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Forums → WEPR → if god is all forgiving, why is there hell
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im an athiest and never understood why if god forgives everyone then why dose he send people to hell
- 266 Replies
Why should that matter? It's not like we would have bad things without religion. Whatever bad things come with religion would come without it.
That would mean that nothing changes without religion or with it. So then it's not even a factor.
100-0=100.
Whatever bad things come with religion would come without it.
No not all of it, we wouldn't have otherwise rational people making completely irrational decisions based on those religious beliefs. This has led to many problems. For one example those who have let their children die or have killed their children based on religious views. This is something that many of them would likely not have done if not for their religion.
People would still make irrational decisions without religion. People join gangs, are selfish, greedy, and often hurt people for their own gain without any religious influences at all. They've often used it as an excuse, but it's not the reason they do it. It's like saying pedo prists molest kids because the bible allows it. We all know pedo prists molest kids because they're pedo jerks who don't care about the kids they molest. But they'll use religion to try and cover it up. If people did do this based on religious belifes then I don't see why the same argument can't be applied to church communities. Implying that without religion we wouldn't have as many close loving communities. My point is that we would still have them, the only difference is that we put the lable "religion" on them.
People would still make irrational decisions without religion.
Yes there would be, however this would be far less prevalent.
It's like saying pedo prists molest kids because the bible allows it.
No it's not like saying that. Going back to my example these are people acting directly on those religious beliefs that God is going to do something, one some cases believing God will cure their sick child so they refuse medical attention that would have. In another a belief God is ending the world, to keep their children from having to face this fate they killed them. These are things that have happened for no other reason but a religious belief and they aren't uncommon stories either.
If people did do this based on religious belifes then I don't see why the same argument can't be applied to church communities. Implying that without religion we wouldn't have as many close loving communities.
We can form communities that aren't based on religion and it's very likely the desire to belong and form these communities would still exist without without religion. So without religion in the equation it's still likely we could still end up with these sorts of communities.
Just for the sake of argument let's say we would have all these negatives and positives without without religion. This makes religion completely pointless and redundant to have.
This thread is starting to look like an excuse to hate on religion, if thats the case, couldn't you have picked a more imaginative question I hear this one every month
I see what you mean, but if a mother refusing to give her child care is complealty religious based. If she knew and understood that the medicene would easily cure her child and she really loved her child then I think she would go with it whether or not she belived god was going to do it. Unless she belived god was against medicine, and I don't see why she would. Can you explain why irrational desisions would be less prevanlent though? If we didn't have a religious cover up I still think that people would do the irrational things they did with a different cover up.
I understand that without religon we would still have the good. What I want to know is why you belive that without religion there would be less bad and the same amount of good. Doesn't this imply that religion has a overall negative characteristic to it? Religion is an idea, and so I think it's like a tool. It can be used for good or bad. But what makes it seem negative or positive are what people use it for and how often. Like guns and hammers.
Sorry, I just have refeshed the page. I agree. Equal negative and positive. I won't argue on the redundent, even though I don't exactly agree.
If she knew and understood that the medicene would easily cure her child and she really loved her child then I think she would go with it whether or not she belived god was going to do it.
She would be placing her trust and the work of God over that of humans. Without the religious belief derived into her head to think God medicine > human medicine and that with if she and others just believed hard enough God would take action, these people would likely take their kids to a doctor.
Can you explain why irrational desisions would be less prevanlent though?
The person wouldn't have the irrational base to work from to begin with.
What I want to know is why you belive that without religion there would be less bad and the same amount of good.
Remove religion from the equation. The positive aspects most rational people will arrive at so the level of those acts aren't likely to change much. The negative aspects aren't things that an otherwise rational person would arrive at. However since we have many otherwise rational people believing these irrational things they end up more likely to do these irrational negative things that they otherwise wouldn't do.
Doesn't this imply that religion has a overall negative characteristic to it?
Yep...
Religion is an idea, and so I think it's like a tool.
One based on blind faith, which is what gives it this environment to let in these irrational ideas that can end up being overall harmful.
If we didn't have a religious cover up I still think that people would do the irrational things they did with a different cover up.
There would be some irrational people that will continue to act irrational but the majority of people are rational and would act as such.
I thought the debate was over >_>....... well anyways. I guess it depends on your point of view. You could say guns are overall bad. Because they breed violence whice is defintly overall harmful. But I think it's how people use guns that make them bad. We could just use them for hunting animals, but instead we use them for war.
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