ForumsSupport ForumThoughts on Armor Points for Feedback

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Alric
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Alric
52 posts
Nomad

I understand the reasoning behind Armor Points, and I think it's a great idea from the AG side of the house. By rewarding people for rating and commenting on games, you expose players to more games than they would probably try on their own, as we all have a tendency to stay in our niches. And with as cool a system as AP is set up to be, you encourage loyalty to the site.

However, because you earn AP for leaving feedback on a game, there are pages and pages of one word or one sentence feedback, most of them just expressing the individual's opinion of the game. If you want people to know you think the game "sucks," then give it a low rating. Pages and pages of monosyllabic feedback discourage players from actually reading through any of it to find something useful. Especially in games that allow for multiple hours of gameplay, where reading a few useful tips or hints could help.

Or maybe you're having trouble with some technical aspect, and someone could offer help after reading your feedback. But when someone does ask for help or advice, it's usually buried by the asinine comments of 12-year-olds who "hate it" and only left feedback for the AP.

And in what way does the comment "okay" help the designer/programmer develop better games?

Again, I think the AP system is genius, but I think its application could be modified to provide a better environment for players and programmers alike.

Alric

  • 48 Replies
thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,821 posts
Farmer

Sorry for double-posting, but I've noticed that the word "asinine" has been our favorite word insofar.
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The thing that I think is important to remember is that seeing a barrage of one word comments on games like "stoopid" definitely would alienate some potential new users, and it would make it seem like every user here is crazier than the Houdini splicers from Bioshock...."We call ourselves....the Saturnine!"

Gantic
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Gantic
11,889 posts
King

Alright, I'll be more direct this time: Where is the evidence that these simple comments are the result of players wanting AP?

ulimitedpower
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ulimitedpower
1,735 posts
Nomad

the asinine comments of 12-year-olds who "hate it" and only left feedback for the AP.


Don't mention that in my face again.(With this post i will hit the 1600 line!!!)

And in what way does the comment "okay" help the designer/programmer develop better games?


I once suggested a filter, but people (for some reason) don't like it.

this is what the mods have been trying to deal with for a long time now


a quick glance at your profile reveals that you have been here for less than three months. 5 month old users are considered older users. So don't talk like one. And your post wasn't helping the topic except by making it longer. Yes, moderators are always digging up 5 year old spam posts from a user called 'I_joined_1960", and their new companions who were written 10 seconds ago. With the rate of spam we get every day, moderators would have to delete 100 posts every minute to keep up with them.

but why not simply stop awarding AP for Feedback?


You have suggested a very harsh topic: The facts go like this:

1. Yes, people abuse the Feedback by over flowing it with spam.
2. Luckily, spammers never get far because people who over do it get caught and (a)warned (b)banned or (c) their spam is deleted.
3. Without points for Feedback, a lot of people would leave and it would be a lot harder to make points. That isn't very good.

That would make sense now wouldn't it Alric? But then there would be a lack of attention to the site, and it would ultimately fall into darkness.


You have a point there. And armorgames must remain popular!!!
aaboydboyd
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aaboydboyd
28 posts
Nomad

If you stopped giving AP for comments, then everyone would stop going here. You should put up a filter that only allows comments that have at least 5 words or so.

Mobyduck
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Mobyduck
108 posts
Nomad

Adding a word filter wouldn't matter, the spams would go from "Nice" to "Really nice game man, wow!".
Removing AP from the feedback wouldn't drive people away from AG, only those that are AP additct, something that shouldn't be encouraged.

Lain
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Lain
176 posts
Nomad

I really don't think there's a way to avoid this porblem, except the way mods handle it now. The only other fix would be to add a more effiecient way to get AP, and then that would just get spammed even worse.

Gantic
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Gantic
11,889 posts
King

I realized how long the charts would actually take, so I stopped at 59 data points for Bowja the Ninja, since I've got other stuff I need to do in Excel.

Word Count vs. AP/Day

Armor Points vs. Length of Membership

This one is just to put things in perspective:
Word Count vs. Membership Length

Gantic
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Gantic
11,889 posts
King

Forgot to post this. X(

FOR WORD COUNT:
*Does not include smilies. Includes ratings if rating is part of a sentence. Includes filler words and repetitive words.

FOR LENGTH OF MEMBERSHIP:
**Calculated using day calculator

FOR AP PER DAY:
***AP/Day not adjusted for merits (There were several users with one or two merits.)

OTHER:
New users present outliers and may skew data.

Lain
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Lain
176 posts
Nomad

The strange thing, is, there is almost no trend in your data. Some of the people who have been members the longest or with the most AP seem just as liable to post crappy comments. Then, you have the people who joined yesterday, and are a wooden serf, but give a really intellectual comment. It seems there's no way to tell just by how experienced someone is if they're a spammer or not.

Lain
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Lain
176 posts
Nomad

Sorry for double post, but I hate it when people deliver biting comments about someone's spelling in an online forum. My spelling skills are unmatched in my entire grade, but my keyboard is terrible, so I frequently have typos.

Milos
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Milos
848 posts
Peasant

Getting 2 AP for a word or two is just too great temptation, and after rating it is the easiest way of acquiring AP. If you disable AP it would just reduce interest in commenting and take the fun out of whole points collecting concept.
Possibility of earning a merit should stimulate members to be more elaborate in their feedbacks. At least some of them.

Alric
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Alric
52 posts
Nomad

Alright, I'll be more direct this time: Where is the evidence that these simple comments are the result of players wanting AP?


You're right... there is no proof. I don't frequent other flash game sites, so I don't know if there is a comment box similar to AG's anywhere else, but I'd look for a site that has a comment box but no reward for using it, then look at the comments people leave. If there's no difference, then I'm obviously wrong and I'll shut up. See, I'm not complaining because it's "not fair" for users to earn points this way. I'm simply suggesting an idea that might improve the overall look of the site, as well as help developers continue to improve, which benefits us all.

Possibility of earning a merit should stimulate members to be more elaborate in their feedbacks. At least some of them.


The kind of AP junkie who spams the Feedback box wants his points and wants them now. He could spend half an hour writing a decent comment, or he could spend those thirty minutes rating and commenting on games he probably didn't spend more than a few minutes playing, if at all.

3. Without points for Feedback, a lot of people would leave and it would be a lot harder to make points.


If you stopped giving AP for comments, then everyone would stop going here.


People would leave if it were harder to earn AP? I call shenanigans. People would continue to use the site and would use whatever methods available to earn AP and the "rewards" and "status" that come with them.

Do you really think people tell their friends, "Hey, man, there's this really awesome site where you can leave comments and post on the forum and earn points and the points let you have new ranks and new little avatar thingies for your profile? And oh, by the way... you can play some games there, too."

I doubt it. Users tell their friends about a FLASH GAME site that also has some cool features. Let's not forget that this is a FLASH GAME site. People come to this site to play FLASH GAMES. Yes, this site has an awesome community to go with the FLASH GAMES, which sets it head and shoulders above the rest, but this site started by hosting free FLASH GAMES so people could kill some time and have some fun.

I ran across an AG game on some other flash site years ago, and the game was so awesome (I don't remember which game) that I visited the AG site and started playing games from there. While on deployment to Iraq last year, I had some time to kill, so I went back to good ol' AG. And BAM! Everything's different.

I come to this site to play games. I've spent countless hours playing games on this site. I don't spend my time leaving Feedback (I think I've left 3 in my time here) or posting on the Forums (this is my first and only thread). I know there are many people who are drawn to the community, but I bet >99% first arrived at the site because it hosts FLASH GAMES.

*************

Here's a simple idea:

If you're not going to post something original or helpful, keep your two cents in your pocket. Those of us who are actually discussing the topic at hand already know there are plenty of you who think it's a bad idea to stop awarding AP for Feedback. (I'd be curious to read the Feedback history of this idea's opponents.) So if all you're going to say is some variation of If you stop awarding AP for comments, people will stop coming to the site, just say it out loud to yourself and spare the rest of us your eloquent new way of saying the same old thing.

Alric
Gantic
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Gantic
11,889 posts
King

Check out Kongregate.

Gantic
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Gantic
11,889 posts
King

Scratch that. Check out comments for the new Bowja game and count up how many comments have been flagged for review. The comments are actually hidden after flagging (of a certain amount probably). I was unaware that they actually deleted stuff. To prevent skewed results, check the new game.

pizzadude193
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pizzadude193
93 posts
Nomad

Without points for feedback, it would be even harder to earn points

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