Forums → WEPR → [redirected]If God created all things
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Here is something to get the brain going. It's been said that God created ALL things. Also it's been said that God is 100 precent pure/good. So God created man and it was said that because of man's sinful actions bad/evil things were created. But if God created ALL things then God created bad/evil things, not man. So by God creating bad/evil things this does not make him 100 precent pure/good.
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This doesn't prove God's existance. It only proves that you can't argue that there is no God.
You're right, NoName. You can neither prove nor disprove God's existence - at least not with certainty. But it's not up to the atheist to argue against every little thing people decide exists. We can just go around positing entities and then making people argue they don't exist.
This is exactly the same line of argumentation used when talking about the Flying Spaghetti Monster or whatever.
And I would also say you absolutely can argue there is no god. Again, it might not be a purely deductive argument, but there are some amazing arguments against the existence of any god. And some arguments against a western God that are about as close to knock-down as you can get.
And I would also say you absolutely can argue there is no god. Again, it might not be a purely deductive argument, but there are some amazing arguments against the existence of any god. And some arguments against a western God that are about as close to knock-down as you can get.
The only evidence against God's existance, in my opinion, is lack of evidence of God, which is all the evidence that should be needed to disprove in his existance. If you explain that there is no proof of God's existance, and someone else says that he works behind the scenes, there's no point to continue on because it's impossible to argue that point. If that person tries to present proof, then you can debate it.
It basicaly falls down to this.
When you ask someone to prove that God exists, they either:
1.Present you with "roof" which can be argued and debated.
or
2. Explain that God works behind the scenes and can't be proven, which is impossible to debate. - This is the stuff I find pointless to debate about because it goes in circles
2. Explain that God works behind the scenes and can't be proven, which is impossible to debate. - This is the stuff I find pointless to debate about because it goes in circles
We can then ask how they know this which is something we can debate.
This one is going to sound ridiculous... so ridiculous, in fact, that I bet you will not be able to restrain yourself from posting how ridiculous this next answer sounds.
We can then ask how they know this which is something we can debate.
We call it "faith". Faith is when you believe in God, even when you don't understand something. How can you believe that God existed before time? You believe it using faith. How can you believe in God despite there being no solid evidence outside the bible. Faith.
So now the word of God is temporary? People can pick and choose what rules to follow now?
I meant it could've been a command in the Old testament. in a story... you probably wouldn't understand so do assume things. Please.
Woah. I go to bed and 8 pages great me in the morning.
@Big Bang:
Get this. Some guys with a lot of spare time worked out the proability of the big bang. They then worked out the proability of other things, and this is the one that is of the same level of proability of the big bang:
If an F5 Tornado randomly ripped through a junk yard, making parts of scraps and wires fly through the air, then it could comepleatly and randomly build a 747 Jumbo Jet, with ever wire and rivet in place, chairs covered in upholstery, and fuel in the tanks.
You could then follow up and take off, right out of the junkyard with no problem, and land safly somewhere else.
This is the same level of chanse the big bang is on.
And people actually take that as a fact o_0
SIDE NOTE: I can find the name of the book this was in if you really want me to.
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Pardon my spelling. Although english is my first language, I'm hoplessly lost at it.
umm, how the heck do they figure out the odds of either one?
And that would be SO cool.
umm, how the heck do they figure out the odds of either one?
I guessing math, lots and lots and lots and lots of math.
I don't care if people believe in God, but don't follow the bible too closely. It has things in it such as "If a man marries a women who has had sex before him, she must be stoned to death."
Spread kindness and understanding before God.So now the word of God is temporary? People can pick and choose what rules to follow now?
I meant it could've been a command in the Old testament. in a story... you probably wouldn't understand so do assume things. Please.
The Torah, to my knowledge, is composed of the first five books of the Bible, what is called by Christians as the book of Law. Or, the Law of Moses. I'll refer to is as The Law for this post.
I'll start by referring to a "council meeting" in Jerusalem (see Acts 15), when Paul, accompanied by some others,(verse 2, skip to verse 4)... "they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders... verse 5: (some present were)...the Pharisees stood up and said, "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses."
...after discussing this, (verse 7), Peter...said,"Brothers, you know that some time ago GOD made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe.
(verse 8) GOD, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. He made no destinction between us and them, for He purified their hearts by faith."
It goes on to say that God sent His Son, Jesus because we, as human beings, couldn't obey the laws of Moses,(see Exodus- Deuteronomy).
Deuteronomy 22:23 talks about the right of stoning. See Matthew 1:18-25 for the story of Joseph and Mary's egagement, her pregnancy, Joseph's decision to divorce her,(and then the elders could have had her stoned), and the angel appearing to Joseph...
[quote]We call it "faith". Faith is when you believe in God, even when you don't understand something. How can you believe that God existed before time? You believe it using faith. How can you believe in God despite there being no solid evidence outside the bible. Faith.
I totally agree.
[quote]umm, how the heck do they figure out the odds of either one?
I guessing math, lots and lots and lots and lots of math.[/quote]
Thus why I said they must of had lot of spare time =P
Here is something to get the brain going. It's been said that God created ALL things. Also it's been said that God is 100 precent pure/good. So God created man and it was said that because of man's sinful actions bad/evil things were created. But if God created ALL things then God created bad/evil things, not man. So by God creating bad/evil things this does not make him 100 precent pure/good.
That makes perfect sense and its a great argument. Personally Im atheist I believe when its done its done there is no afterlife. Also if you read the bible dosent it sound like a fantasy book? None of it sounds real it all sounds made up. Nothing like that has ever happened in history. Also if "god" is real and hes "ultimate" why dosent he just kill satan and be done with sin if he hates it so much.
(Also if you read the bible dosent it sound like a fantasy book?)
How much of the bible have read .The Bible is very serious, "And there were noises and thunderings and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such a mighty and great earthquake as had not occurred since men were on the earth.
Revelation 16:18
when i think of fantasy books I think of fairys and unicorns,but when i think of the Bible i imagine a loving Savior
We call it "faith". Faith is when you believe in God, even when you don't understand something. How can you believe that God existed before time? You believe it using faith. How can you believe in God despite there being no solid evidence outside the bible. Faith.
Faith is believing something with out evidence. The only place that's ever considered acceptable is in religion. I don't think it should even been acceptable there so I would have to say that is up for debate in itself.
If an F5 Tornado randomly ripped through a junk yard, making parts of scraps and wires fly through the air, then it could comepleatly and randomly build a 747 Jumbo Jet, with ever wire and rivet in place, chairs covered in upholstery, and fuel in the tanks.
You could then follow up and take off, right out of the junkyard with no problem, and land safly somewhere else.
Your showing absolutely no understanding of what the Big Bang is here. I recommend you go read some peer review papers on the subject before trying to argue it again. So Fail.
I also find it interesting that I have heard this same lame argument to argue against evolution and here your using it applied to the Big Bang theory, I'm not sure if I should lol, face palm, or give you another fail here.
SIDE NOTE: I can find the name of the book this was in if you really want me to.
I can guarantee your book is a load of bull dookie.
when i think of fantasy books I think of fairys and unicorns,but when i think of the Bible i imagine a loving Savior
The Bible does have unicorns, dragons, demons, and giants does that count for fantasy?
Actually, I think you may be right. I think it was evolution that had the same proability.
I know exsacly what the Big Bang is. I can quote from memory the whole process (that I have learned, they might have added more/taken some away from the last time I studied up on it)
Once uppon a time, 2 parralell univerce cell thingys accidentally hit each other, causing a big boomy and making a new reality. Then some random black holes and dust showed up, and the black holes heated the dust into stars, instead of sucking them in for some reason. Then some of the dust turned into rocks and orbited the stars. Then a planet with life ended up happening, and another planet hit it, causeing that planet to have a moon, and eventually 500 billion years later humans poped up.
Thats what I know in a crash course, and I didn't get it from wiki either.
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Pardon my spelling, although english is my first language, I'm hoplessly lost at it.
That makes perfect sense and its a great argument. Personally Im atheist I believe when its done its done there is no afterlife. Also if you read the bible dosent it sound like a fantasy book? None of it sounds real it all sounds made up. Nothing like that has ever happened in history. Also if "god" is real and hes "ultimate" why dosent he just kill satan and be done with sin if he hates it so much.
How much of the bible have you read, hearing about the flood and turning water into wine is not the sole teaching of the bible. Also, if the author had read the bible he would have known that this is quite a horrible argument against God.
The Bible does have unicorns, dragons, demons, and giants does that count for fantasy?
Unicorns= Horses, Dragons= Dinosaurs, Demons= Satan and such, which os part of our religon and when the bible talks about giants it does not refer to 20 foot tall beasts, but more 7-8 feet tall men who got what they wanted through brute force.
Faith is believing something with out evidence. The only place that's ever considered acceptable is in religion. I don't think it should even been acceptable there so I would have to say that is up for debate in itself.
Faith is defined as, 'belief that is not based upon proof'
Your big bang is a theory. Just that, it has not been proven, and neither have God. You put faith in the big bang as much as we put faith in the bible.
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