ForumsWEPRLouisiana Petitions To Secede

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CommanderPaladin
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CommanderPaladin
1,538 posts
Peasant

Not all Americans are enthralled with obama.
According to a news article published online by World News Daily (WND), The residents of Louisiana have started a petition to peacefully secede from the U.S. and form their own government. The petition was started on November 7 of this year, the day after the election.
(Now I'm going to opine a bit.)
While it causes me great pain to see America in the sorry state it's in now, and an act(s) of secession would only intensify the situation, this may be what needs to happen. I love my country and desperately want to see it return to its former glory, but the current regime has taken conditions ranging from fair to poor and exacerbated them to such an extent that the national condition is in a rapidly worsening state of untenability for all involved. The people of Louisiana realize this and are acting accordingly.
I believe that if obama actually cares for this nation like he says he does (which personally I doubt strongly), he would take this new development as a sign that he and the rest of the regime need to reverse their actions and/or resign. If he doesn't, it is likely that this will be the first of many cases of Americans separating themselves from a government that is no longer Of, By, and For The People but rather seeks to enslave them with government dependancy and weakens the nation on the foreign and domestic fronts.

America is dying, people. Something has to be done in short order, or America will be consigned to the ash-heap of history as a great nation that forsook its own ideals and killed itself from within. And I can't stand the thought of that happening.
All of you who believe in God or prayer, please say an extra prayer for the nation tonight.

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Strop
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Strop
10,835 posts
Herald

these same people will be pounding their chest talking about how they are true Americans and patriots.


lol I didn't say it. I was thinking it but I didn't say it...

Or well, I kinda did say it except in a much more roundabout fashion.
xeano321
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xeano321
3,083 posts
Blacksmith

I'm not too sure why you would want to secede... Doesn't make any sense. People get out of control. They are only thinking about the fact that Obama wouldn't be president if they secede... I don't believe they are considering the fact that they lose the protection provided by the government in the form of the army, navy, ETC...

Also, Louisiana doesn't seem like they would be able to provide a economy large enough to provide the citizens with the same way of life that they are used to.

I don't blame them for wanting to secede, but it seems like a stupid idea.

VonHeisenbourg
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VonHeisenbourg
377 posts
Shepherd

One thing ht annoys me about this secession business is that it's likely in four years when we vote for the next president these same people will be pounding their chest talking about how they are true Americans and patriots.

I find that to be improbable. If this whole secession business continues unanswered and unresolved, the growing feeling of discontent and resentment towards the Federal Government will only rise and reach a climax, at which point Civil War shall ensue.

Now on a slightly different note:
Ron Paul On How and If Secession is un-American
Strop
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Strop
10,835 posts
Herald

I don't believe they are considering the fact that they lose the protection provided by the government in the form of the army, navy, ETC...


Maybe the extremist militant Islamist jihad against the whole of the Western world might shift focus.

I find that to be improbable.


I'm not sure we can properly discuss probability given how speculative we're being at the moment. But perhaps you could tell us if/why you find this to be unfeasible.

If this whole secession business continues unanswered and unresolved, the growing feeling of discontent and resentment towards the Federal Government will only rise and reach a climax, at which point Civil War shall ensue.


I once wrote a story based on the idea that the growing discontent against the Howard government might lead to civil unrest/conflict in Australia. Because after 12 years, the youth population was getting pretty angry.

But we just voted that government out the next election. What I'm saying is that you'd have to figure out what the critical mass for escalation into civil unrest might be, and I can't gauge that from here. But this movement has carried on sufficiently long enough and probably grown sufficiently large enough that people who are interested to see what the administration's reaction is have their eyes on the right place.
VonHeisenbourg
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VonHeisenbourg
377 posts
Shepherd

I'm not sure we can properly discuss probability given how speculative we're being at the moment. But perhaps you could tell us if/why you find this to be unfeasible.

I don't think unfeasible is the right word to use in this context, but ok...

I find it unfeasible for people to go pounding their chests and claiming how American they're because they don't even want to be American any more. Look at the Occupy Wall Street Movement, and these secession petitions. Do you really think that when it comes to be voting time people will be gloating about how American they wish to be after all these protests?

If one has strong views on something (anything really) they will not change because it's time to vote on it.

I once wrote a story based on the idea that the growing discontent against the Howard government might lead to civil unrest/conflict in Australia. Because after 12 years, the youth population was getting pretty angry.

But we just voted that government out the next election. What I'm saying is that you'd have to figure out what the critical mass for escalation into civil unrest might be, and I can't gauge that from here.

Critical mass for escalation into civil unrest?

I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean by this.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,498 posts
Blacksmith

I find that to be improbable. If this whole secession business continues unanswered and unresolved, the growing feeling of discontent and resentment towards the Federal Government will only rise and reach a climax, at which point Civil War shall ensue.


I don't find it all that improbable. We already have a pretty good track record of this sort of thing happening.

Do you really think that when it comes to be voting time people will be gloating about how American they wish to be after all these protests?


Yes because it's not the first time this has happened. In fact this was going on in Texas for the last election.
TheMostManlyMan
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TheMostManlyMan
5,487 posts
Herald

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/65386_293455284105628_1361473344_n.jpg
They loved what America was supposed to be, what it used to be. Not what it has become and want no part of what it's becoming.

Strop
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Strop
10,835 posts
Herald

I don't think unfeasible is the right word to use in this context


After getting out of bed, I thought about this and couldn't figure out what I was thinking last night. You're right, let's stick to improbable. That'll teach me to post at 5am in the morning.

I won't offer any further feedback on the current developing discussion on national identity, it's going well enough as it is.

Critical mass for escalation into civil unrest?


Think of a nuclear bomb. You need a critical mass for the chain reaction to trigger, and you need a catalyst. I think that's a fairly good (if simple) analogy on how civil unrest turns into protest -> revolt. You simply need enough discontent that people can be galvanised into action given the right circumstances. And I don't know if the numbers cited by these petitions is anywhere near "enough" for that kind of thing.
Salvidian
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Salvidian
4,229 posts
Blacksmith

They loved what America was supposed to be, what it used to be. Not what it has become and want no part of what it's becoming.


Conservative much? I'm about as conservative as it gets and even I think that's a bit much. Just because Obama was elected doesn't mean the country will sway into a pit.

While I'm fed with the ton of regulations that democrats have been putting upon our meant-to-be "Leave Alone" economy, some of them have been put to good use. For example, cutting taxes for small business is a fantastic idea, and you can't argue that without sounding like a moron. The idea is awesome, but the effect of the idea (increased national debt) may not be so amazing. If republicans and democrats would work together to fine-tune these ideas we would have a much better system going, but instead it's so partisan that we're at a horrible standstill, and overly-conservative people aren't going to help one bit. In reality, many of the foundations for the country were made up 200 years ago, and several of them need severe updating.
pangtongshu
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pangtongshu
9,991 posts
Scribe

On the plus side of things...there is a petition to deport all of the people that signed these secession petitions that is almost to the 25,000 mark (or has passed it..haven't checked on it today)

Only 3 or 4 of the state seceding petitions have more than it

NoNameC68
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NoNameC68
5,063 posts
Farmer

Conservative much? I'm about as conservative as it gets and even I think that's a bit much. Just because Obama was elected doesn't mean the country will sway into a pit.


I feel some of the people have made light of everyone's reasons for signing the petition, that's all. I'm not saying secession will work, or that we should secede, just that we need to keep real.
SSTG
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SSTG
12,678 posts
Templar

On the plus side of things...there is a petition to deport all of the people that signed these secession petitions that is almost to the 25,000 mark (or has passed it..haven't checked on it today)

Good idea, let's deport those traitors. True patriots stay no matter what and they try hard to change things they don't like, they just don't give up like losers or quitters.
ellock
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ellock
387 posts
Jester

Ok, so I think this whole thing is symbolic to show Obama how upset people are. 20 states in total have signed similar petitions. I think Texas has around 80,000 signatures. The problem with this is that they do not really have enough people to do such a thing. Plus, the Obama administration is not going to address anything with under 25,000 clicks within the first 30 days of the post. Also, the states do not have the right to secede without permission from the president so it will be hard for them to pull that off.


Sources:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._state#Secession
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/11/states-with-most-signatures-to-secede-took-millions-in-federal-money/

NoNameC68
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NoNameC68
5,063 posts
Farmer

Good idea, let's deport those traitors. True patriots stay no matter what and they try hard to change things they don't like, they just don't give up like losers or quitters.


I hope that was sarcasm. If not, the following applies.

I suppose they wouldn't be patriots if they seceded, but you're really bashing them using semantics. When people from Texas act patriotic, it's because they believe in certain principles. To suggest they're being unpatriotic is to COMPLETELY miss the point, and to attack them on something that honestly doesn't matter.

"Oh, they called themselves patriots, then threaten to secede, therefore they're position is wrong," is fallacious in itself. Whether they consider themselves patriotic or not doesn't prove or disprove whether secession is proper or not.

You then explained that they should remain a part of America and try to change things from the inside rather than secede. Now, this may or may not be true, but you made this argument as if it's founded on ethics, which is something I strongly disagree with.
Strop
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Strop
10,835 posts
Herald

Let's stop dancing around the point then, because this is getting nowhere.

On this thread the discussion is now approaching "what does it mean to be patriotic?" It's time for every participant in that discussion to state what they believe it means to "be American".

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