Forums → WEPR → Mainstream Media Biased Against Israel?
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Well, it's happened again. Israel retaliates against Hamas and Palestinian militants for firing rockets into Israel, and then CNN, Fox, and BBC cover the story with headlines such as, Palestinians killed in Gaza air strikes, and Israeli air strike kills six Palestinians. No where on either of these sights do they mention that more than 50 rockets were fired into Israel.. First off, where is the international condemnation for these clear terrorist attacks against civilians? How come the U.N. hasn't issued a resolution declaring the attacks to be illegal? And why isn't this getting more news coverage than a retaliation strike?
There are clear cut examples of this every day in the international media. Every time a Palestinian is killed by Israelis, or a mosque is vandalized by settlers, the news jumps on it like it's WWIII. However, a rocket launched into Sderot? Nothing. Ashdod? Who cares? How about Beersheba? Nada. Obviously the plight of poor terrorists is more important that those of evil Israeli citizens.
Why is the media so against Israel? Discuss...and yes, I know. This will eventually turn into an argument about the legitimacy of Israel >.<
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I think everyone should see this.
rnhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDj1DIDGcpI&feature=results_main&laynext=1&list=PL758CA1951817592F
This is precisely why I do not use the Holocaust to justify Israel's existence. I only bring it up because nicho here blatantly disregarded the fact that the Holocaust ever occurred!
Again, and I quote:
No other nation has enacted such a complete oppression on an entire population of a people before.
If the IDF is in the wrong, it's because Hamas forces the IDF to respond to attacks against Israeli civilians. The IDF then targets the militants, and tries to minimize collateral damage. The opposite of Hamas.
1) Israel came first, which unbalanced the regional equilibrium. Hence, the IDF claiming they're not doing it first is rather illogical.
2) The IDF does try to minimize damage when they attack. I think I praised them for it.
3) What I do point out is that the IDF, even when it applies gentler tactics during battles, enacts a blockade that affects millions. That in itself is a slow strangling death.
Yes, Israel is wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, and sooooooo wrong.
I dare you to read those. You might learn something about the "heroes" of Palestine.
You know what? I think the Palestinians are lucky that Israel is even willing to negotiate with them...I sure as hell wouldn't after what they did to my countrymen.
1) Your examples are simple lists of massacres. I do have a list of Palestinian massacres too.
Here
Here
Here
Here
Around 50 more here.
2) So telling me I'm ''so wrong, so wrong'' does nothing to counter my argument that many of the originial Israelis were refugees fleeing to a land that was not theirs in the first place, and hence are at fault. So no, your argument via examples does nothing to address the point here.
I never use it as an excuse to permanently push off other people. However when you claim that no nation has ever committed such "atrocities" which you think Israel commits, I will bring up the Holocaust because you're plain wrong! And you never said any "contemporary nation now." You said, "No other nation..." Go ahead and disregard history if you want to though.
Again yes, apologies for saying ''no other nation'', my point was no contemporary nation. Also, given the video DSM has shown I see no reason why you have to harp on the Holocaust so much. Yes, I made a history mistake, but so? How does it affect my argument? Why do so many Israelis like to bring up the fact that the Holocaust justifies what they can do now?
Wow. You're starting to sound like some of the neo-Nazis I've met...but moving on. If you want to play the cause and effect game, then let's play! How about we don't blame the U.N. Let's blame...Hitler! Yeah, that's a good idea. He started the Holocaust, right? Wait...what led to his anti-Semitism? Oh right...the Treaty of Versailles. So let's blame that. But wait! If we're blaming the Treaty of Versailles, let's blame WWI!!!!!
You really wanna play cause and effect?
Well, then can we blame the first atom for everything? Cause and effect is valid, provided it does pertain directly to the question at hand. Does the Treaty of Versailles, a treaty which promulgated Germany's downfall, and was just one of the reasons angering Hitler a direct cause of the Jewish disaster? No. But Jewish leaders who directly carried out an active terrorist campaign against Britain and the Arabs did push Britain to pull out and hand the reigns to America.
Also, pulling an ad hominem during a debate is kind of stupid; such as assuming that I'm all Neo-Nazi. Do I smell the race and hate card here?
Yes, because Hamas is soooooooo good at keeping peace. You think that the word "truce" would have a meaning to them. I guess terrorists don't like playing by the rules.
I don't know if you actually know but the PIJ mentioned in the article is not Hamas. There have been numerous truces where Hamas which such truces are signed with, has actually kept to the peace but other smaller groups. In fact Hamas has arrested such violators of truce.
I never said the WB was their sovereign territory. I said East Jerusalem was.
1) The WB construction is in itself a violation.
2) EJ is never and has never been legal sovereign territory of Israel; the Jordanians annexed it from the Palestinians, after which Israel did. Ergo, no legal basis.
Then you should be against any war. Or at least the invading army. In any war, millions are put into stress. Just because it's Israel vs. Palestine doesn't make it anything special.
It is special, because it is one of the only contemporary examples of entire nations of peoples being oppressed, and one of the only contemporary examples where the legal basis has clearly been in favour of the victims so blatantly.
As for my general stance on war, I have never exactly reiterated it here, so why are you spinning an argument out of something non-existent? Also, just because it seems like nothing ''special'' doesn
t mean it isn't important.
Israel came first, which unbalanced the regional equilibrium. Hence, the IDF claiming they're not doing it first is rather illogical.
Every single time there is a truce, it's like someone presses the "reset" button on the violence. Whoever then breaks said truce, is therefore directly responsible for the violence that follows. Each time there is a truce, Israel does not attack. They hold their fire. Only AFTER rockets are launched from Gaza, does Israel respond.
The IDF does try to minimize damage when they attack. I think I praised them for it.
Not yet...
What I do point out is that the IDF, even when it applies gentler tactics during battles, enacts a blockade that affects millions. That in itself is a slow strangling death.
The noose can easily be cut by Hamas. All they need to do is lay down their rockets against Israel.
Here
First one is wrong. See paragraph 3
Here
Officials recommended that the units responsible be placed on trial. Unfortunately, the recommendation was never followed through on.
Here
It's hard to tell if a massacre occurred here due to the thick layer of BS placed on top by the Palestinians
Here
Only crime committed was in Lydda. Other civilians were bussed out and then the town was taken also to prevent an Arab League advance. A valid military strategy.
Around 50 more here.
Not going to address these, as I'm sure that some have faults, I just don't have time to go through them all.
Also, given the video DSM has shown I see no reason why you have to harp on the Holocaust so much.
I don't. I only brought it up because of your previous statement. Thank you for retracting it though.
No. But Jewish leaders who directly carried out an active terrorist campaign against Britain and the Arabs did push Britain to pull out and hand the reigns to America.
Again, see my first point. Cause-and-effect is basically reset once a truce has been reached.
Also, pulling an ad hominem during a debate is kind of stupid; such as assuming that I'm all Neo-Nazi. Do I smell the race and hate card here?
Never accused you of actually being a Neo-Nazi. I simply said you were beginning to sound like one. Sorry if there was any offense.
There have been numerous truces where Hamas which such truces are signed with, has actually kept to the peace but other smaller groups. In fact Hamas has arrested such violators of truce.
Hamas is the controlling force in the GS, therefore it must control any "exports." Israel has repeatedly stated that Hamas is responsible for all terrorist activity inside the Gaza Strip.
Every single time there is a truce, it's like someone presses the "reset" button on the violence. Whoever then breaks said truce, is therefore directly responsible for the violence that follows. Each time there is a truce, Israel does not attack. They hold their fire. Only AFTER rockets are launched from Gaza, does Israel respond.
Well, considering the actual root source of the problem is Israel existing on land it shouldn't, ever since the UN partition, yes it is Israel at fault.
The noose can easily be cut by Hamas. All they need to do is lay down their rockets against Israel.
Yet when Hamas does go for a truce, Israel continues to build settlements, and in doing so, drive out more and more Palestinians. They don't seem to cease building, even during ''truces''.
Officials recommended that the units responsible be placed on trial. Unfortunately, the recommendation was never followed through on.
And so? Does that make them blameless? No.
Not yet...
Did. Read clearly.
First one is wrong. See paragraph 3
Then scratch that and blame my research. Nonetheless, one mistake does not alleviate anything; there has been numerous documentaries of other massacres.
It's hard to tell if a massacre occurred here due to the thick layer of BS placed on top by the Palestinians
The Jewish Agency of Israel themselves issued an apology to the King of Jordan. Furthermore, several former leaders of the Haganah demanded that the pamphlet stating the massacre to be false, be withdrawn on account of its inaccuracy. You don't get more authoritative then that. Given that even the leaders of the massacre denied such propaganda as false shows and even reinforces the truth.
Only crime committed was in Lydda. Other civilians were bussed out and then the town was taken also to prevent an Arab League advance. A valid military strategy.
Yitzhak Rabin issued an order to the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) stating, '' The inhabitants of Lydda must be expelled quickly without attention to age''. It might seem a ''military strategy'' to you, but the Geneva Accords does clearly state that civilians should not suffer in the line of fire. This is a clear violation of that.
Again, see my first point. Cause-and-effect is basically reset once a truce has been reached.
Those are trigger causes of small clashes. The big underlying cause, the canker that eats into the bud of the whole issue and sixty years of constant warfare, still lies on the insistence of Jews to dump loads of their people illegally, and claim it as their land based on airy fairy historical reasons.
Hamas is the controlling force in the GS, therefore it must control any "exports." Israel has repeatedly stated that Hamas is responsible for all terrorist activity inside the Gaza Strip.
Which it has committed efforts to enforce. Hamas is not the sole authority in the fragmented territory; and have been in conflict with a few PLA groups themselves. Blaming Hamas as a whole is fruitless, given that smaller allied groups do go rogue.
And so? Does that make them blameless? No.
Never said it did. However, at least Israel (tries to) prosecute those who kill civilians, instead of glorifying them and naming streets after them.
Furthermore, several former leaders of the Haganah demanded that the pamphlet stating the massacre to be false, be withdrawn on account of its inaccuracy.
The article doesn't say what the pamphlet was inaccurate about. It could easily have been a misrepresentation of casualties on the Israeli side, or another error akin to that. However, if you read the paragraph above, you'll see that Arabs denied any massacre, ****, and other such. ALSO, the gross exaggeration by the Arabs directly led to mass migration by the Palestinians from Israel.
Then scratch that and blame my research. Nonetheless, one mistake does not alleviate anything; there has been numerous documentaries of other massacres.
By both sides. Neither of us will "win" (although this debate will probably once again come to a stalemate) on the basis of who massacred who more times. We can agree that atrocities and war crimes have been committed on each side, just not the magnitude and number of times.
The big underlying cause, the canker that eats into the bud of the whole issue and sixty years of constant warfare, still lies on the insistence of Jews to dump loads of their people illegally, and claim it as their land based on airy fairy historical reasons.
Again, starting to sound like a conspiracy theorist. Have you ever read "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion?" Your sentence, "...still lies on the insistence of Jews to dump loads of their people illegally..." sounds like it could be directly from this book, which basically outlines a global "Jewish conspiracy."
Very much so, theyre biased against anything good pretty much. At least by a Christians standards.
Never said it did. However, at least Israel (tries to) prosecute those who kill civilians, instead of glorifying them and naming streets after them.
No, in fact many of the fighters who committed offences in 1948 were ordered to do so by their own commanders.
The article doesn't say what the pamphlet was inaccurate about. It could easily have been a misrepresentation of casualties on the Israeli side, or another error akin to that. However, if you read the paragraph above, you'll see that Arabs denied any massacre, ****, and other such. ALSO, the gross exaggeration by the Arabs directly led to mass migration by the Palestinians from Israel.
Yet, Israeli officers no less are witness to this. Eliahu Arbel arrived at the scene April 10. He was an Operations Officer B of the Haganah's Etzioni Brigade. He reported:-
''I saw the horrors that the fighters had created. I saw bodies of women and children, who were murdered in their houses in cold blood by gunfire, with no signs of battle and not as the result of blowing up the houses. From my experience I know well, that there is no war without killing, and that not only combatants get killed. I have seen a great deal of war, but I never saw a sight like Deir Yassin.''
And yet again, Israeli officers and soldiers in your video that claims it was all a ''mock up'' acknowledged that they threw grenades into houses to flush militants out, regardless of whether there were families inside them.
So was it a massacre? Or did some Israeli officers have amnesia and cooked up lies, years after the whole thing to shoot themselves in the foot?
Again, starting to sound like a conspiracy theorist. Have you ever read "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion?" Your sentence, "...still lies on the insistence of Jews to dump loads of their people illegally..." sounds like it could be directly from this book, which basically outlines a global "Jewish conspiracy."
First off, simply calling it a conspiracy with no evidence is incredibly skewed. Secondly, a conspiracy theory explains an event as being the result of an alleged plot by a covert group or organization or, more broadly, the idea that important political, social or economic events are the products of secret plots that are largely unknown to the general public. This is wholly not a conspiracy. Everyone knew what the Zionist leaders wanted after the war, especially after the King David Hotel bombings.
No, in fact many of the fighters who committed offences in 1948 were ordered to do so by their own commanders.
I'm not talking about when fighting for independence. I'm talking about from after Israel became a nation, to modern day times. They actually take their soldiers to court for killing civilians, unlike Hamas.
So was it a massacre? Or did some Israeli officers have amnesia and cooked up lies, years after the whole thing to shoot themselves in the foot?
So are you going to disregard eyewitness accounts that there was no massacre?
As much as I'd absolutely love to keep debating this issue, I'm afraid that I will be taking a 3 week leave-of-absence from Armor Games, as I will be traveling internationally. If this thread has any more posts, I will respond to them when I return.
I'm not talking about when fighting for independence. I'm talking about from after Israel became a nation, to modern day times. They actually take their soldiers to court for killing civilians, unlike Hamas.
Sure, they all are punished....Just as Hamas arrests only some people for breaking the truce, the IDF only court-marshals and charges a few, ''selectively''.
So are you going to disregard eyewitness accounts that there was no massacre?
And you will disregard evidence from the IDF soldiers themselves? There certainly was contradictory evidence from the Palestinians, and the numbers killed were certainly exaggerated. But even lower estimates by IDF soldiers put the casualties in the 100+ range, and many of them civilians. Of the things that we can confirm, was that the village had signed agreements with nearby Jewish settlements not to attack each other; but paramilitary Israeli forces disregarded the peace in the area, and attacked it, a village with no strategic or tactical value whatsoever; pointing the reason for the attack on gross abuse and psychological warfare, themselves, already crimes, even if massacres never happened, which almost certainly did.
so you say that we need to let them kill us? do what we did in the last 2000 years, hope to get to 'jerusalem' {even that we dont have anything with jerusalem, we just trolled the arabs, to "get them mad" right?}
and that no warlord will decide to blame us for anything?
you know, in the start, when we talked about politics, i was ok with that.
when we talked about what my nation {or by you, the IDF} is doing, it was a little annoying, when you supposedly what happene in my country better than i do.
but now, when you say that my country is wrong, and i need to live as as a minority in somewher else, just becasue the arabs want this and this and this and this, so, go to hell. i dont care anymore what go out of your hating mouth. i know that if you will hear that the eygiptean army attacking Israel you will have joy in your heart "the good arabs who want democracy and freedom driving away the evil mindwashed dicators jews".
so yea, you have 1000 queue and "witness" who claim to see my friends killing a village for fun. who say to people like you that my father, a tank commander in the first lebanon war run over houses full of childrens jsut to kill tham, because that what my evil warlord told him.
you say that my family members, who are 'settlers', that even that i am agaisnt almost anythink that i belive in, are cold blooded murdurers. that they do drive-bys on random palestinians {orphans handicapes who love unicorns}, again for fun.
so no, we are not the wild west here. and no nazi germany. in fact, i never saw in this crazy world any place that Critic a military oppertion for hurting a man from the enemy side. that get attacked for seven years. seven years, in which i never saw you giving a word about what happen. whould you live in a place, in a knowledge that any minute your "neighbors" will shoot rocket on your house? when peopel affraid to Hitch a ride because someone may try to kiddnape them? wher, in a time that passed, any minute your bus, teh resturant you sit im, can blow up by a meniac who want 72 vergens in heaven?
in a place, wher in the age of 18 you recruit to the army, to serve in gazza, in the west bank?
no. you prefer to sit near your computer ant critic us for any squeek we do.
suicide bomb? hah, they started. a bunch of terrorist entered a house, killed 6 peoples, 4 of them little childrens, in the age of 2, 5 and 6? they deserved it. a lao missle was shot on a kids bus? "waht israel did first?".
now, when you, Even if in an indirectly way said that its ok for them to kill Israeli people, i am not gonna keep talking to you.
i tried and tried to make you see that the evil Israelis are people. that we, or as you say "the IDF", are people. but you still look at us as a superior. "if i was an Israeli, i would never make any mistake. i would clear the settlers {how? a dictatorships ways?} i will make peace to the arabs {by giving them Israel} and let anyone who want hit us, because we started".
so sorry my master, but lets bet, that you will be like the one who fled to tel-aviv when Cast Lead oppretion was on {yea, when rocket droped in the village near me, beer-tuvia, behind a house of a friend of mine}.
and sure, if singapor was in our place, you would kill no one, just the very specific person who shoot. no no, you wull arest him in a democratic way, let his organizeison buy wepones {it not democratic to stop them} and let them get cover in kindergardens {its not democratic to shot ther}.
i will defend democracy in Israel to death {yea, we do have one}, but, in war aginst terrorisem you dont start your bull****.
i sure that if you lived in 1939, you were one of the people who will say "its not democratic to Embargo germany". one who will sya "its awful what our soliders do in the battlefield".
its so obviuse. you, as a people, never had the spirit of a patriotic war. of giving blood to your country. for you, a country is just the office who give you a driving liecnsce. for me, its the thing that keem my homeland safe. its the thing that let me know, that no one can hurt me. not like my grandfather, who had to leave his family {his mother sent him away, saying "its ok, the neigbors love me, they wont harm me"}, who hed to flee all over europe from czech, to italy to Israel. and im glad he did it. some fled to USA, some to south america. he decided to make the hard choise, and went to Israel. he built the place i live in, moshav orot. and the father amd mother of my grand mother built the 'capital' of my Regional Council, beer-tuvia.
the first "outside" jews who came here, dreamd to rebuild Israel. when they came, it was a wasteland, some people who were known as 'falah'. they spoke arabic, but were not fully arabic. only after Israel was started to built in, immigrents from all over the arabic world start to came. and sorry to tell you, Israel was always part of teh jewish peopels. what other jerusalem we speak in every hanuka, when we used to pray "for next year in the built jerusalem"? to the one in USA? i dont think so.
in my father side, i am the 15 Generation in Israel. after the The expulsion from Spain. but they should have stay ther, to not provoke the arabs?
if anyone that dont know me will see this, he might think that i am a right winger. but when i argue with people from Israel, i am a left winger. i do know that ther were some mistakes. i do know taht not anything is perfect. the hitting of the danish protester was horrible. but i dont have to give exmple to prove anything. but, when i talk to someone like you, i am teh most patriotic person you will ever see.
i am tierd of arguing with you. its always a queue qqueue argueing, and you keep poping up things that just get me mad.
for an exmple, castner. you called him a liar. i wanted to curse you for that. dontt ever call him that way again. he saved 3000 jews from dieing by the nazi, and even more. my grandfater uncle, may he rest in peace, was saved by his famos train. he told me how it was. i recored it, and 2 mounths later he died. i am the first person {exept his wife} that he speak with about what happened to him in the holocausto. and i can say that i trust him.
but, for the last thing, you do belive that if the hamas wont want the "diffrune and comepletly other" organizetion" from shooting, he wont be able to? give me a break. you are acting like they are good peoples. yes, i said it. i think that the hamas are bad. woooa!
i am not a racist man, i am a comepltly beliver of freedome to everyone, but like a jail dont give everyone freedome as said in teh Constitution, so does a enemy state. tehy are almost a comepletly diffrunte state. sure, there are yet people in the right wing that are against it, but they are almost free. so they shoot at us. do you realy belive that they just want to transport medicen???
its like saying that a known drug smugglet is undemocraticly not allowd to bring suveniers from mexico. that in WWII teh british, undemocratly, blockaded germany. these evil british!
i can assure you that when hamas and the palestinians will stop shot at us, we will stop the blockade. just yesterday we cought an ambolance, that in it were 200,000 dollars. i guese they vulenteerd in the red sarccen. and dont even try to say that we faked it. pleaese. when the army do less than that, people get fierd or thrown to jail.
now i see your link. dir yassin? are you a real idiot? it was in 1948, when a etzel battalion attacked it. i am not sure if you know it, but in a civil war, let me tell you a secret, every village is a stratigic target. becasue peopels from ther. yes, from ther, went to kill jewish people in other places. thats how civil war goes. it happened in spain, its happen here too. do you know the history of the spanish civil war? villgaes were seperate by franco'ists and by republicans, later even by communist and democratics and anerchists. and i am sure no one say "these bad republicans attacked an innocente franco village. you are so naive and Innocent taht its amazine. did you ever saw blood in your life?
i will die for Israel. whould you for singapor?
and if so, against who?
so you say that we need to let them kill us? do what we did in the last 2000 years, hope to get to 'jerusalem' {even that we dont have anything with jerusalem, we just trolled the arabs, to "get them mad" right?}
and that no warlord will decide to blame us for anything?
I don't think you've actually been reading anything of what I said. I have not disagreed unnecessarily with what the IDF does when they fight battles; what I do condemn is the blockade, the prevention of supplies to the populace and the rest. By all means, go after the Hamas fighters, and kill the fighters who kill your civilians.
But if you're going to tell the rest of the world that the Arabs are oppressing you, when in fact Israel is the one oppressing the Palestinian soldiers, then you obviously aren't reading a wide range of news.
but now, when you say that my country is wrong, and i need to live as as a minority in somewher else, just becasue the arabs want this and this and this and this, so, go to hell. i dont care anymore what go out of your hating mouth. i know that if you will hear that the eygiptean army attacking Israel you will have joy in your heart "the good arabs who want democracy and freedom driving away the evil mindwashed dicators jews".
so yea, you have 1000 queue and "witness" who claim to see my friends killing a village for fun. who say to people like you that my father, a tank commander in the first lebanon war run over houses full of childrens jsut to kill tham, because that what my evil warlord told him.
you say that my family members, who are 'settlers', that even that i am agaisnt almost anythink that i belive in, are cold blooded murdurers. that they do drive-bys on random palestinians {orphans handicapes who love unicorns}, again for fun.
I am going to repeat this very slowly, because obviously you have not read through my posts carefully in your hate filled rage.
1) I oppose the Israeli Constituition being defined as based on Jewishness. Why? Because this is not democratic. Simple, and fair.
2) That is, I am NOT claiming that the Jews have to be eradicated, or scattered, or oppressed. I have no idea which part of your butthole you pulled out the whole ''live in minority somewhere'' idea.
3) This definition based on Judaism is undemocratic, and goes against the message Israel wants to send to the world, that they are for fair treatment. Of course they treat their own Arab Israeli citizens fairly and don't discriminate, but by defining a country via one race is certainly NOT democratic.
and sure, if singapor was in our place, you would kill no one, just the very specific person who shoot. no no, you wull arest him in a democratic way, let his organizeison buy wepones {it not democratic to stop them} and let them get cover in kindergardens {its not democratic to shot ther}.
i will defend democracy in Israel to death {yea, we do have one}, but, in war aginst terrorisem you dont start your bull****.
Hey, I never said you can't shoot the fighters. What I did say, is that the IDF does perpetuate oppression against normal citizens, and that is an abhorrence.
And of course we shoot terrorists. We shot a couple of Pakistani militants when they hijacked Singapore Airlines Flight 117 in 1991.
i sure that if you lived in 1939, you were one of the people who will say "its not democratic to Embargo germany". one who will sya "its awful what our soliders do in the battlefield".
its so obviuse. you, as a people, never had the spirit of a patriotic war. of giving blood to your country. for you, a country is just the office who give you a driving liecnsce. for me, its the thing that keem my homeland safe. its the thing that let me know, that no one can hurt me. not like my grandfather, who had to leave his family {his mother sent him away, saying "its ok, the neigbors love me, they wont harm me"}, who hed to flee all over europe from czech, to italy to Israel. and im glad he did it. some fled to USA, some to south america. he decided to make the hard choise, and went to Israel. he built the place i live in, moshav orot. and the father amd mother of my grand mother built the 'capital' of my Regional Council, beer-tuvia.
Don't know if you actually heard it, but we have had a mini-Holocaust here. The Japanese randomly picked out the Chinese males, and shot them. Go Google Sook Ching, and read about it.
You're not the only race that actually suffered genocide. In fact, I live a few kilometres away from one of the more recent mass graves of bones that was dug up. My grandparents were taken as slaves by the Japanese, and they lived through daily fear of ****, decapitation, beating, and extortion. And as much as we are Singaporeans, I'm Chinese too, and the millions of systematic deaths such as the massacres at Nanking, and the biological experiments on the Chinese people infuriate me. You're not the only oppressed race on the planet; others have had been slaughtered like animals just for our skin colour. So don't tell me that we Singaporeans and Chinese don't know what oppression is.
the first "outside" jews who came here, dreamd to rebuild Israel. when they came, it was a wasteland, some people who were known as 'falah'. they spoke arabic, but were not fully arabic. only after Israel was started to built in, immigrents from all over the arabic world start to came. and sorry to tell you, Israel was always part of teh jewish peopels. what other jerusalem we speak in every hanuka, when we used to pray "for next year in the built jerusalem"? to the one in USA? i dont think so.
in my father side, i am the 15 Generation in Israel. after the The expulsion from Spain. but they should have stay ther, to not provoke the arabs?
Again if you kindly read clearly instead of just outright excoriating my posts in such an non-intellectual way, you would realise I have no problems with Jews who have been there for generations. They own the land, they keep the land. What I have a problem with, is the fact that most of the Jews today are descended from Jewish refugees who just came in waves in the immediate waves post-WWII and claimed it as theirs. That is wholly unfair to the Arabs already living there.
the first "outside" jews who came here, dreamd to rebuild Israel. when they came, it was a wasteland, some people who were known as 'falah'. they spoke arabic, but were not fully arabic. only after Israel was started to built in, immigrents from all over the arabic world start to came. and sorry to tell you, Israel was always part of teh jewish peopels. what other jerusalem we speak in every hanuka, when we used to pray "for next year in the built jerusalem"? to the one in USA? i dont think so.
It was not a ''wasteland'', there was already a Palestinian majority with a Jewish minority living there when the refugees came.
for an exmple, castner. you called him a liar. i wanted to curse you for that. dontt ever call him that way again. he saved 3000 jews from dieing by the nazi, and even more. my grandfater uncle, may he rest in peace, was saved by his famos train. he told me how it was. i recored it, and 2 mounths later he died. i am the first person {exept his wife} that he speak with about what happened to him in the holocausto. and i can say that i trust him.
Then go on and be petulant and curse me. I don't actually think I called him a liar, and the only time I mentioned him was a long time ago; I have completely forgotten what I said of him, unless you bring up the link.
but, for the last thing, you do belive that if the hamas wont want the "diffrune and comepletly other" organizetion" from shooting, he wont be able to? give me a break. you are acting like they are good peoples. yes, i said it. i think that the hamas are bad. woooa!
You think they're bad, I think they're methods are bad, ruthless, but they carry the same message that most Palestinians want to hear, and believe; that Israel is the current oppressor. You're perfectly allowed to think they're bad, but likelise, I am perfectly within my rights to have my own opinions, instead of you shoving them down my throat.
i am not a racist man, i am a comepltly beliver of freedome to everyone, but like a jail dont give everyone freedome as said in teh Constitution, so does a enemy state. tehy are almost a comepletly diffrunte state. sure, there are yet people in the right wing that are against it, but they are almost free. so they shoot at us. do you realy belive that they just want to transport medicen???
its like saying that a known drug smugglet is undemocraticly not allowd to bring suveniers from mexico. that in WWII teh british, undemocratly, blockaded germany. these evil british!
The Gaza flotilla does come to mind.
now i see your link. dir yassin? are you a real idiot? it was in 1948, when a etzel battalion attacked it. i am not sure if you know it, but in a civil war, let me tell you a secret, every village is a stratigic target. becasue peopels from ther. yes, from ther, went to kill jewish people in other places. thats how civil war goes. it happened in spain, its happen here too. do you know the history of the spanish civil war? villgaes were seperate by franco'ists and by republicans, later even by communist and democratics and anerchists. and i am sure no one say "these bad republicans attacked an innocente franco village. you are so naive and Innocent taht its amazine. did you ever saw blood in your life?
1) No citizen is supposed to die in war, given the Geneva Conventions. In such modern times, people and states try their utmost to stick to that.
2) I'm not sure what you understand is having ''strategic value'', but in military terms, having ''strategic value'' means possessing a key overall part to the long term goal. Yet the Israeli commanders themselves admit it was not because of strategic value that they attacked the village.
i am tierd of arguing with you. its always a queue qqueue argueing, and you keep poping up things that just get me mad.
Then stop, and leave. I am simply presenting the other side of the coin; and if you can't take it, you obviously should just stay in your own insular bubble. I don't aim to cause anyone anger, but if it distresses you so much, then stop coming to argue.
i will die for Israel. whould you for singapor?
Just went for my army callup and medical screening, and will begin at the end of the year. So while we're on the topic of martyrs, what else do you want to compare? The weapons? Army food? The army preparation courses I've been through already? Or are you just trying to act all macho, as if others don't do national service too?
So in conclusion, you have your own opinions, that's fine, I have my opinions, that's my business. But what I strongly encourage you to do, is actually read the opinions and posts of others properly before posting like a complete moron, and accusing others of something they have not said, whilst at the same time slamming others as ''hate-filled'' just because they disagree with your opinions.
In a nutshell, I have never claimed it was okay for Hamas to shoot people. I have never said Jews need to be terminated. I have never said Israel has to be broken up.
Wake up, read properly, perhaps get new glasses, and stop acting like a total jerk in an argument if you want to be taken seriously.
@Project_Jango , The last post here is from 2012...
Anyway, what about reporting who Hamas is? Reporting the fire that has been shot on Israel around 7 years without Israel responding?
When OP firstly asked this question he ment that the glibal media try to spuce things up yo sell you one more newspaper. 99 of the time its completley peacefull here in Israel and in Gaza and in the west bank. the problme is with College liberals who belive they know everything and that they are cool rebels and claim Israel is pure evil. Later on news, when the 1% of tine wher things happen, the news agencies portray it as "another arab killed" like it happen all the times. Peoples actualy belive that settlers kill arabs by the thousands every week and that tye IDF is doing a genocide.
Thats being biasd.
The entire area is a gigantic political mess not helped by the double whammy of self-righteous, intolerant, incompetent leaders on both sides. Eventually it will either bubble over into some kind of all out war or complete oppression of one side by the other. Any outside intervention will make it worse so it's better not to poke it. I'm not typically so pessimistic about such matters, but Israel is really past helping. It's no good debating whose fault it is (Although the answer is roughly along the lines of "everyone involved.", because that doesn't alter the inevitable, bloody end to the situation.
/thread
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