Hey guys. I'm back, with a story for you to analyze.
Today I was in English class discussing old Anglo-Saxon texts, things I'm very interested in that other students aren't, but that's because I pitch a tent in my pants every time the word "Viking" or "Berserker" is mentioned.
Well, I was out the previous day because I had to leave school early to go see the Big Four at Yankee Stadium (EPIC! SLAYER!) and missed an in-class assignment about a text that involved an open-ended response. Today the other kids in my class reviewed each other's work and had to revise their responses. The teacher was passing out folders for us to put future SAT-related assignments in (I plan on getting a perfect score on that-almost did it with the PSAT last year in Soph year) and that we could put some designs on the folder to make it unique and what not, go home and past pictures of dudes or post a quote, whatever.
I was being myself, every notebook I have has a pentagram on it (see above) and I'm very cool about my Satanism, my Soph Teachers who knew I was a Satanist were cool about it, my English teacher Mr. Portas was actually very interested and enjoyed my standpoint on various responses from last year. So I draw a pentagram in the top-right corner on the front and turn the folder around, and proceed to write in big letters, my favorite quote. From Oppenheimer, the "Father of the Atom Bomb", "I am become DETH, the destroyer of WORLDS".
Sure, it was a bit more theatrical than when usually uttered, and it took up the entire back-portion of the folder, but I was being me, and I've received a lot of support from my peers and educators because of my eccentricity. My teacher proceeds to grab my folder and declare "Okay, we're going to do this again, we're not going to have Satanic symbols, and.." he flipped the folder over to the quote and pointed at it, "This garbage when it comes to the SAT's".
He proceeded to rip the folder in half and threw it out, and gave me a new one. I was being all neat with the heading too, the "Name-SAT Practice-Teacher Name" heading, showing I could be strange but incredibly well-versed.
I brought up the fact that when the Sophmore class goes on a local church's "Antioch" retreat, they can wear shirts displaying a quote form the Bible and get no backlash from the school. He responded by saying the folder was school property, which I can... half-way understand, but the fact of selective religious admittance still pissed me off.
So now I plot how I'm to deal with this situation. Is there anger? Yes. Am I going to be a child like him and rip up my problem? No. I just want a few responses to this tale of mine.
And one last note before the "-Chillz", at the end of last year we were to put together a portfolio of our best works over the year, and add a few more pieces of writing. I adored the project, and made the cover stand out from the traditional "scrapbook" style most kids had, I adorned it with flip-up pages, black paper, and a goat-pentagram on the front. Mr. Portas adored the aesthetic, ate up my tone and content, and I earned 225 out of a potential 250 points for the project. For those who aren't mathematically gifted, that's a 90 percent grade, an A-. He was able to look past my faith and see my content for what it was, or when he did acknowledge me faith, see how it affected my content for the better, as it should be. In my opinion, what my current English Teacher did was childish and shows strong religious bias, something NEVER permitted in public schools (especially a public school that's rated 6th best in the state of New Jersey). Maybe I'm wrong. Give some input!
Satanism is usually seen as very negative, just like Neo-Nazism. You wouldn't go drawing the Swatstika on the schools "half propety" because thats what you believe in. Things that are known to be negative are usually condemned, and Satanism is usually classified under this.
As blkasp said, those who do not have proper knowledge of satanism won't understand it. In the past it has been linked with so many negative things.
I understand it's your folder, even though it's the schools property as such. My view on that bit is that they are giving it to you. Symbols can be dangerous due to the connotations associated with them. If you wanted to speak with your teacher, you could explain to him exactly what the pentagram means and stretch way back to Mesopotamian writings (3000BC) and explain the astrological meanings in it's origin.
The reason i think your teacher was correct in not letting you draw the symbols (Although i don't think he should have acted the way he did) isn't because of religion - it's because of graffiti. I know a lot of teachers found us drawing anything over the folders they gave us was disrespectful - so i don't think it's a full blown attack against satanism.
As blkasp said - you couldn't draw a Swastika all over your folder because it would be disrespectful. I'd also find those drawing crosses disrespectful. Simply because your religion has nothing to do with your folder.
I'd assume this is more related to the fact that you're drawing all over your folder rather than what you drew. I don't think what he did was wrong, nor was ripping it up really exaggerated seeing as how you got a new one. Before you go around saying it's a matter of him not liking your religion, maybe you should find out if any of your Christian buddies have crosses on their books.
I don't know what the problem about the quote is, which by the way is not a quote of Oppenheimer. He quoted the Bhagavad Gita, so what you had on the back of your folder was a quote from a Hindu scripture.
I don't know what the problem about the quote is, which by the way is not a quote of Oppenheimer. He quoted the Bhagavad Gita, so what you had on the back of your folder was a quote from a Hindu scripture.
Also just a simple pentagram isn't strictly Satanic. It is usually used as a symbol of protection (yes even inverted).
Also just a simple pentagram isn't strictly Satanic. It is usually used as a symbol of protection (yes even inverted).
It is apparent, to me, that chillzy here makes it very well known that he is a satanist to everyone who is even moderately familiar with him. His adoration for the pentagram may very well stem from the ancient protection symbol and not the ties with Satanism... but when you go around all, "ZEIG HEIL MEIN SATAN!!!," you're going to have a very very hard time of explaining the fact that the symbol on your notebook isn't there because of your Satanism in any way...
...to give a better example... If I prance around doing the Nazi salute and burn crosses in my yard all the time, then I'll have a very hard time explaining that the swastika tattooed on my arm is just there because I really enjoy ancient Buddhist history (w/o any Hitler Nazi influence at all)... no matter how true that statement may be.
I wonder if those people who wear those shirts have ever asked for permission to wear them. If they have... then they went through the proper outlet. If you do something that's not normally allowed without asking, then there should be repercussions. If you ask first and get permission, then kewlsville.... plaster it all over your being ...maybe you should just ask for permission next time?
...even if I bought the folder (folders that stayed w/ them and never left the room), my teachers never allowed me to draw on them.... or write on them... or to place stickers on them. At least most teachers ( I'm pretty sure it's ALL of the ones I know) I know emphasize formal reports and don't allow gawdy drawings and such on stuff like that. I think they also file those things away, and they prefer them to all look the same (aside from your name on the top tab)
If those are the rules, then those are the rules. Just because someone else gets away with murder doesn't mean you're entitled to the same treatment.... It just means there's a bias that needs to be corrected. Either call them out on it and get the t-shirt wearers in trouble, or change the rules and policies regarding religious symbols and attire in the what is supposed to be a learning environment separated from religious influence. Until you've changed the rules, you're still breaking them. A flamboyant sense of self-entitlement is hardly going to make that teacher anymore compliant.
That is horrible, similar religious bias has been showed by high ranking officials at my school as well. I find it disturbing that we as a scociety must respond cruley to which we do not understand of care for. I feel it shows how iggnorant we really are.
and that we could put some designs on the folder to make it unique and what not
People are saying that it's mostly because you drew all over your folder, but I quote you saying you were allowed to put designs on it. I think it's just the fact that you drew the pentagram, which really I thought had ties to satan till I read about it just now on wiki. But even if it had ties to satan, it's weird that he would rip it up.
But even if it had ties to satan, it's weird that he would rip it up.
Not really. Some parents tend to freak out over the dumbest things about school, and I'm sure the school and its teachers would like to avoid fights with parents over things like that.
When I replied last time I missed the part about where you said you were allowed to draw on it, my bad. Still, I still think you should try to find out if people of other religions are allowed to draw their symbols on it.
Also, as I mentioned before, I can see how the Bhagavad Gita quote could be an inappropriate thing to put on your folder if it is not obvious that it is a quote.
And a little sidenote, how about not drawing so much attention to your religion? It's fine if you want to be a Satanist, I'm an Atheist myself so I don't think you're any weirder than Christians (or Scientologists for that matter), but if I had a friend who had crosses on everything he owned, and referred to God and/or Jesus in every second sentence he said, I'm pretty sure I'd start avoiding him, not because I hate his religion, but because it's f-ing annoying. Just like I don't want people to talk non-stop every freaking day about their favourite band/actor, or their new car or whatever.
I find that, generally speaking, people who convert to a minority religion and make sure everyone knows about it usually do it just to get attention. People who genuinely care about the religion they convert to are usually just content with believing in it, and following whatever guidelines it may have. Now, this is not always the case and I don't know if it's true for you, and I don't want to offend you, but that's really what it looks like when you act like this.
Christians who don't have a passion to turn people to God are simply lame.
There's a difference between casually trying to get your friends interested in Christianity and acting like the crazy lady from the Westboro Baptists Church.
Anyways, seeing as how everyone has the right to choose their own religion, I personally think that trying to get someone to change his opinion about religion is something you should be careful with. It's okay to suggest it to people you know or something, or talk about your religion, but trying to convince strangers to convert, or more or less harassing people to make them convert are examples of behavior (like going door-to-door like some Jehovah's Witnesses) that I don't find acceptable. People have the right to believe in whatever they want, and if you don't respect that, you're as ignorant as the aforementioned WBC lady. If people have made up their minds, and they're not interested in hearing about your religion, then GTFO already.
I'm a Christian. When I mention God, church, etc., I usually do it to get them interested in Christianity. I don't do it for popularity/attention. Christians who don't have a passion to turn people to God are simply lame. Jesus tells us do spread the word, why would you ignore that?
Christianity isn't a minority religion. I don't know if you missed that part, but it's slightly different.
And I completely agree with what iMogwai said. Sure, I could draw Stars of David all over my school stuff, and there are Jewish kids at my school who do that, but there is on key problem there: it's ****ing annoying as hell. Now, I'm all for freedom of expression and religion, but keep in mind that these people have to deal with your obsession, and they might not want to. Beyond that, your Satanism could be offensive to some, as their religions could be offensive to you, which is why most schools try to keep religion out of the system.
Christians who don't have a passion to turn people to God are simply lame. Jesus tells us do spread the word, why would you ignore that?
There's also a difference between educating someone when they ask and trying to force them to convert. I'll be a religion teacher at a high school, but i will teach the major religions and some minor religions out there - i think it's up to everyone to decide on their own.
[quote]Christianity isn't a minority religion. I don't know if you missed that part, but it's slightly different. And I completely agree with what iMogwai said. Sure, I could draw Stars of David all over my school stuff, and there are Jewish kids at my school who do that, but there is on key problem there: it's ****ing annoying as hell. Now, I'm all for freedom of expression and religion, but keep in mind that these people have to deal with your obsession, and they might not want to. Beyond that, your Satanism could be offensive to some, as their religions could be offensive to you, which is why most schools try to keep religion out of the system.[quote] I remember in 5th grade that whenever anyone mentioned religion our teachers told us not to talk about it, but now that I look back I could've gone all 1st amendment on them.
I remember in 5th grade that whenever anyone mentioned religion our teachers told us not to talk about it, but now that I look back I could've gone all 1st amendment on them.
not so much. religious propaganda in the public classroom detracts from the learning environment. Unless the topic of discussion in the classroom is on religion then your discussing it can and should be silenced (if the teacher chooses to). If you're talking about anything other than the subject matter during the time where you're supposed to be engrossed in your studies (during class time... ---breaks, lunch, and "free" time should be different)... the same goes for promoting/discussing atheism, satanism, Hinduism, and/or/but not limited to what you're going to do that weekend.
It's justifiable in the same way that I can't go around singing the F-word song... which is basically just streaming the F-word back to back to the tune of whatever song comes to mind at the time. 1. it's distracting. 2. people find it offensive 3. it's inappropriate
...and free speech doesn't mean that you can say whatever you want wherever you want. There are limits on it, and therefore the usage of "free" in the words free speech is somewhat of a farce. Free implies speech w/o limit and threat of repercussion... that, we do not have.
Even if the constitution does give you that "right," you won't be winning that argument. Unless you can say/prove that they discriminated against you b/c they're racist towards your ethnicity, then you're not going to be having much luck. Smug self entitlement is counter productive a lot of the time when you're trying to prove to someone that your stereotypically negative position is in fact correct.
