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Salvidian
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Salvidian
4,170 posts
Farmer

INTRODUCTION

Thread Background
Coming from a long-time lurker born in 2008, I have noticed that Armor Games is facing a recent "slump" of activity. In other terms, Armor Games is becoming inactive. In my quest for answers, I've contacted several Armor Games users, ranging from new users to veterans. Thinking that I gave people something to think about for the day, Ernie15 gave me a bold idea to convert these ideas into a thread where one can give his/her ideas on the matter instead of letting this issue be small-talk. In many's minds, this is an issue that needs to be addressed to immediately. There have been threads like this, but this is the central HUB of what we view of Armor Games today.

Armor Games, I give you The User's View.

Armor Games Background
AG3, a major update to the Armor Games world, has been in development for around 2 years. There are tons of beta testers for the website. Prior to and starting at the development of AG3, Armor Games was once a bustling "city," if you will, of ideas traveling by means of public forum posting to comments to one another, or "small talk." Many of these users have left for reasons we will discuss and are being replaced by users we will later discuss.

Staff Changes
Late 2011, Cormyn, a very popular admin, resigned from his duties and became a regular user. He was somewhat replaced with Justin Royster, aka username jroyster22.

Part 1: Cormyn
Cormyn was undoubtedly known for his ability to be publicly active within the community and was often described as strict. As strict as he was, he kept the trash out and helped shape our modern-day Armor Games. He wrote code for the community, laid down a lot of the rules, appointed moderators alongside the moderation team, and, short and sweet, held Armor Games together. In many people's opinions, he was the administrator's community face of Armor Games. Once Cormyn left, jroyster22, alongside his duties with AG3, became the one to contact if you needed help. Justin Royster had big shoes to fill, and so far, he's done a moderate job. He prefers to contact via email, taking away from that on-site communication charm. In my opinion, Justin Royster has been a little vague with his duties. I and others have complained that Armor Games needs a new head, and if Justin Royster was a little more open, we'd have that strong, great leader. I am not criticizing his work- I understand he's busy. I'm just asking that he showed a little more of his face.

Part 2: Inactivity
Sadly, many of Armor Games' moderators have been caught up with daily life to successfully fulfill their duties on a daily basis. Similarly, admins are busy preparing AG3 for its release and have a lot to do. I understand they have lives as well. Many other new members have complained that it is impossible to get in touch with anyone on the staff team. Cormyn had written moderator-selection software, and many are thinking, if it is still available after Cormyn's resignation, perhaps it could be used to find another addition to the moderator team. Freakenstein has been a fantastic addition, but I feel as though we need more. I'm not going to name names because I respect what our moderators do; I feel as though we need more. Maybe it's time we eliminated the "small staff team" tradition for the time being until we recover. As for admins, we don't need a lot, but just one public face to get contact with would be fantastic.

Migration
I know AG3 is going to be very different. I know forum activity has sunk. I know your friends have left. Because of multiple things, many users, newbies and veterans alike, have moved on to different websites. This is not going to help our inactivity problem. It will only make it worse. I am not only asking you all to stay, but I am asking you to help out. We can't sit around and let our users leave. Part of it is our problem; we can make things interesting again. We can make people want to spend all of their time here. We can show people Armor Games is the best darn website out there!

Generation Transition
Jeol brought this to my attention and it struck me. What if the reason so many people are leaving is because they are older? Now, some people will never change, but others will grow and move on. And, who replaces them?

Part 1: Veterans
It's summer. You've finished school and want to enjoy the outdoors. You've finished school and have to work. You've finished school and want to try something new. Whatever it is, whether you've gotten too old for Armor Games, or have something else taking up your time, you can't visit your favorite website in the world. You know what? That's quite OK. Just remember to drop by once in a while and talk to your old friends. Many users are finding that they are having difficulties connecting with new people if they leave right away. Sadly, this leaves many users bored and craving for a good conversation.

Part 2: New Users
The size of Armor Games' user list is rising exponentially- it's skyrocketing! Most would think this would create more activity, wouldn't it? Frankly, no. Many games require an account for online saving to work, and the new generation replacing the previous one seems to be filled with people who join, stay active for a day, and quit dealing with the forums, leaving a large gap to be filled by no one.

Armor Games v3
As mentioned earlier, AG3 is being developed. By my count, there are currently 5 admins developing it. Unfortunately, users are complaining because there is little or no status updates on what's going on. Not to sound demanding, but more frequent updates could make the waiting all the easier. Also, the new achievement system may scare veterans who are used to and have gained recognition by the current AP system. AG3 will also result in a clean slate for the forums... By deleting all of the material there. Of course, much of the material is repeatable, but many veterans have good memories of posting here.

Conclusion
We've lost the face of the admins, Cormyn, and would like to have another public face again. Many moderators are busy with their lives and some more help would be fantastic. A lot of people have given up on Armor Games and have outright quit. Old faces are being replaced with people who aren't as devoted the site. AG3 is coming with big changes, but has gone very quiet recently.

~Salvidian

Those who contributed to this information in some way, shape, or form
-jeol
-Ernie15
-daleks
-Skeleton_Pilot
-Cenere
-GhostOfMatrix
-MrDayCee
-johnmerz

  • 339 Replies
Salvidian
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Salvidian
4,170 posts
Farmer

I was forced to remove some of the information because I had an issue with posting.

Upon reading the information,
it is recommended to discuss issues such as
-Other problems AG is facing
-Player-Staff relationships
-Who has left AG
-Who is considering leaving AG
-Real-life events dealing with AG (Summer vacation)

daleks
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daleks
3,770 posts
Chamberlain

One, how did I add anything to this when I did not even know about it? Two, I will post my opinions about all of this tomorrow.

GhostOfMatrix
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GhostOfMatrix
15,622 posts
Herald

Forum activity seems like it's at an all time low. Most likely due to how few forumers we have now - ~20 or so. When I created my account in 2010 and even in 2011 I'd see many names and there was a new post every few minutes, while now you're lucky to see a new post every half hour. People are probably done dealing with all the glitches and waiting for the new site. I know some people recommend creating new interesting threads, but if they haven't then why do they think we have any ideas that haven't been posted already? I've tried in the past - spent about half an hour on every new thread but they only reached about five posts before getting lost.

There's no player-staff relationship as they don't post frequently. All we see from them is stuff in the S&S subforum and it's usually addressing game issues. I'd like to see admin involvement in the AG3 subforum, as we haven't heard anything since Cormyn left.

Most people in the top 100 have probably left, I rarely see any of them participating in the community. A few that come to mind are Cenere, Mage, and Ernie but they usually just stick to one subforum - AMW/S&S, WEPR, and tavern respectively. I check here daily but I've been spending more time on Kongregate because they have most of the things discussed in the AG3 subforum that I want. I don't think I'd ever permanently leave AG, I love using this site, but I feel like it's dying.

It's been two years since they mentioned AG3, and I'm seriously starting to doubt if they'll ever come out with it. Last we heard from Cormyn it was going to be in summer or winter 2011. Yes, I was excited when it was fresh, but it doesn't seem like they're developing it anymore. On the beta site there haven't been any changes in months.

I'm not looking forward to them deleting the forums, if they do it that is. They've mentioned if it's too much of a hassle they will. But if they do I don't think many people would stick around. Personally I wouldn't want to start anew. It's not because of the post count, rather because of all those threads being deleted.

Well I'm done with school and it's usually very nice out so I'd rather be out there than inside on my computer. I'm also considering looking for a part time job just like most teenagers. I assume most forumers are also doing the same. However considering how much free time most people have now you'd expect the forum activity to rise instead of decrease; unfortunately new users don't usually stick around for that long. I see new user threads in the newcomers subforum often but that's the last I ever see of those people.

how did I add anything to this when I did not even know about it?

Probably from reading comments.
xeano321
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xeano321
3,152 posts
Farmer

I and others have complained that Armor Games needs a new head


Justin isn't the head of AG... Dan and John are the head guys as far as I know. (Just to keep the facts straight.)

Salvidian, I agree 100% with all of your statements (credit to those who actually had the ideas, just thanking Salvidian for posting them all at once.)

Two, I will post my opinions about all of this tomorrow.


Agree with Daleks, I have to reorganize my thoughts on this and post tomorrow
EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,223 posts
Nomad

Late 2011, Cormyn, a very popular admin, resigned from his duties and became a regular user


A great moment. A truly great moment. I did not like him. At all.

I and others have complained that Armor Games needs a new head


If you're seriously considering someone like cormyn, I will e-kick you in the nuts.

perhaps it could be used to find another addition to the moderator team


Why? There's so little activity in the community only two or three mods are needed. One could go it alone if necessary. The community is tiny. More mods isn't going to make life better.

The community is not better or worse than it ever was. Without purposely falling into a golden age fallacy, would I say it was better in older times? Yeah, it was. For me it was. Maybe for others it wasn't. I've been around for a very long time, and I've seen the community change time and time again. Do you know what happens every time it changes? Somebody starts a thread like this either complaining about how the olden days were better or some kind of useless pep rally that's going to be filled with veterans who cry themselves to sleep every night, reminiscing on old happenings and wondering how to change the present more to the likes of the past. It gets obnoxious. It really does. Would I want AG to be like 2009 again? Sure. Those were the times I was still learning who did what, and the ways of the site. There was plenty of crap, but there was plenty of fun, too. I had my share of high-and-mighty moments and plenty of moments I probably should have reacted differently. And then there was 420. But you know, fun stuff, right?

Old days were great, and new days are boring. That's how it works. That's how it always is.
Xzeno
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Xzeno
2,301 posts
Nomad

*reads* wh-what? Are you...

Those who contributed to this information in some way, shape, or form
-jeol
-Ernie15
-daleks
-Skeleton_Pilot
-Cenere
-GhostOfMatrix
-MrDayCee
-johnmerz

Well that explains it. With a thinktank like that, of course you're going to come up with some insane, wacked-out pro-Cormyn statements. Of that list, Cenere's is the only opinion I'd suggest anyone even come remotely close to valuing in this matter.

Cormyn was one of the worst things that ever happened to AG. His primary outlook on AG was that being an admin automatically meant that he knew what was good for the forum. He put him self up as some sort of beleaguered person doing the work that was required. But the work he was doing wasn't required. It was bull****. Cormyn spent his days making life on the forums worse and then complained about it. He thought he had the ability to lead just because he had the power to lead. But that's all he had. Power. Power granted because he was a programmer. I'm a programmer. Cormyn's role as "community organizer" had no more legitimacy than any other normal user dictating what should be done. The difference was that he had the power to ban anyone who disagreed with him.

Disagree? Okay. You can even keep your account.
thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,824 posts
Shepherd

Cormyn was Alduin and people like the OP are the draugr who still wake up every day to give their life force to the dragon priest leaders

thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,824 posts
Shepherd

You only think that because you're a draugr and your advanced state of decay prevents you from thinking otherwise

EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,223 posts
Nomad

But hey, at least they bring you guys back so we can get some negativity, right?


Negativity is best pony.
BoredMartian
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BoredMartian
676 posts
Nomad

Just remember to drop by once in a while and talk to your old friends.


Why would someone have to take time out of their schedule to do something they don't care about and isn't essential?

We can show people Armor Games is the best darn website out there!


We? How? Dilly of a pickle?
nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,987 posts
Grand Duke

I want Carlie, not Cormyn preferably and hypothetically. Don't want to go through such a strict Forum phase.

Ernie15
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Ernie15
13,351 posts
Bard

Justin isn't the head of AG... Dan and John are the head guys as far as I know. (Just to keep the facts straight.)


Dan is the head of AG, John is the head of game development and Justin is the head of the community.

Why? There's so little activity in the community only two or three mods are needed. One could go it alone if necessary. The community is tiny. More mods isn't going to make life better.


If you haven't noticed, if you get two or three mods posting in the same thread, that thread is going to blow up with activity. Newish users especially want to get in on the "action" of posting in the presence of mods. They probably see it as some sort of mortals-on-Mount-Olympus thing.

This is what I've seen from experience.


Would I want AG to be like 2009 again? Sure. Those were the times I was still learning who did what, and the ways of the site. There was plenty of crap, but there was plenty of fun, too.


Would you rather keep the site the way it is now, or have it be more like it was back in 2009? And for the love of all things sacred, do not answer with a "you can't make the site the way it was back in 2009" because that's not what I'm asking.

If you want to give up on the community, then give up. But complaining about other people voicing their opinions on how to better it again doesn't help anybody.

Cenere's is the only opinion I'd suggest anyone even come remotely close to valuing in this matter.


Arrogance isn't going to help anyone or anything either.

Like him or not, when cormyn was in power, things got done. Not only did things progress like never before, but the community was made well aware of every update and any member could approach him for any problem and he'd get around to it just like that. He involved himself with the community and let everyone know he was there.

You can choose to remember him as some fascist, power-hungry dictator. I choose to remember him as the most dedicated community leader we've ever had and perhaps will ever have.

Why would someone have to take time out of their schedule to do something they don't care about and isn't essential?


Would you like it if someone you talked to almost every day suddenly moved hundreds of miles away and never attempted to contact you again and you had no way of contacting them?

Yeh; negativity causes conflict, and what would we be without that? Inactive.


On the internet, conflicts last as long as both parties are willing to argue, even if neither of them know what they're talking about. Hence the WEPR. I've never once seen someone in a forum say "Oh, you're right and I'm wrong. Silly me."

I want Carlie, not Cormyn preferably and hypothetically.


Carlie was as friendly and approachable as they come, but she also had a tendency to disappear for indefinite and sometimes inordinate periods of time without letting the community know. She was dedicated, but not on the same level cormyn was.
EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,223 posts
Nomad

He involved himself with the community and let everyone know he was there.


How could someone miss that ban message when they try to log in?

Little infraction? b&. Disagree with cormyn? b&.

Stalin got **** done. He also killed twenty million people.

because that's not what I'm asking.


You were asking something? I wasn't aware.

If you want to give up on the community, then give up. But complaining about other people voicing their opinions on how to better it again doesn't help anybody.


I'm complaining about the repetitive nature of the thread. I've seen it all before, and I'll probably see it again. The intention is good, but it's pointless and irrelevant. Stating that we're lacking in activity is like saying that people die when they're killed. It's obvious. While I would support more activity, the main divisive point of the thread is the issue of mein fuhrer cormyn.
Xzeno
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Xzeno
2,301 posts
Nomad

Like him or not, when cormyn was in power, things got done.
No, they didn't. What did he achieve? What &quotrogress" did he make? The &quotroblems" he worked to solve didn't exist until he decided they needed to be solved. He did achieve some good things and ban some bad users, but he was overzealous to say the least.

And Orion Alt and I aren't being negative. Well, we are, but not pointlessly so. We all agree that AG sucks and should be better. We apparently all don't agree on how it should be better.
Cenere
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Cenere
13,658 posts
Jester

However people might feel about Ian/Cormyn and what he did as an admin and as a face for the staff, he was probably the best thing that could have happened since Carlie got busy and left. Simply because he bothered to listen to mods, users and he actually communicated with the community.
His - reign was stricter, but also better controlled, at least from a mod point of view.
I personally liked him a lot, since he actually did bother with us, he bothered with small talks and put in as many thoughts on topics as he could, so we could find a proper solution. Not to mention he was there, just a post away, and not twenty emails and an angry thread away like the rest of the staff seems to be.

So, even if he was trigger happy to some, that he might not have an agreeable solution or he might not be as smooth with the community as an of the mods or something... He still actually gave off the feeling that someone cared.
The current staff... The current staff will write four word posts, reply to one single thread and apparently ignore anything else and, I assume, does not value their moderators, present, former or future.
Or they just hate me specifically, which would not be news, but seems like an overly ambitious thought.

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