ForumsWorld Events, Politics, Religion, Etc.

Theism and Atheism

Posted Jan 13, '14 at 10:54am



487 posts

Yeah, i'm not saying God's allowing rape, I'm saying that this, in the traditional bible, doesn't have to mean rape. What if both parties are willing?


Posted Jan 13, '14 at 2:58pm



5,750 posts

What if both parties are willing?

Then I'd find it strange that the man would be required to pay if they each wanted to be together, but that's beside the point.

The law doesn't make a distinction between consensual sex and rape. It just says that if a man sleeps with a woman they must wed. Well, that applies to rape too. The problem is this oversight, which rewards the rapist and further victimizes the woman.

You'd think God would have made better laws, being omnipotent and all.

Posted Jan 14, '14 at 1:27pm



114 posts

Seems legit.


Posted Jan 21, '14 at 12:00am



9,485 posts

[I'm bringing over a relevant discussion topic from the Evaluate The Supernatural thread. The following quote is from MattEmAngel]

It only takes one ignorant person to start a fire war, regardless of whose side they are on. I'm a Christian (aka, a deist, which means I believe in the supernatural), and deists often end up with a bad rap as being illogical and arrogant thanks to a few people that do a terrible job of representing us. I once saw a very interesting article called "Seven things Christians and Atheists have to agree on." To my surprise, it was correct.
It's on Cracked and, although the text is way too small, it's worth a read. I suggest reading through this before debating too heavily. It'll keep everyone a lot more mature.

My main point of disagreement is that the author thinks that atheism is a belief system. ("1. You Can Do Terrible Things in the Name of Either One") There is no "In the name of atheism" in the same way that there is no "In the name of aleprechaunism/afairyism/aSteveism". There could be an antireligious policy under a secular government, but that has nothing to do with one's acceptance of a god claim, considering that some religions contain no god and would strongly disagree with such a policy.

Posted Jan 21, '14 at 12:27am



5,750 posts

There is no "In the name of atheism"

There is and isn't. Someone can do something and say they did it in the name of atheism, but it wasn't atheism that they it for. They did it for the values they associate with atheism. Atheism itself is just the "no" answer to the question, "Do you have a belief in a supernatural entity?" Anyone who tries to attribute anything more to it than that doesn't understand what they're talking about.

I pretty much agree with EmperorPalpatine here though. The guy's bolded points were true, but his descriptions and examples of them were poor. His bit about morality for example, where he just assumes there's a universal morality and that atheists believe in this because they don't like getting scammed $80, thus they somehow are being hypocritical because there's no "morality particle" when all that shows is he doesn't have a good grasp of what morality actually is.

Posted Jan 21, '14 at 12:49am



9,826 posts



Posted Jan 21, '14 at 3:52pm



1,712 posts

The guy's bolded points were true, but his descriptions and examples of them were poor.

I would argue that even the bolded statements are, in many cases, incorrect. Sure "Both Sides Really Do Believe What They're Saying" and yes, by the conventional definition of the word good, "There Are Good People on Both Sides". The rest is vague and overly generalized, however.

Posted Jan 21, '14 at 6:39pm



5,750 posts

I would argue that even the bolded statements are, in many cases, incorrect.

Not really. They just have so little importance that they can be applied to any two diverging viewpoints.

Going over them individually.

1. You Can Do Terrible Things in the Name of Either One.

Mostly true. Anyone can do anything "in the name of something." It's entirely possible for a person to go out and kill a theist "in the name of atheism" because they want only atheists to exist. Likewise, I don't have to explain what's done in the name of religion by radicals.

2. Both Sides Really Do Believe What They're Saying

True, unarguably and axiomatically. People believe what they believe and what they believe puts them under that label.

3. In Everyday Life, You're Not That Different

Pretty much true, though the more religious one gets the more this differs. In your job, at the supermarket, driving to work, taking a vacation, talking with friends...well, there's going to be far more variation between individuals than an aggregate group of atheists vs theists.

4. There Are Good People on Both Sides

True. There are plenty of religious people (the majority) who do not use it to harm other people and do good things. There are plenty of atheists (the majority) who do not rage about religion all day long and do good things.

Though this one seems more for the theists, who commonly argue that atheists have no morals.

5. Your Point of View is Legitimately Offensive to Them

Okay, this one might be untrue. I don't find the idea of theism offensive. I don't know how many atheists do. I do know that a lot of religious people find it offensive to have it said that what they believe is not true, so I lean more towards this being true, because I know many atheists find religion offensive and I do as well.

6. We Tend to Exaggerate About the Other Guy

Change exaggerate to generalize off extremists and this is 100% true. The idea itself is true.

7. We Tend to Exaggerate About Ourselves, Too

Do I need to talk about how unrealistically people can view themselves and those in their group?

8. Focusing on Negative Examples Makes You Stupid

While I would argue that it makes you stupid, it certainly is intellectually dishonest to not look at the whole picture. Only talking about the good or bad of anything presents an unrealistic view.

9. Both Sides Have Brought Good to the Table

Again, true. Atheists and theists are perfectly capable of doing good and contributing to knowledge and peace.

10. You'll Never Harass the Other Side Out of Existence

This is an observation of human nature. The more you try to repress something, the harder it holds on. "Harass" I take to mean not commit genocide but bother incessantly, so true.

Posted Jan 22, '14 at 4:09am



24 posts

Religions are yet another thing that divides our world (and I'm saying this as a christian)


Posted Jan 24, '14 at 11:33pm



9,787 posts


Been trying to get a straight answer on this one for a while.
If a religion is true, why do we not see people independently coming to the conclusions the religion espouses without first being exposed to that religion?

Reply to Theism and Atheism

You must be logged in to post a reply!