AGS Steam Games

Forums → WEPR → US Cuts UNESCO Funding

13 3858
zakyman
offline
zakyman
1,627 posts
Peasant



Basically, the US is pretty peeved (much like I am) that UNESCO admitted the "nation" of Palestine into their organization, even though Palestine is not even a member state. UNESCO is the education wing of the UN and the fact that they are admitting this terrorist organization is an outstanding blow to the reputation and the standing of UNESCO. I am personally glad the the US cut off $60 million in funding, because now that money can be spent back here, instead of giving it to organizations which recognize and reward terrorists for bypassing negotiations.

What are your thoughts on this?

  • 13 Replies
Bladerunner679
offline
Bladerunner679
2,487 posts
Blacksmith

this terrorist organization is an outstanding blow to the reputation and the standing of UNESCO


look zakyman, I know how you are sympathetic to the israelis, but pakistan was received, there is nothing we can do about it. palestine isn't a terrorist organization, it's been wanting to become separate from israel ever since it became a nation. we now look petty because we withheld our funding over a completely fair trial. it makes us look really bad by doing this. no ammount of personal bias will change that.
zakyman
offline
zakyman
1,627 posts
Peasant

it's been wanting to become separate from israel ever since it became a nation


I find issue with this comment. Had Palestine wanted to become a separate nation, than they would have accepted it in 1947, the Olso Accords, and multiple other times where Palestine would have become a country. However they cannot accept the recognition of Israel.

we now look petty because we withheld our funding over a completely fair trial


If it is considered petty to follow your own laws, than everyone in this world is a fool.

No funds authorized to be appropriated by this Act or any other Act shall be available for the United Nations or any specialized agency thereof which accords the Palestine Liberation Organization the same standing as member states.


It's US law. Look it up
Armed_Blade
offline
Armed_Blade
1,482 posts
Shepherd

admitting this terrorist organization is an outstanding blow to the reputation and the standing of UNESCO.


Quite interesting. In arguments, you chose your words carefully. When ranting, it is easy to see that you view the entire nation as a terrorbasket. Freaky.

"nation" of Palestine

I do not get why you chose to use quotes. By definition, a nation is borderless.


instead of giving it to organizations which recognize and reward terrorists for bypassing negotiations.


Aside from your continuous use of the word 'terrorist' - I have another question to ask of you. How on earth is this a bypass of negotiations?

1) Membership to UNESCO is determined by a popular vote of the members present, regardless of the countries size/budget.

2) UNESCO is a piece of the UN that functions separately. This is why it gets to keep the whole '5 Giant countries get some pointless Veto' kind of bullcrap out. It is the only reason that the US does anything with the UN, and also the reason the US hated UNESCO for such a long time -- because it lacked any super influence at all due to equalization.

3) Considering on a 107-14 victory with 52 abstainers, you're view of Palestine being loaded with a bunch of terrorists ready to blow sounds very radical. Although you seem to say that UNESCO is a major educational wing of freedom, you're thoughts seem to be extremely contradictory to the majority of the world -- not just a few others in opposition.

You say it destroys UNESCO's reputation and standing. Yet, for nearly two decades, UNESCO was boycotted by the USA, and the organization stood tall. I think that is what has given it any credibility as a group of the UN that is not subject to the titanic influence of superpowers, and the fact that it has been able to run successfully so long in a democratic arena is what gives it any of the credibility it may seem to have.


The US cutting funding is just the US playing their game. Palestine is set to be on vote for membership soon, and will lose, despite massive support, due to the US veto.
In other words, the US will use it's money/influence/both to get what it wants.
This has nothing to do with the US being 'eeved' about Palestine getting rights/membership/humanitarian rights. It most certainly does not follow in place of what you wish to believe, that the US honestly sees a threat from Palestine that it wishes to subdue in order to save itself and appease Israel -- it is just US foreign policy, looking to save already made investments in Israel just in case things get murky and we have to find some more oil or political control.

Bladerunner puts in good perspective. We just look pretty bad doing this. We're telling a major humanitarian agency of the United Nations, one that works democratically, to go screw itself because we didn't get what we want.
HahiHa
offline
HahiHa
8,256 posts
Regent

I read that the reson for this is actually that the US cannot legally fund any organisation that accepts Palestine as a member. But this really sounds like a bad excuse. I find it childish, I mean, the Unesco fund schooling, science, culture, knowledge; cutting funds to it sounds like a crime to humanity to me.
Why are you calling Palestine a terrorist organisation? It is a nation not accepted as such, it is a people, among which, sadly, there are many extremists as it seems (or as we're always told), but for f***'s sake, it is still a people. Not an organisation.

If America can make better use of the money they now won't spend (yet; it seems they'd be ready to spend it later, depending on whatever happens), then ok. But I doubt that the money will be in better hands, seeing as how your economy evolves...

thepunisher93
offline
thepunisher93
1,826 posts
Nomad

You know what image this creates of USA in muslim world?
That america is an anti muslim country

Bladerunner679
offline
Bladerunner679
2,487 posts
Blacksmith

No funds authorized to be appropriated by this Act or any other Act shall be available for the United Nations or any specialized agency thereof which accords the Palestine Liberation Organization the same standing as member states.


...
...
...that law seems more like a legal version of "you're not playing because I don't like you".

I can understand why they won't accept israel as a nation. israel won't stop encroaching on their lands. I keep hearing how the infrastructure of palestinian areas keeps degrading, then after that I hear about how israel built another 80,000 homes just a while back.

the only way for there to be peace over the matter is if israel will return some of the land they took.

and yes, I know you will probably retalliate against me saying that in a little while.
Bladerunner679
offline
Bladerunner679
2,487 posts
Blacksmith

sorry for the double post.

for some odd reason, I can't seem to get the last two posts of this thread. so in other words, I'm firing into the dark. sorry bout that.

zakyman
offline
zakyman
1,627 posts
Peasant

Quite interesting. In arguments, you chose your words carefully. When ranting, it is easy to see that you view the entire nation as a terrorbasket. Freaky.


When referring to Palestine, I do not mean the culture as a whole. I mean the governing body. Arafat is a terrorist who has called for the destruction of Israel many times.

...that law seems more like a legal version of "you're not playing because I don't like you".


Than so are all of the sanctions against Iran, and other nations the US has seen fit to block financially.

the only way for there to be peace over the matter is if israel will return some of the land they took.


Ah yes, return the land back to indefensable borders where Israel is cut in half. When you decide to attack someone, and then you lose land in the process, you lose your right to cry about it.

I can understand why they won't accept israel as a nation. israel won't stop encroaching on their lands. I keep hearing how the infrastructure of palestinian areas keeps degrading, then after that I hear about how israel built another 80,000 homes just a while back.


They built homes in East Jerusalem. That is not a settlement. It seems that now even a building in Tel Aviv would cause international controversy.

That america is an anti muslim country


How so?

Considering on a 107-14 victory with 52 abstainers, you're view of Palestine being loaded with a bunch of terrorists ready to blow sounds very radical. Although you seem to say that UNESCO is a major educational wing of freedom, you're thoughts seem to be extremely contradictory to the majority of the world -- not just a few others in opposition.


The UN is one of the biggest anti-Israeli and anti-Semitic organizations in the world. More statements AGAINST Israel have been made, than all the ME combined. And this is with violent crackdowns in Syria, rockets launched daily into Israel, and Hamas using women and children as shields. It seems as if Israel is the scapegoat in these conflicts.
Bladerunner679
offline
Bladerunner679
2,487 posts
Blacksmith

The UN is one of the biggest anti-Israeli and anti-Semitic organizations in the world. More statements AGAINST Israel have been made, than all the ME combined. And this is with violent crackdowns in Syria, rockets launched daily into Israel, and Hamas using women and children as shields. It seems as if Israel is the scapegoat in these conflicts.


you really are ranting aren't you?

look, the UN only appears antisemetic because they have no real power to enforce anything. they can't control goverments, all they can really do is send a strongly worded letter to the current leader asking him to cease and desist. they are really a way of connecting the world to allow political information to be shared in public.

so...when somebody attacks the jews, there is really nothing the UN can really do about it. it's the countries themselves you have to appeal to.
Bladerunner679
offline
Bladerunner679
2,487 posts
Blacksmith

sorry once again for the double post. sumitted the post before I finished.

How so?


it's simple: the sterotype that americans are intolerant is already there. this will just add to it and instead of making it general, it will be very specific and will make things much harder when talking politics to the middle east.

Ah yes, return the land back to indefensable borders where Israel is cut in half. When you decide to attack someone, and then you lose land in the process, you lose your right to cry about it.


my good friend zakyman, do you not remember how israel was established? brittian basically forced people out of palestine to allow israel to be established just a few decades ago. since brittian was more powerful then than they are today, nobody could fight back about it.

Than so are all of the sanctions against Iran, and other nations the US has seen fit to block financially.


it's true, they are ways of the U.S. just being petty, which is why those laws really shouldn't be around.

When referring to Palestine, I do not mean the culture as a whole. I mean the governing body. Arafat is a terrorist who has called for the destruction of Israel many times.


once again, because palestine was (almost overnight) forced out of it's own lands for the israelis to establish their own country. arafat and his generation still feel the wounds of that event, and they get re-opened when israel starts pushing on them once again for the land that was already theirs.

in simple (and very harsh) terms, the israelis had no right to believe the land was theirs.
zakyman
offline
zakyman
1,627 posts
Peasant

you really are ranting aren't you?


No, I am merely stating facts. If you want to have a condescending attitude toward fellow debaters, then stop your dialogue now.

look, the UN only appears antisemetic because they have no real power to enforce anything. they can't control goverments, all they can really do is send a strongly worded letter to the current leader asking him to cease and desist. they are really a way of connecting the world to allow political information to be shared in public.


I understand that the UN has no real power. However, it is ridiculous when statements against Israel are issued by the bushel, when crimes in Darfur and Syria are practically ignored by the UN!

my good friend zakyman, do you not remember how israel was established? brittian basically forced people out of palestine to allow israel to be established just a few decades ago. since brittian was more powerful then than they are today, nobody could fight back about it.


Yes I do. I remember that it split the land into two parts, and the Israeli half wasn't even connected with itself. The Jews were more than happy to take the peanuts thrown at them, small compensation for the Holocaust, but the Arabs could not afford to lose .03% of the land to Jews.

once again, because palestine was (almost overnight) forced out of it's own lands for the israelis to establish their own country. arafat and his generation still feel the wounds of that event, and they get re-opened when israel starts pushing on them once again for the land that was already theirs.

in simple (and very harsh) terms, the israelis had no right to believe the land was theirs.


Actually, most Palestinians left because they did not want to be in the line of fire, and the Arab military generals were predicting an all out slaughter of Israel. And while we are on the topic of claiming of the land, the basis for Israel was that it was their holy land in the Torah. However, the Muslims also claimed this.

Aside from your continuous use of the word 'terrorist' - I have another question to ask of you. How on earth is this a bypass of negotiations?


I realized I never shot this down. It is a bypassing of negotiations because it is a unilateral movement through channels that would only lead to conflict. I might not sound like it, but I really want peace in the region. The only way that that will happen is if both parties return to the table. Israel is ready. However, the Pals have consistently walked away from great deals giving them a homeland, because Israel refuses to get swamped by refugees under a "Right of Return"
antiloopje
offline
antiloopje
16 posts
Blacksmith

Sorry if I'm not following all your thoughts, but simply answering the first question:

1) Palestina isn't full of terrorists as you say. We've come to a point where it became impossible to say who's wrong or right - both are wrong. However, Israel is in a better, stronger position and thus, they have to take the first, the next, the main, the largest and the final steps in the peace process.

2) It was a decision of the UNESCO: over 150 countries have decided and the majority has chosen. This is a pretty good reflection of how the WORLD thinks about it, eh?

And 1 more reaction about your last post:

but the Arabs could not afford to lose .03% of the land to Jews.


Well, if the UN or the US governement or anyone would ask you to go out of your house, you wouldn't be pleased either. The palestines lived there for a long time and I suppose they liked it there.
gaboloth
offline
gaboloth
1,612 posts
Peasant

This is stupid, all human beings are equal and have the same rights to have a good education.
From a less idealistic point of view, it's actually still stupid. I could understand in UNESCO gave weapons, military training or whatever, but it gives EDUCATION. If palestinians are more educated it'll be much harder for their leaders to deceive them into following senseless wars and believing to anti western propaganda, so the people who chose to support terrorists will decrease.

Showing 1-13 of 13