned cash to watch brainless movies. Most people are actually too stupid or scared to go agaist the flow. Its amazing what happens when 10 of your friends see a movie and all say it was great, and you sit there thinking "that was guff"... but most people wouldnt SAY it. They sit there and smile and say "yeah it was ok"... swimming against the crowd is only easy for some.

District 9... amazing. Im going to buy the DVD, but I am happy, now that Iv seen a DVD rip, to wait till its out and down in price. But this is not normal practice for the herd... buy it now, buy MW2 NOOOW whilst all your friends play... buy Left for Dead 2 NOWWW or you will miss out... Go see this movie NOOOOWWW or you wont have stuff to talk about with your friends and will seem like a social leper... Dont take my word for it... just watch people and you will see. Keep what Iv said in the back of your head, and you will see the pattern. From game to book to movie... and im sure it is in fashion and makeup products and food. Buy our Popular crap... be with your friends... look like a frikkin GAP advert, all smiles and thet feelgood feeling... you too can have this etc...

P2P is not piracy... its a scream for independance from a commercialized way of life. When they start feeding the world and taking care of people... I will start thinking about paying these multibillionair industrys money they "deserve"

*rant snort rumba snort rip*
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

They say the same stuff, its illegal, its theft, its destroying industry, its taking jobs, its denying money to small producers/actors who deserve the money etc...
None of this is true.


None of it is true? Well, it is definitely illegal.. how did you come to the conclusion that it's not doing any of these things?

I do... but why is there a multi billion pound business that is conning people out of hard earned cash to watch brainless movies. Most people are actually too stupid or scared to go agaist the flow. Its amazing what happens when 10 of your friends see a movie and all say it was great, and you sit there thinking "that was guff"... but most people wouldnt SAY it. They sit there and smile and say "yeah it was ok"... swimming against the crowd is only easy for some.


Maybe they deserve to be conned? I see people fall hook, line & sinker for holistic and homeopathic medicine crap all the time. If I go to see a movie that a friend recommended and it sucks, I don't follow that person's advice on movies from that point on. And as for standing up and stating your own opinion about something or 'swimming against the crowd' as you put it - these things might have to do with whether or not you want to risk being a social pariah, but they have nothing to do with whether or not piracy should be legal.

and im sure it is in fashion and makeup products and food. Buy our Popular crap... be with your friends... look like a frikkin GAP advert, all smiles and thet feelgood feeling... you too can have this etc...


And in none of the other circumstances is the intellectual property capable of being 'copied' in the same manner. So, are you saying that we should all get make-up, gap clothing and the rest of that junk for free too?
balerion07
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balerion07
2,837 posts
Peasant

I walked out of District 9 and went into a different theater instead. I bought a ticket and deserved a movie but I doubt that the theater would have seen it that way.

AnaLoGMunKy
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AnaLoGMunKy
1,573 posts
Blacksmith

None of it is true? Well, it is definitely illegal.. how did you come to the conclusion that it's not doing any of these things?


Illegal doesnt mean bad. It doesnt mean wrong. It doesnt mean detrimental.

Maybe they deserve to be conned?


Sure... thats a real good way to carry the human race. Fuck my neighbour I dont care because hes think as pigshit hair. Real clever. Just be wary, those who go down have a real dragging habit, and a iron grip. Remember that when you see fellow earthlings suffer.

And in none of the other circumstances is the intellectual property capable of being 'copied' in the same manner.


Its hard to get away from the constant advertising that we are seduced with. Is it really ok when people who could have potential care more about sticking up for the wealthy and powerful. Are you really prepared to sit back and say "skrew him, he was stupid"... Im starting to think "skrew that" we were tricked, goaded, lied to, convinced, manipulated and hearded into this numb brained state. Im not gonna sit back whilst people around me flounder. So you expect me to care about £6 from george lucas and co.

And as for getting the free makeup and gap clothes... like I said, I accept paying for useless crap when the world is fed and clothed. Theres enuf, without a penny to spare. Or do you disagree? lets feed these fukkin stick insects and clothes designers and hollywood stars who ONLY make the money they do because of us!!!! If we didnt give them this undeserved cash they wouldnt get the publicity and profit that just amplifies their earnings tenfold.
numbauno
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numbauno
21 posts
Nomad

I'll admit to using cracked software and music and having programs like limewire and frostwire. Half the cops wouldn't care about it either. So someone earning several million dollars a year misses out on 99c cuz i didnt buy their song? big deal.

Snakebite
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Snakebite
996 posts
Nomad

Just think about it though, if it was just you, then no, there wouldn't be a problem. But it's not. It's millions of people, millions of dollars lost because of pirating site. I know most cops don't care... But see, it's not the cops who are going after pirate sites, it's the FBI. Which could also spell out an automatic felony for being involved.

Graham
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Graham
8,051 posts
Nomad

i wonder if there is any way to prevent a cd/dvd to be burned onto a computer...

and don't you just need a 128-bit encryption to make you anonymous to any trackers?

HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

Illegal doesnt mean bad. It doesnt mean wrong. It doesnt mean detrimental.


No, it doesn't. However gaining something of value that someone else worked hard on, for nothing, is wrong - and also a detriment to the people who made it.

Sure... thats a real good way to carry the human race.


Remember that when you see fellow earthlings suffer.


So when some fool decides to pick up an album made by a crap band, or go see a terrible movie, or watch the worst television shows on TV which they pay good money for; that somehow translates to how I decide to live my life? I missed the memo indicating I'm personally responsible for complete idiots.

Its hard to get away from the constant advertising that we are seduced with.


No it isn't. I don't think I've been 'seduced' by a single piece of marketing in my entire teenage/adult life.

Is it really ok when people who could have potential care more about sticking up for the wealthy and powerful.


Adults make their own decisions and are responsible for their own well-being. I don't see the need to have to lead them around like lambs - if that's how they want to let themselves be treated, that's their decision. By the way, what on Earth does this have to do with piracy? You seem to want to get up on a soap box to rant about the state of the world, but none of it has to do with P2P file sharing.

Are you really prepared to sit back and say "skrew him, he was stupid"


It doesn't require much 'reparation' at all - and yes.

Im not gonna sit back whilst people around me flounder.


Again, this has nothing to do with P2P file sharing.

I accept paying for useless crap when the world is fed and clothed.


You do... *know* why things cost money... right?

lets feed these fukkin stick insects and clothes designers and hollywood stars who ONLY make the money they do because of us!!!! If we didnt give them this undeserved cash they wouldnt get the publicity and profit that just amplifies their earnings tenfold.


How is the cash undeserved? They're making products that people apparently want and that drives the value for the product - what people will pay for a certain item. Clothes, food, sports events, movies, music - I work at a company that makes video games - I don't make the games themselves; I'm part of one of the support teams. I'm in a position where if you don't want to buy the companies 'useless crap', something which I put a lot of effort into helping the team get through pre-pro, alpha, beta, gold, ship & post-pro - you're telling me that my time means absolutely nothing, and that you'd rather play the game for nothing, because that's exactly what you think of me, and everyone else on the development team.

Does the company at large make a lot of profit? Of course they do; it's kind of the point of going into buisness. A lot of the employees wind up owning stock & a share in the company though, so we want it to succeed as a whole.

If you're pissed off because some people are good at making money... get used to it. You need to find something of interest to occupy your time other then complaining that rich people are rich. P2P file sharing isn't going to somehow create an equilibrium where everybody has the same amount of money: they're still going to be rich as all Hell, and poor people without the money to buy every single album from HMV or go to every crap movie that gets released in theater are still going to have two sticks to rub together.
Darkroot
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Darkroot
2,763 posts
Peasant

The artists deserve any money they get for the film but they are not the problem it's the people leaching from them, the publishers. They don't do anything and make a lot of money. The only reason why p2p exist is because the overall problem of the economic structure of the businesses.

Does the company at large make a lot of profit? Of course they do; it's kind of the point of going into business. A lot of the employees wind up owning stock & a share in the company though, so we want it to succeed as a whole.


I agree people should make a profit for what they make. But not the extreme profits that some companies make now. Look at EA that huge monster is making so much money publishing games it has the ability to buy out other smaller companies and lay people off. Only people who truly did something should get money.

P2P file sharing isn't going to somehow create an equilibrium where everybody has the same amount of money: they're still going to be rich as all Hell, and poor people without the money to buy every single album from HMV or go to every crap movie that gets released in theatre are still going to have two sticks to rub together.


Yes but people with little money can't take risks buying things they don't know about since demo have practically ceased to exist the only way to really test out a game is to torrent it. Also you have absolutely no concept of how much money poor people have most of the people wouldn't even be able to go to movies that they have really wanted to for a long time. People don't download garbage. I bet you buy crap and don't even think about how lucky you are to be able to buy it. Don't talk about something you obviously don't understand.
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

Only people who truly did something should get money.


Everyone 'does' something. I mean, if I work technical support for the people who develop the games - should I not get paid? They don't have time to fix their computers when they break, or fix problems with the network, the telecommunications systems, setup new user accounts, manage the domain, order new machines and handle the asset management - they're too damn busy making the actual games.

That's why I have a job. On the development team you also have development directors who facilitate and manage the team's personelle and resources, budgets - producers who work on game feel. You have CEOs that manage all of the production teams & decide on buisness direction for the whole company.

Can I do that? Can one of the developers who is more familiar with C++ then speaking to people do that? I don't have the formal or informal education or experience for such a job... somebody has to do it - but they're technically not making the actual product. So... should they not get paid?

I bet you buy crap and don't even think about how lucky you are to be able to buy it. Don't talk about something you obviously don't understand.


Maybe you shouldn't give advice to people you know very little about and obviously don't understand. I rarely buy anything; when I do, it's carefully thought out. I don't buy any video game at the drop of a hat, and I don't frequent the movie theaters - even to see movies that I think I'll enjoy. There's a lot of music that I could buy, or maybe want to buy, but I don't. It's called fiscal responsibility. Living within your means. If someone can't take the 'risk' to buy a video game, maybe they shouldn't be dumping money on expensive entertainment outlets and worrying more about getting by. There are a lot of fun activities available that don't cost very much.
AnaLoGMunKy
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AnaLoGMunKy
1,573 posts
Blacksmith

It doesn't require much 'reparation' at all - and yes.


This is in a large way, the problem with much of the world. And of course it has to do with P2P, this is file sharing and freedom of information. And your damn right im going on a rant, because the only thing you can do is defend these multi million dollar businesses. Someone needs to rant, for YOUR sake.

You do... *know* why things cost money... right?


Why does food and clothing cost money, we have more than enuf to go round. Maybe you should consider the position that most of the world is in. They are far too poor to even own a computer and dont get internet access. If the world was connected for free then there would be much that we all learn. And still this is related to P2P. Do you uinderstand what ISP's and Corperations are trying to do to the internet. Please look on the issue of net nutrallity if you dont.

Basicly you are asking me to care about these multi million pound businesses, and yet on the other hand, you say skrew other people. At least my rant is heartfelt and means something. I feel like you are being the devils advocate.

(Its hard to get away from the constant advertising that we are seduced with.)

No it isn't. I don't think I've been 'seduced' by a single piece of marketing in my entire teenage/adult life.


That, sir... is an outright lie. There is not one person, no matter how pure of thought or steadyness of direction, that can avoid the constant barrage of advertising, its also subliminal!. You cant escape, even when you turn of that tv is pumping messages into your brain.

If you're pissed off because some people are good at making money... get used to it.


Im pissed off because there are a few who have the most, and you should be pissed off too. Your really going for the personal stuff here, dont judge my position on this without some form of quote to back it up. You wont like it if I return the favour so follow this advice

Maybe you shouldn't give advice to people you know very little about and obviously don't understand.


Dont try to suss me mate, this is a debate, not a personal slagging match.
HiddenDistance
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HiddenDistance
1,310 posts
Peasant

of course it has to do with P2P, this is file sharing and freedom of information.


Information that's not meant to be freely shared. Read up on intellectual property rights.

Why does food and clothing cost money, we have more than enuf to go round.


You really don't know? Because people's time costs money. So... should farmers not get paid because there's enough to go around? A farmer should just spend their entire life slaving away on a farm and *not* get paid for it? What about the people that manage the distribution, or stock the shelves at a supermarket - I suppose they shouldn't be paid either for their time? Your understanding of how society works and the economy is embarassing. No wonder you're deluded about this P2P stuff.

Basicly you are asking me to care about these multi million pound businesses, and yet on the other hand, you say skrew other people. At least my rant is heartfelt and means something. I feel like you are being the devils advocate.


I'm not asking you to care about them; but they're entitled to the money they're earning. As for saying 'screw' the other people, if they want to make a decision to buy a piece of crap and waste their money, it's not my responsibility - it's theirs, it's yours, it's all of ours. Ever hear the phrase "buyer beware"? That's exactly what this equates to - only with digital information, it's much easier (and somehow therefore okay) to obtain illegally then it is pairs of jeans, cars, or computer hardware. I'm really not playing devils advocate. Should we make gambling illegal too because some people spend more money then they should on it, or perhaps we should recognize that there's not anything intrinsically wrong with it and that a few stupid people abuse it and wind up getting into incredible debt? People are responsible for their own actions - no exceptions.

That, sir... is an outright lie. There is not one person, no matter how pure of thought or steadyness of direction, that can avoid the constant barrage of advertising, its also subliminal!. You cant escape, even when you turn of that tv is pumping messages into your brain.


Prove it.

Im pissed off because there are a few who have the most, and you should be pissed off too.


I rarely let other people tell me how I should feel about a certain issue. Maybe that's your problem.

Dont try to suss me mate, this is a debate, not a personal slagging match.


I was talking to Darkroot in that post, not you.
AnaLoGMunKy
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AnaLoGMunKy
1,573 posts
Blacksmith

You really don't know? Because people's time costs money


This is what Im talking about. You may have been talking to darkroot in the last post, but you still pull a snide tone when saying this stuff. Dont insult my intelligence because I believe in a different way of life from you. I certainly dont believe money is the be all and end all of life.

I rarely let other people tell me how I should feel about a certain issue. Maybe that's your problem.


Can you not see the problem with a few people earning all of the money. Can you really blame people when half the world has a terrible school system which is bias to their country and religion. Teach people to be thick and buy into a system. This is no conspiracy crap, its real. Using subliminal tricks and smells and pictures to get people to lead the lives they want. Is that choice?

it's not my responsibility - it's theirs, it's yours, it's all of ours.


And thats a contradiction.

And I once again repeat, as stated in the OP, P2P doesnt really affect buyer choice. People WILL and ARE buying regardless of P2P and piracy!
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