Forums → WEPR → [nec]Christianity vs Atheism
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I am a christian, i and i strongly belive in my lord jesus christ, and i also belive that if you belive in him and except him as your savior, u will go to heaven. and i also believe that he created the world, not the big bang, or that we came from stupid apes.
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Doesn't it also specifically state that in the new testament somewhere?
1 John 5:3 definitely implies this. The Old Testament laws were given to the Jews by God and this is the basis in which modern Christians reject Old Testament law. However if you reject Old Testament law then you must reject it all. It is not open to interpretation, nor is it meant to be an a la carte service for law. (James 2:10)
Also I would like to point out that the New Testament quotes and derives it's authority from the Old Testament and it's laws as many as 4,100 times. Kind of implies that the New Testament is not negating the Old, but reaffirming it. Also the works and ministry of Peter were based on Old Testament law and authority.
The simple fact is that if you read the Bible and follow what it says then it clearly states that Old Testament law is meant to be followed by all of God's people, even Christians, in it's entirety and without question.
I forgot another one in which Jesus himself addressed Old Testament law:
Matthew 5:17 âDo not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.â
God isn't real!
I don't believe in "god". I have no reason to. And the bible is so contradictory. They say God is "all forgiving" Then why is there a Hell? That's just dumb don't you think? I can't say I know the inner workings of the bible and everything about it. And I don't want to know. But I know enough to not believe in "Him." And how they say "God works in mysterious ways" that's dumb. What reason would he have to intervene in someones life? Like taking a loved one away they'd say that. And a few people would take their own lives if a certain loved one died. I'm sure it's happened before. So basically it goes like this. I'm going to take your loved one form you so you kill yourself and go to Hell. Why the hell would the "Loving and all forgiving God" do that? Just to be an asshole in my opinion. And how can someone actually believe in something like "Him?" They even leave out I think like I think eight years of Jesus' life out of the Bible. Now that's just bad story telling. It's all filled with holes. the only good thing that has come out of the Bible is a few movies with a "God" concept. I guess it's all a matter of faith. And I just can't put faith in this being. It's just stupid. And I really hate those Jesus Freak that spout all that crap. But it's a good way to evade taxes. And the preachers get to touch little boys. That is a plus. I remember when I was little and more docile I believed in "God." I never did pray. But I remember not liking "Him." I remember think how much of an ass "He" is. But now I know He isn't real. I know that if you believe in him you'll be disappointed again and again. I'm so glad I wasn't born into the puritan era. I'd be hanged for the way I think. We all would. We don't even believe in god the way the puritans did. That died out long ago. Maybe for better maybe for worse. Most likely better. Or maybe someone created the Bible so we would have less war in the world. Or something. It's my guess that if we didn't have god or any other religion there would be war everywhere. But we did have wars because of the Bible and God. Like the three Crusades. But I still think we have less that we would without a Bible or other religions. At least some good came out of it. But religion still weakens the mind. If you believe in God you are gullable. You can't or don't want to see the truth. Hoping god will save you from all your misfortunes. Most people believe in him only when they need something. When they are all fine and dandy they might thank him. But until they need something the though of God never crosses their mind. So much for faith. They just need and need so they take and take.
And lets not forget the stories in the Bible. Noah's Ark for example. I mean, really? Does anyone else see the holes in that story? There is no way Noah could take on a job of that magnitude. I mean, how old was he? Where did all the wood come from? How long did he have to take to build that? How did two of every single animal from ALL over the world Magically make it's way to Noah's ark? And don't some animals eat other animals? They need food to survive. I mean come on. Too many holes in the stories. That's all I have to say about that.
I probably have many typos but I'm too lazy to reread this and fix them.
Matthew 5:17 �Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.
That's the one I was thinking of.
I can't say I know the inner workings of the bible and everything about it. And I don't want to know.
I would recommend learning. It can be very fascinating.
the only good thing that has come out of the Bible is a few movies with a "God" concept.
Actually there are quite a number of good and great works of fiction that were inspired by the Bible many of which have nothing o do with God directly.
We don't even believe in god the way the puritans did. That died out long ago.
I believe we call them extremists now.
But I still think we have less that we would without a Bible or other religions.
Not sure if I agree here. Yes we would most definitely still have war but I'm not sure if it would be more, less , or the same.
Does anyone else see the holes in that story?
I see many, many holes in that story big enough to ride an arc through.
Many like to then say this story and others that just make no sense are just metaphors. But this is often very arbitrary on what is and is not metaphor, which means we could possibly see the whole thing as metaphor. If that is the case then we could then say God is just a metaphor.
Have you ever heard of Satan? He was/is trying to wreck all of God's plans, and be in control. Hell was his creation to stop people from going to God.
Interesting, since Satan was once the angel Lucifer, and the Bible states that only man has free will. Ergo, for Lucifer to rebel, and the other angels who followed him, God must have made him do so. From that we can conclude that God made Satan and thus evil. However if God is all good then he wouldn't have made evil.
Of course, you always hear that, and it all seems rubbish, but have you actually tried it?
Yep, I have. And interestingly enough I have exactly the same odds of having my prayer answered if I pray to a screwdriver.
God created those animals; don't you think he could easily make them do those sort of things
That relies on too many premises which are unproven and more likely than not false. Sorry, I don't buy fairy tales. Now if you have some evidence then that's a different story, and I would gladly recant my position. However all of the evidence we have points to this being impossible rather than having actually happened, so I'm leaning that direction.
Really MR? I'd of thought praying to a screwdriver would be infinitely more useful - especially if you were praying for a means by which to drive screws into objects thereby affixing them in some way to something.
Have you ever heard of Satan? He was/is trying to wreck all of God's plans, and be in control. Hell was his creation to stop people from going to God.
I thought hell was God's punishment tool. (Correct me if I'm wrong)
Why is there death at all? Part of Satan's plan, all against God's will.
Or maybe because our biological systems eventually fail because of telomere degradation which renders our cells incapable of replicating and eventually causes our death. Something like that (I'm probably missing a couple of processes).
prayer can bless you and the people around you; just make sure what you're asking about has good motives (James 4). Be thankful and have a cheerful heart. Of course, you always hear that, and it all seems rubbish, but have you actually tried it?
There are other ways to be moral appreciative, other than through religious motivation.
God created those animals; don't you think he could easily make them do those sort of things, or do you think the bear would complain and slash his claws and try to bite Noah?
I would argue that evolution is the origin of species. And how do you suppose that God commanded all these animals?
Have you ever heard of Satan? He was/is trying to wreck all of God's plans, and be in control. Hell was his creation to stop people from going to God.
So God should kill Satan and demolish the Hell, assuming God has the power to do so.
Why is there death at all? Part of Satan's plan, all against God's will.
The problem is, why can Satan be against God's will? Are Satan and God equal in power?
prayer can bless you and the people around you; just make sure what you're asking about has good motives (James 4). Be thankful and have a cheerful heart. Of course, you always hear that, and it all seems rubbish, but have you actually tried it?
http://www.darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin2008-16.html
http://www.darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin2006-02.html
God created those animals; don't you think he could easily make them do those sort of things, or do you think the bear would complain and slash his claws and try to bite Noah?
Then why didn't He just use thunder to demolish every building and zap every sinners?
Then why didn't He just use thunder to demolish every building and zap every sinners?
You mean the being who can bring at least two of every animal in the world to one location despite certain environments preventing many of them from surviving the journey, cramming them all into a ship that is clearly far to small, keeping them all from eating/killing each other, finding a way to keep them alive for forty days and forty nights under storm conditions the likes of which were never seen on this planet before or since, increasing the over all amount of water on the entire planet to fill everywhere, while still keeping fresh and salt water at levels so the fish could survive, then somehow making all this extra water vanish leaving absolutely no geological evidence, and having every species on the planet show no genetic sight of being brought down to such a low population... And you think he could have just 'ZAPPED' all the sinners instead!?
Clearly such a plan would be far to imperfect then an overly complicated one that would likely result in hardship and suffering to everyone who actually didn't deserve punishment and lived and require vast amount of magical intervention at a number of levels.
like to touch up on some thoughts o satan. HE had free will, as of all angels. the thing that we got over them was teh abilty of fogiveness. God banished satan to hell, im sure it doesnt feel great for him
Many like to then say this story and others that just make no sense are just metaphors. But this is often very arbitrary on what is and is not metaphor, which means we could possibly see the whole thing as metaphor. If that is the case then we could then say God is just a metaphor.
As I like to think of it. But the morals in the bible are the meaning of the whole metaphor.
But the morals in the bible are the meaning of the whole metaphor.
And what morals are those, exactly?
And what morals are those, exactly?
Don't you think that the answer, or what would the Christians answer, is obvious?
Don't you think that the answer, or what would the Christians answer, is obvious?
Well, to a point. However what I run into difficulty with is that the Bible puts forth a list of morals, then tells story after story in which those morals are violated for one reason or another and yet gives us to guideline on how to determine when we should or should not adhere to these morals, if at all. So what is the point of giving us a moral guide without telling us how to follow it? It seems to me like it makes it a moot point and complete waste of time.
Well, to a point. However what I run into difficulty with is that the Bible puts forth a list of morals, then tells story after story in which those morals are violated for one reason or another and yet gives us to guideline on how to determine when we should or should not adhere to these morals, if at all. So what is the point of giving us a moral guide without telling us how to follow it? It seems to me like it makes it a moot point and complete waste of time.
That and some of the "morals" listen in the Bible order you to break other, actual, morals, such as the many stonings.
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