But why would separate atoms fuse from stars, 'decide' to assemble themselves in a way that makes a consiousness, doesnt that in its self reqire one in the first place? thus, something before atoms?
It has nothing to do with "Deciding", do elements "decide" to bond with each other? Its not a matter of consciousness, but of reactions Plus, doesn't Christianity state something like God thought himself into existence? Doesn't that require something beforehand to let him think?
I believe specifically in God and well it's the way I was raised, but not only that I personally have witnessed miracles, I've had experiences that I'm positive have came from him, and while it is possible to explain our existence with science I fell like God being real explains our existence actually better than science does. Also I don't believe that we have no purpose or greater goal in life so even if I'm wrong and God doesn't exist I know that there are other gods
Well yea if you just say "It just happened" and can make yourself believe that then of course its better then any other explanation, logical or not.
No, it sais,'... God was not made, and cannot be unmade, God is, was, and always will be...
Hmmm...maybe its something else.
Still, that means our fundamental beliefs about time are flawed if this is to be true. Time must be non-linear for him to exist eternally, or for there to actually be something called eternity. Basically, just like life forming by itself, it goes against our laws of time and space, as well as our knowledge. What came before him, because something must have in order for him to exist, so the claim he's always existed doesn't make sense. How did he become something from nothing, and how can something exist forever, doesn't there have to be a start to something for it to happen?
doesn't there have to be a start to something for it to happen?
Post-Big-Bang, yes. Pre-Big-Bang, no. Because our concepts of time and causation are inapplicable before the Big Bang, because time is linked to space and all space was almost infinitely compressed. Therefore, time would be too - so theoretically something would not need to start or end, because there would be no time.
I'm objecting to the God theory, in which he eternally exists without the compression of space and time, not to the big bang :P Although I didn't know that theory before
Time is one of our four dimensions. God live outside of it. Picture a line on a piece of paper, we as mortals are progressing along the line, but God sees the whole page, he doesnt see the future, he sees it all as 'now'
Not a good translation... it means that science cant rationalize what it cant fathom, and logic cant explain the absolute trust is some thing you cant see. Thats what my sentence means.....
Yes.. and science is also on the page that believing in things for which there is no evidence is *crazy*. There is no such thing as the 'supernatural', only the natural.
But why would separate atoms, fused from stars, 'decide' to assemble themselves in a way that makes a consiousness, doesnt that in its self reqire one in the first place? thus, something before atoms?
Decide? Do you have any idea at all how chemistry works? Atoms & molecules don't make decisions like:
"I'm tired of being a hydrogen molecule. I need to find some oxygen to make some water."
They crash into each other, they get heated and frozen, turned into gases, liquids & solids and they interact; sometimes they change, sometimes nothing happens at all.
One of the chief arguments that life forming on Earth needed a creator is based on how it couldn't have been random, because the odds of it actually happening are too great. Most of the universe is too cold, some of it is *way* too hot.
But step back and think for a second. Our galaxy is 100,000 light years in diameter. Light, the fastest thing that can travel that we know of, takes 100,000 years just to cross the galaxy. There are ranging estimates between 200 and 400 billion stars. Not all of them have planets... but some do. And not all of those planets are capable of supporting life.
Now, think of the other galaxies. In 1999, data from the HST led astronomers to estimate that there may be as many as 125 billion galaxies out there. The recently installed camera can see about 3000 visibly. Now, think about all of the stars & planets in those galaxies.
Given the size of the universe.. and the odds of life being created on a planet.. odds are, it had to happen somewhere, and quite possibly more then one. Earth happens to be one of those places.
We are atoms, we make desicions, are you just a compound, or are you a consciousness?
I am a consciousness from our own definition of consciousness. It doesn't mean that I am not an arrangement of atoms, compounds & molecules; the two are not mutually exclusive.
What Im saying is, havent you ever wondered if your thoughts and emotions were anything more than boichemical reactions taking place in rythmical patterns, or are they more than physically signifigant?
What Im saying is, havent you ever wondered if your thoughts and emotions were anything more than boichemical reactions taking place in rythmical patterns, or are they more than physically signifigant?
When allowing my mind to wander, or in discussions of philosophy - yes, I have wondered.
However, since we have no evidence to support that my thoughts or emotions *are* anything more than biochemical reactions taking place in rythmic (or arythmic for that matter) patterns, I can't conclude that it is anything more then that - entirely physical.
To study the evidence and come to a contrary conclusion is irrational. On a further note - given the nature of our existence, and the lack thereof of anything supernatural, to take something that we do not yet fully understand (such as the formation of the universe as we know it now) and attribute it to something supernatural does not make sense. It is better to say:
"We're still working on it, but this is what we think so far"
or even:
"I don't know. Yet."
Then to say:
"It must have been some being that exists outside of time and space that we have no means of verifying ever that is all-powerful."
