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kiddslayer12
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kiddslayer12
70 posts
Nomad

I am a christian, i and i strongly belive in my lord jesus christ, and i also belive that if you belive in him and except him as your savior, u will go to heaven. and i also believe that he created the world, not the big bang, or that we came from stupid apes.

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thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,821 posts
Farmer

i am a christian and i strongly believe

STFU!! If you an't contribute to the argument then just shut up and don't post.

How was it a natural disaster? It couldn't have been a volcano because there were no volcanoes around. It couldn't have only been an earthquake because stuff was burned. It wasn't a meteor shower. Meteors sre way below freezing when they are in space. When they go through the atmosphere, the outside heats up and burns. If they make it to the ground at all, the hot parts are all burned up, leaving a cold rock for people to look at. If you ask me, cold rocks can't burn down cities.

Why is it that the burning of a city have to be from God? It's just senseless. Out of the laundry list of sensible interpretations, you have to say that an omniscient being that can construct an entire delicate balance of existence, but can't make a woman from scratch? Also, the entire meteorite heats up. Ever heard of temperature transfer? If a meteorite ever falls in your backyard, run out and touch it immediately. If you don't get burned, then you are correct. But I guarantee that moving at hundreds of miles a minute while bumping up against thick gases AND having your exterior burned will make for a hot rock. Besides, there are definitely things that are missing from he Bible's account of it. Ever heard of arson?
Aaroniscool
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Aaroniscool
254 posts
Nomad

STFU!! If you an't contribute to the argument then just shut up and don't post.


Ouch, little harsh, don't ya think?

bowing down to idols doesn't make a person wicked at all


True, however bowing (in sincere worship) to an idol is directly rejecting God as one's savior.

Why is it that the burning of a city have to be from God?


Well, in that particular instance, God said it was going to happen and it happened to the cities that God said he would destroy. Coincidence?

p.s. I don't know if they had candles back then so if they didn't just insert a different random naked flame.


They had oil lamps =)
necromancer
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necromancer
750 posts
Peasant

This tangent you guys are arguing about is hilarious.

Can't we just agree that if an omnipotent god actually did exist then he could burn what he wanted? These stories were just created to convince people through fear to follow the Jewish religion, they don't have to be true.

thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,821 posts
Farmer

Ouch, little harsh, don't ya think?

Sometimes it is not deft persuasion that does the trick, it is blunt scolding

I agree that it is a hilarious tangent to argue, and yes they are just stories to bully people into religious submission. To quote Bruce Almighty, hearing these deeds of "God" makes me think that we're all ants and that God is sitting on the ant hill with a magni-frying glass.
Quite frankly, I don't think that religion is an appropriate way to touch the concept of God, no matter how long the pole is. It's obviously just a collection of stories made up by people. If the theory of God is true, then God would be infinitely intelligent, and could only be adequately explained in a scientific manner. Religion is basically just an over-simplifying lens, if you ask me.
Strop
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Strop
10,816 posts
Bard

Killing in the name of God and killing because God directly told you to kill are two different things.


One is advised not to actually believe this. Partially because it makes one look like a total nutjob with no credibility.

Fundies just don't make a good name for themselves, you know?
FireflyIV
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FireflyIV
3,224 posts
Nomad

@ fourtytwo

You still have not answered one of my questions.

God gave mankind free will to choose to worship him or not. Why punish them with death. Won't they go to hell if they are wickid anyway?

Merciless_Mercenary
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Merciless_Mercenary
446 posts
Nomad

@ firefly
Hell a.k.a outer darkness is only for the one third that were driven out of heaven those namely who chose to follow Satan. Everyone on earth chose to follow God and therefore enjoy the mortal earthly experience until judgment comes.God gave us free agency a.k.a freedom to choose and with that comes the consequences of our actions so we will only be judged by our own actions and God always forgives us if we ask with sincerity and true remorse.

Everyone has the right to worship whom, where and what they may according to the dictates of their own conscience.

Zootsuit_riot
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Zootsuit_riot
1,523 posts
Nomad

@ firefly
Hell a.k.a outer darkness is only for the one third that were driven out of heaven those namely who chose to follow Satan. Everyone on earth chose to follow God and therefore enjoy the mortal earthly experience until judgment comes.God gave us free agency a.k.a freedom to choose and with that comes the consequences of our actions so we will only be judged by our own actions and God always forgives us if we ask with sincerity and true remorse.

Everyone has the right to worship whom, where and what they may according to the dictates of their own conscience.


I'm still not seeing an answer to his question...
fourtytwo
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fourtytwo
698 posts
Nomad

If you don't get burned, then you are correct. But I guarantee that moving at hundreds of miles a minute while bumping up against thick gases AND having your exterior burned will make for a hot rock.
Some guys did some research on this recently. The rock actually goes through the atmosphere so fast that the interior doesn't have time to heat up.
God gave mankind free will to choose to worship him or not. Why punish them with death. Won't they go to hell if they are wicked anyway?
Yes, they will go to hell. God gave them a shortcut :P I have to admit I wouldn't know why God would do that. Sometimes, it is just too hard for me to understand His ways.
One is advised not to actually believe this. Partially because it makes one look like a total nutjob with no credibility.
Why not? What is the rest of the reason? Why does it make me look like a nutjob with no credibility?
Talo
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Talo
945 posts
Nomad

because unlike most nutjobs, the rest of the sane people consider people who hear voices in their heads.... NUTS.

thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,821 posts
Farmer

Yes, they will go to hell. God gave them a shortcut :P I have to admit I wouldn't know why God would do that. Sometimes, it is just too hard for me to understand His ways.

I don't think that accepting God should really matter with getting into heaven, because a good person deserves to be treated well. I think that bad Christians should go to hell, and good atheists should go to heaven. Perhaps judged by God's perspective of morality? Who knows.
--------
My overall point is that the Bible paints God as perfect and just, and that he wrote the Bible, yet the Bible is filled with stories of genocide of innocents at the hand of God, by God. He states in the Bible rules that, according to fourtytwo, are only for the Israelites; i.e. genocide of all different religions they encounter, yet in Leviticus it says that everyone must follow every rule, meaning that we should too. If I desperately wanted to, I could poke hundreds of holes in the logic of the Christian God. Like this:
Bible: "God am perfect and just."
Me: "Did God give us free will?"
Bible: "Yes."
Me: "Free will to choose to worship God or not?"
Bible: "Yes."
Me: "Is God infinitely forgiving and loving?"
Bible: "Yes."
Me: "Then why does God send us to burn in an eternal lake of excruciating flame for exercising the free will that He gave us to not worship Him?
Bible: "Because you made a mistake, were imperfect, and deserve it."
Me: "Whatever happened to the infinite forgiveness and love? Isn't that a severe punishment for being human, like God designed us? Why punish us for being how God created us?"
Bible: "You have questioned God, and sinned. Repent!"
Me: "answer the question, please."
Bible: (Insert viable answer here)
Me: T_T
It's just that if God is as God says He is, then humans would not go to hell. He would forgive. He wouldn't punish severely.
Deth666
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Deth666
653 posts
Nomad

It's just that if God is as God says He is, then humans would not go to hell. He would forgive. He wouldn't punish severely.


only problem is that you have to repent for your sins you have to actually be sorry for sinning your not just automatically forgiven
thisisnotanalt
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thisisnotanalt
9,821 posts
Farmer

But that would mean that his forgiveness is limited, not infinite like the Bible says it is.

fourtytwo
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fourtytwo
698 posts
Nomad

(Insert viable answer here)
God created us for a purpose, to glorify Him, and we were given some rules to follow, even though we had free will. We broke those rules and now deserve death. After Christ came and died for us, all we had to do was ask for forgiveness.
only problem is that you have to repent for your sins you have to actually be sorry for sinning your not just automatically forgiven
fourtytwo
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fourtytwo
698 posts
Nomad

But that would mean that his forgiveness is limited, not infinite like the Bible says it is.
How is it limited? All that means is that God is giving us a choice. Either we accept His forgiveness, or we reject it.
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