I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done. I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please
A flood that left no geological evidence what so ever
This is wrong, there is geological proof of floods in Mesopothamia and nearby regions, which were strong enough to literally wiple the land of humanity. Still, there's a word "oecumena" in the Bible's text describing the flood, which stands for "known world", which was way smaller back there.
I am assuming that Christianity is not automatically correct. Now to convince me to buy into it, you have to present valid evidence.
Please check Fatima's miracle, it's heavily documented and proven by 70000 eyewitnesses. Will this count as valid?
There are non religious aboriginals who hold a strictly naturalistic view of the world who got along fine without any religion with there own moral structure. (Sorry I can't think of the name of these people, if anyone knows please post.)
Cannibals? They didn't have religion and their moral stated that eating other tribes' members is good. Yes, they have their own moral strucure, which also stated that eating your own tribe's member is bad. This moral contradicts with current one.
Why is there so many contradictions in the bible then?
Because many Bible's stories, including whole of Genesis, originate from the time when there was no literacy available, so all of them were transferred by word, which is dependant on the memory capabilities of a certain individual, and humans can forget.
Lemme talk about matter and energy. Obviously you can't create it out of nothing. But if we can't create it, then we wouldn't be here. How did we go from nothing to something?
Lemme talk about matter and energy. Obviously you can't create it out of nothing. But if we can't create it, then we wouldn't be here. How did we go from nothing to something?
Because many Bible's stories, including whole of Genesis, originate from the time when there was no literacy available, so all of them were transferred by word, which is dependant on the memory capabilities of a certain individual, and humans can forget.
So there is stuff that is wrong in the bible? Since the connectedness of the bible relies on the human mind that doesn't bode well for a deity that wants his children to believe in him in a correct manner.
If you're looking for logical proof, look for it for yourself. Read Lee Strobel, listen to the Top 10 proof CD's. The universe is expanding, we can't deny that. But all scientists have done is extrapolate 15 billion years ago, and squeezed everything into a tiny dot. You're going from nothing to the entire universe. Explain that.
Lemme talk about matter and energy. Obviously you can't create it out of nothing. But if we can't create it, then we wouldn't be here. How did we go from nothing to something?
No, seen entropy is a finicky thing sometimes it looks like it's doing the exact opposite of it's definition but in reality it still doing exactly the thing it's supposed to do.
Scientifically, the universe HAS to have a beginning and an end, as explained by scientists. So there HAS to be a creator for there to be a creation.So it is a contradiction for there not to be God.
This argument directly implies that everything has a creator ( I quote "there HAS to be a creator for there to be a creation); if unquestionably and in every instance everything has an intelligent creator a question arises "Who created God?". Now, there are two paths to answer this question: 1- God was created, ergo he is a creation and not an omniscient originator. 2- God was not created, He was always there. However, if God existed in perpetuum your argument is erroneous, ergo there has NOT to be a creator for there to be a creation. If you choose answer 2 -immediately- opens another possibility, if God does not have a creator, likewise not everything has a creator and therefore some things do not have a creator, in all likelihood the Universe could belong in aforementioned category.
Anyway, the line of reasoning "there HAS to be a creator for there to be a creation" is a road that leads to nowhere, it does not prove in any way whatsoever that God created the Universe. Even if we suppose that the Universe was created by someone its impossible to -rationally- conclude that God created the Universe. The hypothesis simply states that the Universe was created by someone, it does not specify by whom. The designer could be God, Ra, Aliens, Bill Gates, a bear or The Big Whatever.
So there is stuff that is wrong in the bible? Since the connectedness of the bible relies on the human mind that doesn't bode well for a deity that wants his children to believe in him in a correct manner.
Actually, people memorized these stories to the dot until they tell them, because this is something so important. The first Generation would have told the second generation exactly how it happened, the second generation would have told the third generation, It was too important to just make mistakes
God was supposedly there since the start, he's supposed to be a ball of perfection so why the hell are his morals wrong?
He adapts the given moral to the level of society, which was way more cruel at the time of the Old Testament, just remember, children weren't counted as people back there.
Do you have any tangible evidence for the bible besides the Bible itself?
Shroud of Christ in Torino, there were lots of investigations in it, with the result of "true". The shroud as an object stated that Christ was crucified and then something divine happened to His body, leaving a 3-D imprint on the shroud's surface. The complete journey of the shroud is documented and proven by detecting spores of endemic plants. Will this satisfy as an objective witness?
Jesus said, "Blessed are those who do not see but believe." Why should we not-see but believe? Isn't this promoting irrationality?
Second - he is assuming that belief is a choice. Belief is not a choice. When you hear evidence, you cannot "choose" to believe something regarding the issue. You either believe it or you don't. For instance, I can't just all-on-a-whim "choose" to believe that: x > x.
If you're looking for logical proof, look for it for yourself. Read Lee Strobel, listen to the Top 10 proof CD's. The universe is expanding, we can't deny that. But all scientists have done is extrapolate 15 billion years ago, and squeezed everything into a tiny dot. You're going from nothing to the entire universe. Explain that.
Problem - what we're not revealing to you is that we HAVE looked them up, and they fail. There are blatant fallacies in them. For instance: Anselm's argument - existence nor perfection are properties of objects Teleological argument - doesn't preclude evolution, and it doesn't prove anything; it merely suggests. Any others?
Actually, people memorized these stories to the dot until they tell them, because this is something so important. The first Generation would have told the second generation exactly how it happened, the second generation would have told the third generation, It was too important to just make mistakes
I already showed early on in this thread that there are mistakes in the Bible.
