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Theism and Atheism

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 12:11pm

PracticalManiac

PracticalManiac

302 posts

Sorry for the double post but Vesperbot.... seriously? come on man, I have no respect for people like you. Being homophobic is not far off from racism. You hate someone for their actions like racism hates someone for the mere color of their skin. Grow up dood, they are human JUST LIKE YOU. Who cares if they enjoy a different lifestyle. Dont be such a **** and maybe you might even have some gay friends. But you my friend are a real ***.

 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 12:19pm

Highfire

Highfire

3,127 posts

to be so blinded.

Even worse - willingly so blinded.

Being homophobic is not far off from racism. You hate someone for their actions like racism hates someone for the mere color of their skin.

I think you explained that a little wrong. Because actions are nearly always judged, in this case, it isn't such a big deal but I feel you put it wrong.

And for the record, I am not homophobic but I do disagree with it on an ethical scale.

But you my friend are a real ***.

Amen.

I have no idea what he's doing, to be fair. He's probably doing this intentionally (AKA troll) because I cannot see someone silly enough to do this thinking its right.

- H
 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 1:45pm

Highfire

Highfire

3,127 posts

Clearly you haven't met fundies before. Trust me, the are in the same group of people that think Jesus gave them the magical power to handle rattlesnakes, speak in tongues and the like.

In that case, I feel I'm lucky.

- H
 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 2:07pm

MageGrayWolf

MageGrayWolf

9,782 posts

Knight

I've seen this argument. I've said already, devil does not kill bodies, as the person who commits sins delivers both body and soul to his possession.


You do realize the 10 or so the devil kills was with Gods Okay right?

He said that not a single iota will pass from the laws, while they say to not do fornication, and it was explained what is fornication.


So we should stone people to death for even the most minor of things?
 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 2:29pm

HahiHa

HahiHa

5,305 posts

Knight

Fortunately, no, this is not God who hurts us, but the devil, who is also as real as God, and being evil, he's more active among us. The devil always sends temptations, and if we'll follow them, we'll sin and harm our souls. We are always free to choose the side, be it God or devil. But we should test the choices against our conscience to determine what choice leads to God and what choice leads to the devil. If a person has decided to not listen to his conscience, he will eventually choose the devil's ways and will start his descent.

What I mean is... you're getting hurt when you go against god's commandments. Who put up those commandments? God. Who decides to follow them or not? We do. We are told by both god and the devil what we should do. You said, if we choose to follow the devil, we sin and thus get hurt; so getting hurt is a consequence of choice. Who decided that we get hurt when we sin? The devil shouldn't care for it since he got us anyway then. So I only see the possibility of it being god's work; that or the work of a higher instance even than god, which decided that god's way was the real way and which hurts anyone not following it, independent of god's doing.
You could say, the devil is evil, so he surely wants to hurt us anyway. But, since we're supposed to be children of god, since god created us and our souls, and not the devil, then should the devil really be able to directly inflict harm to us? I thought the only thing he can do is mislead us, bring us away from god; isn't this the only harm he can do?
Other question, as children of god, why are we so susceptible to temptation? It kinda seems like god wanted us to be weak-willed, in opposition to most of his angels. Why that difference?
 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 2:48pm

Highfire

Highfire

3,127 posts

So we should stone people to death for even the most minor of things?

Yeah dude, you play Darksiders and kill Angels we gonna **** you right up.

Or if you used The Lords name unjustly. I mean GOD, why would you do that?
Jesus Christ, peoples ignorance nowadays.

...

- H
 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 2:56pm

Kasic

Kasic

5,740 posts

Yes, prove to me being gay is a choice

*grins* Ask Kasic for that, he already stated his homosexuality. I will not overthrow my own sexual identification for a single show-off.


Thank you so much Vesper for showing just how much attention you give other people's posts. I have not once said i'm gay, E1337, however, has more than once. At least get names straight before trying to flame other people.

As for you saying that you were still investigating why it's bad...IF YOU ALREADY HAVE NO REASON, WHY ARE YOU SPOUTING SUCH BIGOTRY? I have very little tolerance left for your absolute ****.

Here's an old, old, old argument for you. If "god" is so nice and loving, why does he even let the devil stick around?
 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 5:39pm

MRWalker82

MRWalker82

4,200 posts

Moderator

If there's a small chance I can "convert" someone to "see the light", I don't want it lowered.


You aren't going to convert the one you are debating with. The most you can hope to achieve is to give those observing the debate the tools to avoid falling into the closedminded and bigoted way of thinking that is being displayed. And that is the only reason I even bother debating anymore.
 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 5:49pm

MageGrayWolf

MageGrayWolf

9,782 posts

Knight

How can someone enjoy Heaven, knowing someone they love is being tortured in hell?
Did they forget that person existed?
Did they stop caring about that person?
Would either of these really be acceptable choices?

A hypothetical.
"There is a daycare center where at least five children have been killed because electrical outlets are exposed in the playroom. The staff maintains that they're not responsible, since they told the children two years ago not to go near the exposed wiring. They maintain that they care deeply for each child and grieve when one gets hurt, but it's up to the children to teach each other about the danger."
Any such daycare would be shut down for neglect.

How is this story really any different from how God handled things with Adam and Eve?
How is it any different from how he continues to handle things?

If God is omniscient (knows everything past present and future), why would he make me knowing I would be an atheist and go to hell for eternity? This question goes for anyone who will go to hell.

Genesis 2:16-17 (KJV)
And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

Genesis 3:4-7 (KJV)
And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
And when the woman saw that the tree [was] good for food, and that it [was] pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make [one] wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they [were] naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

Genesis 5:5 (KJV)
And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died.

Now just the bolded parts
God: "for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die."

Snake (Satan?): "Ye shall not surely die" "For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened"

What Happened: "And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they [were] naked" "And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died."

So who was the one who lied in this story?
Why would God place the tree and the snake there in the first place if not to temped, and knowing full well that they would be (omniscience)?

 

Posted Apr 4, '11 at 6:10pm

MageGrayWolf

MageGrayWolf

9,782 posts

Knight

I will not overthrow my own sexual identification for a single show-off.


I wouldn't even ask to preform a sexual act. All you have to do is choice to feel sexual aroused by looking at something like this.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/MageGrayWolf/sexy_guy_model12812.jpg

If homosexuality is a choice then this should be no problem for you. I'm sure God will forgive you if you do.
 
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