ForumsWEPRThe Bible: Louisiana's proposed state book

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SirNoobalot
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SirNoobalot
22,225 posts
Peasant

As much as I hate to link to Fox News or Yahoo, there is word of a bill that would make the state book of the state the Bible, which raises questions of whether this violates the separation of church and state in the US Constitution.

The most relevant part of the Consitution regarding this topic is the Establishment clause, which prohibits the establishment of a religion by Congress. You may say that this applies only on the federal level, but through the SC case Everson v. Board of Education, (Link or tl;dr), the Establishment clause also applies to state and local government.
That was somewhat unrelated, and now to the more important question....

Does the nomination of a religious text as the official book of a state violate the Establishment clause?

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nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,869 posts
Viceroy

I think it certainly does to the grossest degree; While it is claimed that the bill is not geared towards the purpose of showing state preference over other religious texts and by extension, religions, or to establish Christianity as the state religion, I feel this is tenacious at best, and blatantly fibbing at worse. What other purpose can it serve by adopting it as a State endorsed book? To highlight it's importance to the lives of Louisianians? Sounds a poor reason to me.

As much as I do not condone the enshrining (Get it? ) of any religious text or religion on such a pedestal, if this has to go ahead, then I hope the least condition they can enact as well is to similarly endorse all mainstream religious texts. That way, at least it shows non-favouritism, although it would still completely spit in the face of a separation of Church and State.

Also another nasty ecclesiastical pitfall, which version of the Bible will they choose as the State sanctioned copy?

Kennethhartanto
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Kennethhartanto
241 posts
Treasurer

If i remembered correctly, US is a secular nation which separates Government from religion. by making the Bible the Louisiana's state book, this would completely negate your country's founding fathers wishes, which i don't think anyone in your country's court would want that. what i can say is, don't make any religious based state in your country, because i suspect the effects would ricochet across the nation, quite akin to a wildfire

09philj
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09philj
2,832 posts
Scribe

A terrible thing if it did happen, but it should have been foreseen, surely?

nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,869 posts
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A terrible thing if it did happen, but it should have been foreseen, surely?


After some of them tried to secede following the 2012 elections, we should have known.
SSTG
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SSTG
12,995 posts
Templar

This is UNCONSTITUTIONAL!!!
The only way to stop this nonsense is to elect Democrats in a landslide to prevent this kind of insanity in the next elections!
They should also require a mental test for any future senators, governors, etc.
There are way too many nutcases in this country that can harm the population with such ridiculous behavior once they're in power.
Also, those freaks forget an important rule: NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW.

nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,869 posts
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They should also require a mental test for any future senators, governors, etc.
There are way too many nutcases in this country that can harm the population with such ridiculous behavior once they're in power.


Allegedly a constituent petitioned him, perhaps it's just a cynical populist ploy?
SSTG
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SSTG
12,995 posts
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Allegedly a constituent petitioned him, perhaps it's just a cynical populist ploy?

If you lived here in the US, you wouldn't think this way, believe me.
Those people are dangerous to society.
When people reject reality over a book of mythology full of childish stories, it's a very serious matter.
If it were for them, USA would be like North Korea.
nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,869 posts
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If you lived here in the US, you wouldn't think this way, believe me.
Those people are dangerous to society.


I don't disagree that they pose a danger to society, what I was saying was, it could just be a tactic employed by Republicans to curry favour with the electorate, even if the candidates don't wholly believe in their actions.

Not that it matters though.
nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,869 posts
Viceroy

Can anyone give me a legitimately good reason for a state to have a state book, and is it worth the time to argue about it?


It is worth arguing against if it brings up deeper arguments, such as the separation of religion from State.
09philj
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09philj
2,832 posts
Scribe

the epitome of religious text


That's quite offensive to every other religion. (Unless you meant most common religious text in the US)
nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,869 posts
Viceroy

The entire thing smells of deliberately bringing up deeper arguments. I seriously doubt that Louisiana "forgot" about separation of religion and State laws. They know full well what the Constitution states (that's hardly an unsafe assumption) and that suggesting the Bible, the epitome of religious text, be voted as the "state book" is a play for attention.

There's no way this is a legitimate decision. Religion in America is an insanely touchy subject that has become more and more risky to discuss. Voting on something so blatantly unconstitutional is absurd and a waste of time.


Of course it is a waste of time; but if it's a symptom of an innate need to inject religion in where it should not be, then it's worrying, and a very important subject to bring up.

I'm not surprised that Yahoo! covered it, though. They're just as full of it as this subject. Anything from FOX and Yahoo! is generally not worth your time. FOX condemned "bronies" because "middle-aged men are filing for unemployment so they can watch a show about ponies." They had an expert say that. On the news. Fail.


I don't think simple reporting would not be worth our time. If there was biased bigotry in the form of commenting from the networks and reporters then maybe not, but if all Yahoo or Fox did so far for this issue is to report it neutrally then it should be fine.
nichodemus
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nichodemus
14,869 posts
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I've spent countless hours on Yahoo! news articles and I assure you that they are addicted to bias and skewing information. Occasionally I went to an article just to read the comments, most of which were flaming the site for it.


The Yahoo article quoted had nothing that was bias in it. Hard facts, which can be corroborated with other news sources. If anything, it did not cover all the quotes and statements made by the Reps that were provided in other outlets, but Yahoo has never made news reporting its main purpose, nor does it mean the basic story made up. But this is not pertinent to the thread topic.


Just like the other five million important subjects people are screaming about (sarcasm). Gun control is one thing, because legislation is skimming around the wording, but something like this, which is openly unconstitutional, is really just not worth diverting attention to. Get the Supreme Court (or whoever has that jurisdiction) to send Louisiana a copy of the constitution and a "What the heck is wrong with you?" note and leave it alone.

They're clearly violating the constitution. Let the government handle it and find something else to do. Sorry if that seems rude or simplistic, but come on. It's like that one guy who wanted to burn a copy of the Qur'an. It was a huge deal, everyone and their dog wanted to argue about it and now no one remembers or cares. He was doing something controversial for attention, he got it, Muslims and Christians went insane, and in the end it was a waste of time. Considering how illegal this is, it feels like it's along the same lines.


If opponents let the Louisiana government handle it and not take it into their own hands, they'll likely pass the bill. (They already cleared the first hurdle in the House Committee voting.) It's not an option. It is worth bringing up into the public arena, because although everyone is aware of what the Constitution states, not everyone interprets it the same way. Which is also one reason why the gun control argument is still ongoing, because people disagree with how to interpret the Constitution, such as how it applies to the modern context, but that's not the point.

I think that it's completely different from people who burn the Qu'ran. This is a law that's being passed.
FishPreferred
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FishPreferred
3,057 posts
Archduke

This legislation is preposterous, but it is not something that should be ignored. The infamous Indiana Pi Bill is a good example of what happens when you leave lawmakers to their own devices.

pangtongshu
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pangtongshu
9,868 posts
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Just the way god intended it

Freakenstein
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Freakenstein
9,543 posts
Scribe

The most relevant part of the Consitution regarding this topic is the Establishment clause, which prohibits the establishment of a religion by Congress. You may say that this applies only on the federal level, but through the SC case Everson v. Board of Education, (Link or tl;dr), the Establishment clause also applies to state and local government.
That was somewhat unrelated, and now to the more important question....


If it applies on the federal level, then it most certainly applies to a State and Local level, as Federal law trumps State and Local law. Of course nobody up there is going to intervene unless someone says something, but there is a solid reason why the topmost amendment is the most important.
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