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EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,220 posts
Nomad

I despise the word 'club,' but nothing else describes it. So that's what it is.

Oh yes, and this may be quite an OP. Read very carefully, I'll explain EVERYTHING, including organization, rules, and why we're doing this. These will be static until it needs to be changed, in which case a new thread will be made, with the rules in the OP.

*Note*: This was not put into the forum games because I feel it's a little more than that. It requires complex posting, not a one sentence post that says to nuke them.

If you want the tl;dr version, it's under Review. Although you should read through it at least once, to get knowledge of the finer points.

============================================================

I've had this idea for a while, and was inspired by a debate I had a few weeks ago to make this. A Battle Strategy Club, I thought would be a great idea. I'm fairly positive there has been one, maybe others in the past. However, with the organization required to make such a club, or any club with a purpose, they died. I'm trying to make a club that is as sustainable as possible, and let's face it, battle strategy is interesting. One of the most interesting things around, and it is very similar to any strategy game. This club, however, will not abide by standard gaming rules, but rather will be as realistic as possible. War is simply put, be it a small skirmish in Khandahar, or an all out WWII scale invasion, a logistical nightmare. You do not have an infinite amount of troops, nor an infinite amount of munitions. Bombs, guns, even bullets, are not infinite. You must ration, and a simple rule to all invasions is this: An army marches on its stomach. Even food is a priority in warfare.

Fortunately for us, most of these scenarios will not be logistical nightmares. Unless it's an all out invasion, the battles will not be so complex. You should have a limit on munitions, however. Otherwise, you just rain thousands of 155mm artillery shells on them, and no one of your soldiers die. Fairly simple.

I'm not an expert in battle strategy, nor is any of us here. I'm here to get better at strategy, which can and will help me in life as a whole. Making strategic decisions, even on something as innocent as this, is a vital skill. For all you gamers out there, this may also teach you some strategy tips, for use in any RTS game you might play. While flanking doesn't necessarily give you a bonus damage roll, learning to maintain reserves can help you not get destroyed on the hardest difficulties.

Enough of that, that's a long enough forward. Now for the next part.

Organization of the Club

It's a fairly simple organization, tried and tested by the ZSC (Zombie Survival Club), and that's where I will heavily borrow many of the organizational points. It will not be too complex, there will not be ranks, only opinions. Some people are better than others, and may point out to others what a flaw in their battle plan is. Everything is opinionated, so if you want to feel that everyone is equal, that's you, if you want to feel some people are more reliable than others, that's fine too.

To start, there is no predefined 'leader,' other than me. Really, unless something needs administrative work, I'm just another member. I shouldn't need any help, although if I do, I would ask another member to help. It would not be permanent, so don't get you hopes up for becoming vice president. Unless this becomes very large, something I hope will happen but is not likely, it will be just me.

As a general rule, only members can post scenarios. Anyone can answer, and this will help them with becoming a member. Membership is gained simply by me saying so. Anyone can post an answer, and participate in the activities, but to become a full member is my choice. Typically this will happen after one or two successful, or deemed successful battle plans. If you never seem to learn that simply rushing them every time isn't going to work, you're not going to make it.

Scenarios, are a little complex, and should be organized as best to your abilities. Use common sense, and put all needed information, including terrain, enemies, the size of your force, the perceived difficulty, etc. Any information that might effect the battle plan must be included. You don't need to go into detail on every soldier, we don't need to know their favorite color. Just give us a rough picture. 10 guys with AK's, two guys with an RPG, maybe three or four I.E.D.s. Maybe they're all in one trench, maybe some are on a hill. To equate everything, it should be about two or three paragraphs long, unless it's REALLY complex.

That's about it for organization. Nothing terribly difficult. Now for rules, and the last section before my scenario I will give you all. These are simple, and easy to follow.

Rules

1. ABSOLUTELY NO GOD MODDING. I cannot stress this enough. The creator may not god mod, nor may those trying to answer it. You do not have a nuke, and your troops are not Master Chief. If I see this happen, I will see to it that you will not post again in this thread. If this happens, you will receive a warning, and if you are a member will temporarily lose that right. If it happens again, I will request a mod to not allow you to post again, and request you posts from that point on be deleted. This is to help your mind, not make you god.

2. Be courteous or others, especially people who might not be very good at it yet. Everyone was a newbie once too, so don't get into an argument with them over it. This is friendly competition, and I will not stand for it. This is directed at veterans especially, I will revoke membership if you have attained it.

3. This is not a debate club, guys. You can debate the effectiveness of a policy, but don't bring subjective things into this.

That should do for the time being.

Review

1. I am the only leader

2. Membership is attained by my saying so

3. Scenarios should give all required info

4. No god modding, lest you be banned from the thread

5. Courteousness is central to the thread; play nice with newbies

6. Subjective things such as public opinion should be left out of battle plans, and if possible scenarios. For max realism you can use it though.

Simple, isn't it? Just be nice and be serious. Some lulz activities are fine, just don't get carried away with off topic posts. We can have fun, but making fun of mods in your battle plans is a little much.

*This is VERY IMPORTANT*

Scenarios do not have to be realistic. If you want an American invasion in South London, that's fine. If you want Frodo fighting the Roman empire, that's fine too. It can be anything you want, just keep up to a respectable standard. It's fine to be funny, just not fine to be a total idiot.

============================================================

The First Scenario

This is the first scenario. I will try to be as informative as possible, as stated in the Organization section. This is what you will make to try and get in at first. Make a battle plan I'm satisfied with, and it's good. Remember, anyone can give criticism. If I make an unfair decision in your eyes, fight for it and try to sway me. Politely. Make corrections where necessary.

This will be simple, an example really. Average difficulty, and anyone with any knowledge of strategy should be able to do it.

Location: Desert of Iraq

Terrain: A flat, open area with little to no cover anywhere outside of the main base and vehicles.

Enemy Force: A detachment of insurgents, numbering 150 strong, are assaulting a position of coalition forces, made primarily of US and British troops. 70 of them have AK47's or 74's. 20 of them have various other assault weapons, primarily stolen. 5 of them are equipped with RPG-7's. There are around 15 snipers equipped with Dragunov SVD's. 20 of them are poorly armed, having nothing but pistols and a grenade or two. The remaining 20 are equipped with squad based automatic machine guns. They have no body armor or vehicles beyond the trucks they came in.

Your force: Standard issue M16s and L85s. There are about 75 in all, in full battle gear. You are in an entrenched position, forming a crescent around the enemy. You currently have an F16 on stand by with four 500 pound JDAMs. Use them wisely. You have four Humvee's, each equipped with one .50 caliber machine gun, capable of fitting 7 men, and one gunner. You also have an outdated M551 Sheridan. Remember this is a '60s tank, it does not have heavy duty battle armor. Much the like Humvee's, a direct RPG attack is likely to kill it.

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/zz40/EyesoftheSky_2009/bp1.jpg?t=1277862273

I'm not an artist thank you very much.

The insurgents are tightly knit together, whilst the allied troops are heavily dispersed. The two black dots on the right are RPG operators. The two black dots in the back are snipers. It's about 900 yards to them. Use that for scale.

What will you do?

This isn't anything complicated for a reason. I need other people in soon enough to help build up a decent scenario base.

  • 50 Replies
vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

Why the hell would such a small unit be entrenched in the middle of nowhere? Just wondering. It didn't make any sense to me at all.

They dig through the ground, maybe...But as Orion said, it's just a scenario.
Okay, well Thoad and Vinster, you're in.

Mmmm okay, thanks. =D
314d1
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314d1
3,817 posts
Nomad

Well, I will attempt to join, not much to do once the debate forum is slow...

We are not trying to preserve men, but win the war right?

First I would fire the artillery, aiming for the enemy vehicles. I would then send all the vehicles, full with men, to destroy the remaining, if any, enemy vehicles. After the enemy vehicles are destroyed, I set my remaining vehicles to distract enemy fire. While that is happening I rally my men in small squads of three, sending five squads to attack on the other side of the enemy. Then if the enemy advance is stopped, I would send another ten squads to surround the enemy completely. If the enemy is still alive after that, I would set the squads in the trench to simply fight off any enemy advance. While that is going on, I send four squads to take out the snipers.

I know its a pretty bad plan, but hey its late at night...

vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

I can tell that you DID NOT read all of the OP. Orion said to make things detailed.

So, please read all of the OP. To understand more of the scenario.

314d1
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314d1
3,817 posts
Nomad

I can tell that you DID NOT read all of the OP. Orion said to make things detailed.

So, please read all of the OP. To understand more of the scenario.


Like said, its late at night and I haven't gotten much sleep the last two nights...

And detail has never been my strong suit...

But I will attempt again, if you wish. Do you want me to clarify my previous post or rewrite it?
vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

I see.

Even if detail has never been your strong suit. Just keep trying.

And you can choose whatever, previous post or rewrite, just pick either. It doesn't matter. As long as Orion approves it.

pHacon
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pHacon
1,903 posts
Nomad

But I will attempt again, if you wish. Do you want me to clarify my previous post or rewrite it?


Might as well get some sleep and wait until tomorrow, someone will probably have some constructive criticism for you by then, and you can work on it better.
thoadthetoad
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thoadthetoad
5,633 posts
Peasant

Just one last thing I must ask:
Can I use future-tech weapons? Only I'd have to specify everythign before I start the scenario, but can I use futuretech stuff?

vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

Yes, you can Thoad. It doesn't have to be realistic.

Scenarios do not have to be realistic. If you want an American invasion in South London, that's fine. If you want Frodo fighting the Roman empire, that's fine too. It can be anything you want, just keep up to a respectable standard. It's fine to be funny, just not fine to be a total idiot.
314d1
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314d1
3,817 posts
Nomad

Its morning and time for the rewriting attempt.

First, I send my F16 to bomb any large groups of enemies, as well as the RPG men and the machine gun men. If they are close to each other, one bomb on the RPG men, one bomb on the machine gun men, and two bombs for the largest groups.

Now a question, do the drivers count in the number? Do I have to have say, nine for the Humvee and four for the tank? Here I will assume not, correct me if I am wrong.

Then I fully load the Humvees and send them off in a upside down V with the Sheridan in point, sending them to assault the front of the enemy troops. Once the firing starts, the men on the Humvees exist and join the fray. The primary targets will be the threats, the RPG men.

While that was happening, I would have the remaining troops get into 13 teams of three, armed however numbers allow yet attempting to put similar guns into similar squads, and one team of four.

While this has been going on I send three teams to attack the enemy snipers, they should not be hard to find in this terrain.

I then send five squads to make a wide turn from the base and attack the enemy from behind, flanking them. The main targets are the RPG men and the machine gunners.

Then I send three more squads to each the left and right of the enemy, by walking forward and then turning in there direction, walking closer if needed. Same targets.

The last two squads stay entrenched in the case the others fail. There main targets will be the machine gun men.

I hope that is better, I will make any further corrections after work.

thoadthetoad
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thoadthetoad
5,633 posts
Peasant

Alright, I have a scenario for you all.

IMPORTANT NOTE: THIS IS FUTURETECH. PROBABLY WHAT I'LL SPECIALIZE IN. FUTURETECH IS POSSIBLE PSEUDO-TECH THAT COULD HAPPEN, BUT ISN'T BECAUSE OF THE GOVERNMENT BEING ALL LIKE: "I AIN'T GUNNA LET NO KIDS DESIGN MAH WEPUNZ. HELLZ NAW. THAT'S TOO MUCH MUNNEYZ." BUT YEAH, SO HERE GOES:
I'll give you a choice on which predicament you want to be in, btw.
Overview: The Red army (also known as team RED) is developing a weapon of mass destruction (big black square in map), but they hadn't known the Green Army (also known as team GREEN) knew their isolated location. At the moment, there was only a small entrenchment and sandbag wall around the small device. There are 4 small sentry guns behind the wall. They can fend off maybe 6 common infantry by themselves.
Team GREEN: You have 10 main infantry surrounding the entrenchment. 2 are M3a1-20s, which are essentially just heavily armored (light tank armored) infantry who have a gun that is basically a portable microwave-beam. 2 are insurgents, who have Ak-74s, and have no armor. 2 are M3a1-10s, which are lightly armored infantry who use EMP grenades and a gun based upon electricity coursing through either an infantry unit or a tank, frying (or electrocuting) the target. 2 are medics, or rather engineers, able to heal any mortal wounds the others have made. Though this takes time. The last 2 are tank engineers, supposed to do minor repairs on the jackhammer tanks (seen below)
Then the two big green boxes with the big black things sticking out of them are called jackhammer tanks, they are something of a bulldozer, except they are just a big wall. They don't have a jackhammer action or anything, they're just a big, moving, wall.
Green's Predicament:
You are moving in to destroy the superweapon, hopefully setting back the Red Army's plans. As you reach the outer rim of their entrenchments, you notice that you may outnumber them in infantry, but they heavily outclass you. Most of their infantry in the encampent are M3a1-20s, with both EMP capabilities as well as microwave capabilities. You also just notice reinforcements coming your way, Cryo tanks, which launch a paintball-like shell that freezes armaments.
Also, Silikin tanks, which irradiates a large area within their cap's range.
These tanks are aprox 20 yards away.
Green Objective: Destroy the superweapon.

Red's Predicament:
Essentially, you're on the defense of the above scenario. Only thing different is that you have the ability to launch 1 Cryo Missle, which will almost instantly freeze anything in it's blast radius. When used on heavy infantry, it will only slow them down, but not kill them. When used on lightly armored infantry, they may die of hypothermia. Light infantry are mixed in, and you can't really make it out. Assume that all missile targets are heavily armored.
And here's the map that you desperately need:
http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/368/fieldmap.png

vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

Hm...pretty interesting scenario Thoad. I'll see what I can do. Heh...

pHacon
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pHacon
1,903 posts
Nomad

Hmm... Could you give me the effective ranges of every weapon before I commit to either side?

thoadthetoad
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thoadthetoad
5,633 posts
Peasant

Electricity Guns can generally only fire about 10 yards away, but are effective against everything and are almost always a 1 hit kill. The EMP grenades are about as heavy as a frag grenade, and can be thrown.. Idunno, 20 yards? Emp blast radius is about half of the Cryo Missle radius.
The microwave beams can go about 50 yards away, but are more powerful the longer they keep on their target and the closer they are.
The cryo tanks can fire from about 30 yards away.
The silikin tanks can fire from long distances away, ~100 yards.
The Jackhammer tanks are again, a big moving wall.
Sentry guns can open fire and do effective damage from about 20 yards away. They come with only 10,000 rounds each and will run out quickly (as they will fire on the jackhammer when in range).
Insurgents can fire about as far as they can see. They are definitely no snipers though, and will likely be cannon fodder for you.
Just a bit of additional information for my thing.

firetail_madness
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firetail_madness
20,540 posts
Blacksmith

I have no idea whatsoever about this battle strategy thing, but I'll try my best. (I'm probably going to need a few tries)

Firstly, I'm going to have the humvees open fire, preferably directly in front of the vehicles to throw up a flurry of sand (it's a desert, right?) and blind the drivers. This will hopefully cause the drivers to sensibly brake the vehicles or drive blindly around, in where hopefully they'll collide with their own troops. If not, bomb them with the JDAM.

The JDAM priority will first to be take out the RPG men, than the vehicles, if anything's left over the snipers will be annihilated.

While they're distracted, I'll move about 40 men towards the right and up the field, where they'll be covered by the sandstorm. The tank and one humvee will cover the left side of the field while the remaining 35 men move towards the center and right of the trenches.

Upon call, the humvees will stop firing, and the sandstorm will hopefully stop. Using intelligence from the F-16 pilot above, the 40 troops from the back will attack the enemy, and hopefully then they'll be destroyed from being flanked and confused.

T.T

pHacon
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pHacon
1,903 posts
Nomad

I pick green, it seems that they would be losing almost no matter what, and I just want to have fun with it if I do.

Move everyone behind the jackhammer tanks and get those tanks to form a wedge (like /\\) against the north side of the red's entrenchment with a small gap so that the insurgents can fire at most anything that they can.

While moving the tanks into position (I hope they can drive in reverse), have the m3a1-20s attempting to fry the enemy tanks with their microwave beams, the 10s behind the cover of the jackhammers, throwing at least one grenade into the enemy entrenchment, and any others they might have at the enemy tanks when in range, hopefully not needing their guns to destroy them all.

Chances are I'd be rap*d long before this, but whatever... Green is starting to look kind of like a Kobayashi Maru to me right now.

Once the tanks are gone (it shouldn't be too long because they were almost in range of the EMPs from the start if they don't rape my infantry first), we can rotate the wedge safely to kill all remaining defenders and take out the WMD...

I doubt that will work :P

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