ForumsWEPRApe, human, what next?

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valkyrie1119
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valkyrie1119
1,720 posts
Nomad

If you don't believe in evolution, do not post in this thread. This is a question aimed towards those who, like me, believe in the concept of evolution.

So here is my question for you, evolution shows that we were once monkey type animals at one point, and look at where we are now. In a million years, if we were still alive, what do you think we would become? Or, do you think that we would continue to change and evolve?

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TexanProvo
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TexanProvo
408 posts
Nomad

It's not, I don't think, how humanity will change but how we will change the environment around us. We no longer really adapt to our natural surroundings but instead alter them to fit our purposes. Genetic defects will increase and in a few thousand years we shall most likely be mostly the same as we are now. The only thing that can really cause us to alter all that much is moving into space though we know little of the effects that will have on us in the long run, though they most likely will be negative, especially at first.

wolf1991
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wolf1991
3,437 posts
Farmer

I believe it is a stretch of the imagination to say humans will still be human in millions of years.

skater_kid_who_pwns
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skater_kid_who_pwns
4,375 posts
Blacksmith

Honeslty, evolution is so stupid. So we came from monkeys, and they came from this, and so one, and so one. Well ONe question I never have gotten an answer to, is where the molecules that made these things came from? Don't tell me "They where always there" Don't use the theory of evolution to back it up either. Use other things.

NOw then, IF evolution is real, then we will be weaker, as todays society is so comfortable.

pHacon
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pHacon
1,903 posts
Nomad

Do you want to know how life started or how matter, light, and gravity supposedly existed in a singularity a few billion years ago?

GreatestSoloEver
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GreatestSoloEver
1,361 posts
Nomad

We will turn into Super-Obamas...so pretty much normal people...

Freakenstein
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Freakenstein
9,504 posts
Jester

Honeslty, evolution is so stupid. So we came from monkeys, and they came from this, and so one, and so one. Well ONe question I never have gotten an answer to, is where the molecules that made these things came from? Don't tell me "They where always there" Don't use the theory of evolution to back it up either. Use other things.


Then you cannot use your imagination or the bible to say that we were spontaneously created. I will give you proof. I will continuously give proof of where life all started in every single thread pertaining to this, until people remember!

For most people, we as humans are like paintings, where they are created by a painter, a designer. The only difference is that the painting has chemicals which can't replicate themselves. However, the human body does, AKA DNA. Even if God DID create DNA, he doesn't need to intervene every time an animal mates with another, the DNA does the job of creating the offspring on its own. So what's the question of the...er, night? How did DNA appear is the correct choice. How did living matter get created from non-living matter?

Here, Creationists need to drop the common argument that many seem to use all the time in order to bash the opposite side of the table with the statement which was based totally off ignorance of other Creationists, which was this:

All you monkey believers think that life popped out of nowhere and out of nothingness!

Of course, that's NOT the correct way in which we think. Life popping out of nowhere is no better than popping out of the hand of a deity. So what DO top Evolutionists believe? Why don't I take this step by step for you:

1. Best way to start is looking at ancient earth 4.7 billion years ago. Many different compounds were around back then, such as hydrogen cyanide and methane gas. DNA is made from only 4 different types of Nucleotides, so where did that come from? How in the world did they come to be in this universe?

Here's this: In 1964 a brilliant researcher called Wan Oro put methane and the cyanide to boil in a solution under the perfect conditions that were in ancient earth back then. Afterwards, the solution produced adenine, one of the four types of nucleotide bases. To make a full nucleotide, it needs to gain a sugar called Ribose and a group of phosphates. How in the world did the ribose and phosphate group get formed and get attached to that nucleotide?

2. From the nucleotide to the polynucleotide

Well, once the nucleotide was formed, they needed to form together in chains called polynucleotides. In the 1980s, researchers found that a clay, called "montmorillonite", a very abundant resource in ancient earth, was a perfect catalyst for this process of "chaining".

3. Now we are going to make RNA!

Some of these copies of the polynucleotides with ribose inside, or RNA (ribonucleic acid) are able to make copies of themselves...huh. Of course the copies aren't as perfect, but again, some copies are more adapted than the other copies to survive in the hot, dense planet earth used to be. So these molecules that did survive would replicate and pass on their traits, while those that aren't so great at surviving would just break apart into regular compounds of methane and cyanide.

4. Making protocells! WHOO!

As RNA replicated, they shared their surroundings with other chemicals around them. Some chemicals, called "lipids" like to clump together to form circular bodies called micelles. RNA molecules that attracted the micelles found themselves protected inside them. Because they were protected, they better survived than those that weren't. From there, they replicated successfully, but with the entire protocell with them. There, you have the first primitive cellular structure.

5. Then from the span of hundreds of millions of years later, RNA grew more complex from replicating and passing on better traits. The single strand formed to create a double-strand molecule, and the more successful DNA molecule evolved. One thing however: DNA needs proteins to replicate. Proteins are made from amino acids or the building blocks of life, so how/where in the world did the amino acids get into the picture?

GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD GOD

No...there was no need for God....

6. formation of amino acids

a number of experiments with the montmorillonite not only produced amino acids, but long chains of them that are called &quotolypeptides". It turns out that this long-difficult name clay stuff is a natural breeding ground for all these complex chemicals. So there you have it. RNA, DNA, what made it, and what made amino acids, non-living chemicals that in turn made living organisms and the process in which these chemicals came to be.

So as I build this up, I ask you this: if God did create life, when did he come in, using the same kinds of steps that I have provided for you? And if the chemical process needed to create life can happen on its own, why does he need to come in?

Before I end class tonight, I want you guys to look at some old arguments that end nowhere and show complete ignorance of people's views:

"It can't be done! simple chemicals can't form into complex chemicals without intervention!"

Are you sure? Just because a lot of people pass around this argument doesn't mean it's true. It's not true. Given time and left alone, smaller, simpler chemicals can and will polymerize into complex chemicals.

"2nd law of thermodynamics, genius. FAIL"

This sad argument? Simple chemicals polymerizing into complex chemicals conflicts with NO laws of thermodynamics. I suggest if you use this argument to freely read up on this law, because I believe you haven't and are just ignorantly repeating a myth that's already been shot down many times.
Pixie214
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Pixie214
5,838 posts
Peasant

I've read quite a few theoris on this but at the end of the day it's fortune telling really and at best speculation.

One of the strangest is that because of analogue thumb sticks on game controllers humans will evolve extra-long mobile thumbs..... my problem with this is that the people whoa re best at video games aren't the ones having the most kids >_> (and I dunno of there is a correlation between thumb length and video game dominations )

Next up is that we will split into 2 species one that is beautiful and inteligent and another goblin like race. But this idea was put forward by a professor of economics so I call bs.

Then the idea I keep hearing is that we won't evolve at all.... we've become so removed from nature we rely on toher factors other than survival to mate so we'll stay pretty much the same..... probably a bit atller since the global average keeps increasing. Just look at how small some of the msot well known historical figures where (that family guy flash back that presented Jesus as a dwarf maybe wasn't too far off)

thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,821 posts
Farmer

Honeslty, evolution is so stupid. So we came from monkeys, and they came from this, and so one, and so one. Well ONe question I never have gotten an answer to, is where the molecules that made these things came from? Don't tell me "They where always there" Don't use the theory of evolution to back it up either. Use other things.


Skater, I love you too, but don't be ignorant. Evolution isn't the theory of how they got there, just how living things change. The original matter is from the Big Bang or from something else - we don't know for sure. All we know is that living things change over time (which is all that evolution is.)

Apparently, according to a study in Iowa, people are getting slightly shorter. But that's all I know of right now.
skater_kid_who_pwns
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skater_kid_who_pwns
4,375 posts
Blacksmith

Best way to start is looking at ancient earth 4.7 billion years ago. Many different compounds were around back then, such as hydrogen cyanide and methane gas


You told me what I already know pal. Where did those come from? Look, I'm not defending creationism, or anything else. I arguee both sides, and make people think about what they actually beleive.

So wha tyour telling me is, yo uhave all these things, which magically spawned together?

So, If I have a hill, and some rocks, and Ishove those rocks down the hill, at the bottom it will spell out your name? Basically what your telling me.

And so how did monkeys randomly appear? What made them pop up? what did monkeys come from, and why has no scientist ever found remains of something that changed into a monkey? I have never seen proof of anything, so I don't belive anything.

We are here beacuse we are. Simple as that.
Freakenstein
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Freakenstein
9,504 posts
Jester

So wha tyour telling me is, yo uhave all these things, which magically spawned together?


...No.

So, If I have a hill, and some rocks, and Ishove those rocks down the hill, at the bottom it will spell out your name? Basically what your telling me.


...No. And I laughed because I have no idea how you came up with that from what I said. It is obviously not as simple as "throwing rocks down a hill and something magically happens".

Nothing just magically spawns together. Hydrogen Cyanide and Methane Gas did not magically spawn together. I'm going to say this again and again. It came from the big bang, and that came from a continuous recycling of the big bang. Remember; under extremely hot conditions, elements fuse to condense into heavier, different elements. It's happening right now as I type this if you just remember the Sun. Well what exactly happens when something tremendously X bigger than the sun and tremendously X hotter than the sun proceeds with expansion? All that energy is going to fuse together to form complex elements and compounds. Please tell me you realize the part where hot fusion is a known fact?


And so how did monkeys randomly appear? What made them pop up? what did monkeys come from, and why has no scientist ever found remains of something that changed into a monkey? I have never seen proof of anything, so I don't belive anything.


Did you not read a thing I just posted above your reply? The FACT that living things come from non-living things? No, they did not just randomly appear; that's for Creationists and their gods.

what did monkeys come from, and why has no scientist ever found remains of something that changed into a monkey? I have never seen proof of anything, so I don't belive anything


You should try to look things up so other people don't have to. If you wondered what the common ancestor of the monkeys and apes were, then why didn't you look and see? Because there's obviously proof right there in that link, of a fossil that predates lemurs, monkeys, apes, and humans.

We are here beacuse we are. Simple as that.


And if we all thought that, God and Creationists would simply rule the world without checking to see if he really was there. They would simply state that he was there with mulish ambitions and would execute anyone who would say differently or try and prove them wrong. Thinking about how we came to be spurred research and development, which obviously fast-forwarded advances in life.
thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,821 posts
Farmer

You told me what I already know pal. Where did those come from? Look, I'm not defending creationism, or anything else. I arguee both sides, and make people think about what they actually beleive.

So wha tyour telling me is, yo uhave all these things, which magically spawned together?

So, If I have a hill, and some rocks, and Ishove those rocks down the hill, at the bottom it will spell out your name? Basically what your telling me.

And so how did monkeys randomly appear? What made them pop up? what did monkeys come from, and why has no scientist ever found remains of something that changed into a monkey? I have never seen proof of anything, so I don't belive anything.

We are here beacuse we are. Simple as that.


You're completely missing the point. Evolution is not a theory of how life gets there, only how life changes. All this origin crap you're talking about isn't part of the theory of evolution because the theory of evolution is exactly what the name says it is - a theory of evolution. How things change, not how things start.

All the stuff getting here is covered by a different theory.
whyismynametom
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whyismynametom
263 posts
Nomad

Saying it recycles fore ever, wait where did the elements to make the big bangs come from ORIGINALLY? hmm? no answer, or are you going to say another one before that, bull i mean originally.

Freakenstein
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Freakenstein
9,504 posts
Jester

How could you tell if there was an original big bang? Empirically, there isn't.

Hectichermit
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Hectichermit
1,828 posts
Bard

Hey freakenstein isn't there something about the universe being in an everlasting cycle, expanding then condensing...theres also the law of conservation...where energy isn't created or destroyed...

Freakenstein
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Freakenstein
9,504 posts
Jester

Yep! The energy that we have now will not be destroyed and be created later. What we have is what we will have forever. Seeing that this is the law of conservation proves my point. Saying that the universe was created is blasphemy, while saying that there is an endless cycle of it is not. If matter has always been here and will always be here, the universe just recycles it continuously.

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