Forums → WEPR → Communism and Capitalism
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I wanted to open up this topic again...
Hopefully I will get some thoughtful responses :-$
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I think most people have the wrong view of communism.
The "equal pay" and the "you cant achieve anything" are not much to say. One whole thing of communists want to change is taking away the attention of people away from money. People are not born greedy. It is rather that we try to achieve. Who is to say people are born wanting to get more and more money? We just try to achieve goals. Look at Armorgames. The community here does not get anything over another, yet we are working our asses off trying to get AP. What we call greed comes from the process of people getting money, which usually involves "bad" behavior (The business world is cruel). Bill Gates, however rich, is not greedy.
Capitalism is like taking all of a persons freedoms away at birth and selling it to them when they can afford it it. You cant live without money. You rely on others for earning this money, but those who give it to you dont care of you. Employees are just concerned with getting their profit off you. The problem is, the road to getting a good job, housing, medical care, insurances, etc, are very though and cricket. There is no system for it. This is the freedom you supposedly have in capitalism! You are free to build your own road to happiness. Its like letting a baby do whatever he wants when it cant support itself. The mother should take of it. There is no system to get you settled. What communism does is create this system. No its not taking your freedom away, it is helping you by providing free education, health care, housing...
Its sad to see people say communists are evil, lol. Don't worry, we touch the existing evil with gloves on, it does not contaminate us.
- 127 Replies
We would be better off in the stone age. A mix of modern and the stone age, actually. This being that we keep out scientific knowledge but not the crap products we have.
How are all products "crap," if people buy them they most likely use them. You make vague generalization that don't really apply as you base them off of specific examples. And saying we should be in the Stone-Age scares me, it sounds a lot like Anthem.
They teach laziness.
Not if you have to work for them, which you do in capitalism, compared to communism where they are just handed too you.
In communism, you would progress these fields more and a lot slower on these products.
But you need the products to pay for the experiments, test them, and apply them. A communist state dividing goods between the people will be unable to finance experiments.
I render those products useless.
Haha, you can't do that alone. Are you going to lead a Butlerian Jihad against them? Ooo, Dune reference, hahaha.
And if you educated everyone of what communism really is, there would be ton of motivation because then would they know the system is far and was the best for everyone. I believe previous communist states failed to do this. They used aggression.
And lying to people about communism isn't aggression?
Well considering we. Lived very well 60 years ago without these thing.
Capitals make these products and sell them. People buy because they think its all so cool. Truth is, the excitment of having that new iPod goes away once it blends into your life l, this cH be short as a few days.
This is what I meant by products being "attractive". Its all a lie to make you buy things.
We could of always lived on those toy trucks. And and yes it does teach laziness because some pruducts so make things easier. But really once u get used to it, its the same thing.
And I done litterly mean go back to he stone age!
@Total,
Communism is the next step to socialism.
Once capitalism is abolished, socialism takes place.
Socialism includes a state to ensure no anti-revolutionaries, crimes, etc. At this point, things are rough as people are not so happy.
Marx believes once things are settled, the state would whither away as there would be no crimes and the society could be run democratically. So basically, the difference is that at the stage of communism there is no state. Law is still enforced though, of course ^^
Sorry for the triple, but I must say this.
Communism fails not because the system is flawed but because people do not cooperate! Not because they are greedy, but because they think its a evil government which is going to ruin them. I mean the whole things started after a huge civil war. I mean the problem comes from everyone who was not a revolutionary. And things get worse when they use aggression to keep calm.
Thats why its important to first educate the people of what the goal is. I believe this would make a big difference.
Really, I think its quite lame to say people are too greedy for communism to work.
The new leaders of this new socialist nation is what disturbs me. We need a real leader who knows what his doing.
@Drace
Again, you are proving that Communism cannot work. Communism requires 100% cooperation by everyone. Once a small sliver of the population revolts, the whole system collapses and fails, or must be put down with brutal force. Not one single political issue in history has had 100% loyalty and support. So how could Communism ever work?
Yes, it needs total support. Once the society moves to Communism it is a classless and stateless society. No government. No way to enforce laws. What happens when someone tries to change the system? There is nothing there to stop them.
You are misunderstanding, there Are laws, and there are ways to enforce them. Being a cop is a career like any other. By demolishing the state, you don't get rid of all systems that make society work.
So what happens if the cops start to rebel against the system? What if people vote to bring back a government? Again, you have to go back to violence to keep the society the way it is.
Cops and the military are what makes the state strong.
I can ask that question in any form of government. If these cops and the military resist to fight, what happens? The state is weakened.
If you keep the people happy, that does not happen my friend.
So Communism keeps people happy forever and ever? Again, you are living in a fantasy. No system will ever make everyone happy. What happens when there is a rebellion to the way things are?
Once true communism is established people will be happy. The chances of a rebellion will actualy be lower then in the current state.
Also,everyone has hands and feet to fight the rebellions. You don't have to dress people up in military outfits. If the rebillion gets big enough, it will turn into a civil war. like the North vs South Korea
How can you tell me that people will be happy? It's just more fantasy.
How can one NOT be happy in a true communist state? Its total freedom.
The problem is rather reaching the communist state.
No it's not freedom to me. I want control of my money. I would not be happy there.
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