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gun controle gone wrong again.

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 2:55am

wflag10

wflag10

1,241 posts

Yes you can. This thing almost only happen in USA. maybe as partydevil said, its a cultural diffrunce or something.

"Almost only happen in USA" http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_m … h-firearms

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 3:26am

wflag10

wflag10

1,241 posts

Yes you can. This thing almost only happen in USA. maybe as partydevil said, its a cultural diffrunce or something.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir-crime-murders-with-firearms

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 8:32am

HahiHa

HahiHa

5,032 posts

Knight

We'll have that deleted until you can come up with something on-topic.

Acting like a mod again?

Anyway, the man had the right to shoot. The teenager was dressed in black, masked, and holding something. Heck, in that situation, I would have shot. You have to understand that when people are in the line of fire, or believe they are, they will attack without a thought. Shoot first, ask questions later. And why the hell was the son masked, in black, holding something, and breaking in?

First.. what does it matter what colour his clothes were?

Second, would a warning really hurt? Like saying, "Don't move or I'll shoot!". You know, to make sure the other person realized you got a gun. If then the other person points a gun at you, you may shoot. If not, not.

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 10:49am

Masterforger

Masterforger

1,633 posts

Acting like a mod again?

I see no current mod presence here. Do you? HahiHa, what you must understand is that the world is not organized between "enforcers" and "standard people". There all always mediums and medians.

First.. what does it matter what colour his clothes were?

Not just black clothes. Mask, clothing, potential weapon. What would you do in that situation? Keep in mind you've just been told by your daughter that there is a stranger in her house. You'd be worried sick, possibly adrenalin is pumping as you race to save her. Rationality in such a situation is as common as a four-leaf clover in the Sahara.

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 11:05am

HahiHa

HahiHa

5,032 posts

Knight

I see no current mod presence here. Do you? HahiHa, what you must understand is that the world is not organized between "enforcers" and "standard people". There all always mediums and medians.

That no mod presence is visible doesn't mean they're not around. I'm just saying, they don't like backseat modding, so just report the stuff and let them do their job.

Not just black clothes. Mask, clothing, potential weapon. What would you do in that situation? Keep in mind you've just been told by your daughter that there is a stranger in her house. You'd be worried sick, possibly adrenalin is pumping as you race to save her. Rationality in such a situation is as common as a four-leaf clover in the Sahara.

Black or pink, it doesn't really matter. Mask? That's something different. And yes, if I were in his situation, and if I had a gun, I'd be mad worried, I'd shout at the guy and possibly shoot in the ground before him. But I'd certainly not shoot him right away.

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 11:56am

EmperorPalpatine

EmperorPalpatine

4,977 posts

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir-crime-murders-with-firearms

Not sure if that site is trustworthy. For example, Russia, Liberia, Somalia, Swaziland, Jamacia, Panama, Honduras, and Brazil should be somewhere on there.

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 12:10pm

Masterforger

Masterforger

1,633 posts

Not sure if that site is trustworthy. For example, Russia, Liberia, Somalia, Swaziland, Jamacia, Panama, Honduras, and Brazil should be somewhere on there.

Well, South Africa is a murder hotspot. Last time I checked, they have 24 murders a day there.

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 12:25pm

AatosLiukkonen

AatosLiukkonen

67 posts

Wow. Guy shoots son who's acting like a burglar and everyone goes into a mad panic?

No offense to you people or your lack of common sense, but do you seriously think he knew that was his son when he pumped a few into him? This is not an accident, this will easily be considered a justifiable homicide. Accidents are when people shoot themselves in the foot because they're morons. Justifiable homicide is when people shoot criminals.

Does it matter that is was his son? No, not in the least. Any sane person with half a brain will shoot somebody if they turn around, ski mask and black clothing, holding what could very potentially be a gun. Because guess what? If you don't shoot them, they could very easily shoot you. Firing into the dirt? Are you stupid? People act like total idiots when afraid and taking fire, and all that will accomplish is sending lead down through your neighborhood and potentially into your face, as fired upon by the criminal. On the other hand, people have a hard time shooting back when bleeding out on the ground. This is not Call of Duty where people make their last stand shooting everything that moves. This is real life, and when people are shot, they start puking, screaming, crying, and clutching the newly acquired holes in their body.

And in the heat of the moment? Nobody shoots once. Ever. If you ask them how many shots they fired immediately after the incident, they might say one or two, even when looking at ten of fifteen casings on the ground. That's how life works.

Black or pink, it doesn't really matter

Actually, it does. Criminals aren't as stupid as people think. Black clothing in a dark environment makes a person difficult do see. Hence the common usage of black clothing by criminals at night.

You know, to make sure the other person realized you got a gun. If then the other person points a gun at you, you may shoot. If not, not.

I can aim a gun and shoot in less than a second, and even faster when adrenaline is pumping. By the time you've shot me, you're also quite potentially shot or some innocent body downrange is. If you see a gun, and you value your life and the lives of others, you shoot. Period.

You in USA live like guns are natural. its not. in places were there are no guns for the mass there are no more crimes than in USA. wher i live, there is no one with gun. no one. and yet, there are no wild west here.

And that's great. You're uncomfortable with weapons because you've never been around them. Fear of the unknown and all that. However, where I live, plenty of people have guns. In fact, I just got one very mean rifle for my birthday (and **** she's a thumper), and guess what? I haven't killed anybody with it! So strange, right? I mean think about it: A gun... not killing people... such an interesting concept that the majority of people adhere do.

Let me also make the statement that 90+% of gun crime utilize illegal weaponry, and that as many as 75% or more of murder victims are already criminals. Gun crime in America is not the result of a lot of guns, gun crime in America is the result of a lot of crime and even more illegal guns. I can literally walk down the street and buy an illegal gun (I know a guy who sells them), and that gun could be used in crime. The majority of legally obtained weapons used in murders or assaults are within the domestic situation, not by the criminal on the street. Want to know why? Because criminals CAN'T buy guns. Another one of those 'strange concepts' I keep going on about. Have a felony? No guns for you. Ever.

And since very few criminals start at murder or robbery, you can see where that goes.

Well, I hope you can, anyways.

Why its only happen in USA, all of these cases of 'gun saved my life"?

Because it happens two million times a year. Just the threat of getting shot deters most criminals.

why everywher else people go along without guns, and yet can protect themselve?

Because if what you say is true, and most countries don't have gun crime (which is bull****, just saying), then people don't need guns because defending against another gun is only possible with a gun. Unless you're Chuck Norris or Bruce Lee, which methinks you aren't.

there are people who instantly start shooting when they have the idea, they see a burglar.

If I see somebody with anything I can construe as a gun already in their hand, I'm blowing their brains out. I'm not risking my life for some stupid moron who brings guns to jobs. If I'm wrong, so be it. He still shouldn't have had a shiny object in his hand during the course of anything I can interpret as a crime.

i still don't see why he should be shot dead for it but w/e.

Oh, I don't know, because hundreds of people a year are killed by burglars and robbers?

someone whit a knife can be unarmed easily whitout a gun aswell.

You Bruce Lee? Because I'm not going to try and take a sharp pointy object from somebody, and I'm of sound mind and no disarmament skills. Life isn't a fair fight, and I'm not going to play fair if I have a gun and they don't.

there is no need to shoot someone whit a knife.

An intruder can charge 21 feet in one second. Yes, there is a very real need to shoot them if they have a knife, most notably being that normal people don't enjoy being stabbed when it can be avoided.

maybe he was just leaving from a visit.

With a weapon, dark clothes and a ski mask? That is one strange kid, if that's the case.

people dont. we dont smuggle guns, we dont create our own

Because they don't have to. As I said earlier in this post, I can walk down the street with $150 and buy a pistol, and I'm not even old enough to buy a rifle.

if you get "to the wrong neighberhood" in Tel-aviv, you wont get shot. never

The US isn't Tel-Aviv. It's the US. There aren't just culture differences, it's an entirely different culture altogether.

stabbed in the very maximum

I'd rather get shot. I'd die faster. Bleeding out over ten or more minutes is not how I want to go.

in Usa you can get a bullet by looking suspecios to one person eyes

And the people who shot them go to prison for 20 years or more.

Note: There is a huge difference between "suspicious" and "holding a knife 15 feet in front of you."

only police mans, who were traind hard for this, carry a pistol.

Cops are barely trained at all. Plenty of cops couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, let alone a man. I can hit a man from 100 yards with no issue, so why don't you guess who I trust more? The police who come ten minutes too late or my own gun and myself?

adn when there is a threat, they do there job, not the citizens.

Wrong. They investigate your murder. Police are tasked with protecting society at large, the individuals that make up society. In some cities, it can take as much as 11 minutes for police to respond to a high priority call (the kind that mean somebody just got shot in the face), and by that time, the victim is long dead, whether a gun did them in or a knife.

you dont need to defendd yourself in a modern country

Right, because there totally aren't armed criminals who kill thousands of people every year, right?

Which, if anything, only proves that the requirements for obtaining a gun are lax

Hardly. The man is of sound mind if he shot somebody who could very possibly (even likely) had a knife or a gun. It's not like he shot him from 400 yards in the dead of night.

Whether the kid did or not is irrelevant. The bottom line is: He had a weapon, he could not be visibly identified, and he was behaving like a criminal. Any sane individual would shoot. It's tragic that it was his own son, but such misfortunes are incredibly rare. The man acted correctly in the given situation.

a honest teacher doesn't kill people who are suspicious of being a burglar

Suspicious? He had a weapon, and was dressed for the job to boot! Even if this was just a practical joke gone wrong, this is a classic case of defending himself, his family, and his property!

not if it was illigal. but i bet you wont accept that.

If guns were illegal, I'd have no reason to obey the law when it came to guns. Which is great, because it means I can buy an automatic weapon without such petty worries. If I'm committing a crime either way for my hobby, I might as well go all the way.

they belong in the shooting clubs for that

What do? Guns? Hardly. In your home, in a secure location is the best place. Having a ****load of guns in one place is a bad idea, period. Only retailers need to worry about such risks.

also wen it's illigal less people will be in contact whit guns. all these people will not become a gun enthusiest as fast as when you see people around you shoot all the time. aka, they never develop the love for guns because they never make contact.

The first time I ever shot a gun was just a year ago, yet I've been obsessed with firepower since I was 4 or 5. Care to explain? Hell, just yesterday was the first time I'd ever fired a rifle. I see not where your opinion comes from.

making them more strict would be a good 1st step.

Why? So few legal guns are used for crime every year that doing so would actually negatively impact crime as the people who do use guns in self defense are no longer able to, thus increasing crime rates. As I stated earlier, the majority of gun crimes involve illegal guns, and the few cases which utilize legal weaponry are domestic situations that would be carried out with or without a gun.

There are outliers to the trend, but there are always outliers.

anyway more strict or not the honest teacher will keep his gun i guess.

In America, gun laws almost always start with pistols. So no, he would not.

burglars are small criminals. where i'm from. most small criminals don't have guns.

That's because where you're from, they don't have the same access to illegal traffickers, drug dealers, or cartels.

and if they do you should co-op whit him and let the police do it's work after. not risk your life in a fire fight.

If you hit them, there won't be a firefight. For you to reliably hit them, you need practice. If guns are illegal, then how are you supposed to practice?

Police aren't there to protect you. Period. They simply do not have the resources to protect each and every one of us. They'll find your killer, sure, but they won't save you.

everyone can learn atleast 5 techniques to do so in 1 day. even your grandma or 10 year old brother.

You have no grasp on reality, do you?

-will (over time) the small criminal like the burglar. still make the effort of getting a gun himself?

It's barely an effort. Illegal gun dealers are everywhere and have very reasonable prices.

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 12:34pm

EmperorPalpatine

EmperorPalpatine

4,977 posts

Last time I checked, they have 24 murders a day there.

Wiki's 2012 homicide stats say 31.8 per 100000 people per year. They have a population of about 50M.

31.8*(50M/100K) = 15900 murders per year

15900/365 = 43.56 murders per day

 

Posted Sep 30, '12 at 12:45pm

Masterforger

Masterforger

1,633 posts

And that's great. You're uncomfortable with weapons because you've never been around them. Fear of the unknown and all that. However, where I live, plenty of people have guns. In fact, I just got one very mean rifle for my birthday (and **** she's a thumper), and guess what? I haven't killed anybody with it! So strange, right? I mean think about it: A gun... not killing people... such an interesting concept that the majority of people adhere do.

Indeed. People see you own a gun, and they say "you could kill someone with that!", and well, yes, duh, you could, but nearly all gun crimes are made with illegal guns. Is this hard to understand? Illegal dealers are good for business all round! On the shady side, anyway. Manufacturer sells large amounts at cut price, but still profits, retailer sells guns at cut price, but still profits, and buyer gets gun, at cut price, and can now murder.

Anyway, I put no trust in the police. It's their job to arrive minutes after you're dead, search the scene for clues, find the killer (after months) and bring him to justice. Sadly, you're still underground, or ashes on the wind.

 
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