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Forums → WEPR → Should We use the death Penalty?

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thepyro222
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thepyro222
2,150 posts
Peasant

Juat thought I'd revive this topic. What does the AG universe think?

  • 232 Replies
grimml
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grimml
879 posts
Nomad

It -would- be cheaper, if not for all the bureaucracy of it.

But you need that bureaucracy because you can't kill somebody of you're not 100% sure that he's guilty.

One death penalty case costs about 2.3 milliond dollars in Texas. That's 3 times as much as 40 years of prison would cost. In Florida it's about 3.2 million dollars. It's so expensive because of the huge procedural costs with the many experts, the complicated selection of the jury and most proceedings (about 90-95% according to Professor James Liebman from Columbia University) aren't succesfull with the death penalty, which means people get a life sentence. So the State has to pay for the costs of a death penalty case (which is much higher than a normal proceeding) AND a life sentence.
The State of New Jersey released a law concerning the death penalty that costs 16 millions a year and fired 500 cops which could prevent crimes.

(Here's the source of the numbers but it's in German.)
Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

But you need that bureaucracy because you can't kill somebody of you're not 100% sure that he's guilty.


Many times, it's kinda friggin obvious that they did it. Many of them just appeal for life sentences if there's the death penalty in the state. And then the whole what, 10-20 years they are waiting to actually recieve the penalty, they are constantly trying to appeal.
grimml
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grimml
879 posts
Nomad

As of February 2004, 113 inmates had been found innocent and released from death row. More than half of these have been released in the last 10 years. That means one person has been exonerated for every eight people executed.

A study by Columbia University professor James Liebman examined thousands of capital sentences that had been reviewed by courts in 34 states from 1973 to 1995. ""An astonishing 82 percent of death row inmates did not deserve to receive the death penalty,"" he said in his conclusion. ""One in twenty death row inmates is later found not guilty.""

The vast majority of those exonerated were found innocent because someone came forward to confess committing the crime; key witness testimony was found to be illegitimate; or new evidence was found to support innocence.


Source (this time in English)
Masterforger
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Masterforger
1,824 posts
Peasant

The way I'm beginning to see it, revenge and justice are little different. Sure, justice keeps people safe. ish. But execution is a more... permanent.... solution.

Arjan
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Arjan
41 posts
Nomad

I think people can change, give them a chance after 10 years.

Also, killing someone isn't really making him/her suffer, locking him/her up for 40 years is. Heck, he/she has some time to think about his crime

randomcanadian
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randomcanadian
7 posts
Nomad

You really need to be careful with the death penalty.

MasterAwsuko
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MasterAwsuko
74 posts
Nomad

Honestly, no. Although some may believe the term "an eye for an eye" justifies death penalties, as in kill and be killed for punishment, it's just as bad as the offender. Killing the offender wouldn't teach him anything. It would only justify his/her madness in such a screwed up society.

Sonatavarius
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Sonatavarius
1,322 posts
Farmer

I don't even need the offender to have killed someone to justify putting them to death. ...but the court system might. I don't pursue the notion of an eye for an eye. Unless you want to put them into a solitary confinement cell the rest of their lives (with nothing but what is essential to sustaining life), then there are certain people that just need to die. ...those men who just want to watch the world burn, for example. I keep seeing, "killing them solves nothing!!!"... it solves the problem of them doing it again inside or outside of jail. ..just saying.

Masterforger
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Masterforger
1,824 posts
Peasant

Oooooh! Solitary confinement! Let them go slowly insane! I love it! I'm going for solitary confinement as the main punishment.

Sonatavarius
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Sonatavarius
1,322 posts
Farmer

D:... but we can't have that, Masterforger. People have the right to socialize!!! (and possibly shiv each other)

Masterforger
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Masterforger
1,824 posts
Peasant

Criminals are hardly people. If they weren't aware of the consequences, serves 'em right! The law was made for a reason.

Masterforger
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Masterforger
1,824 posts
Peasant

If you chose to break the law, and then was caught, say, for murder, solitary confinement is the perfect solution. At least for repeat offenders.

Sonatavarius
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Sonatavarius
1,322 posts
Farmer

Criminals are all people. Everyone has some reason behind their actions. Again, prison will keep people safe, and death is NOT a successful deterrent, so why bother?


Just because people have reasons doesn't make these reasons noble or commendable. Some people get their jollies off of watching their victims writhe in pain and bleed out. They cherish the mutilation of their victims. ...or the child molester who repeatedly hurts children. These people hide what they do, so they know that there are consequences... and they know they are hurting people.

Are you going to build and man more jails? We don't have the space as it is. If you wanted to put them in straight jackets and strap them to a bed with a feeding tube for the rest of their lives, then go for it. In this way, we can fill room after room with tons of convicts that won't ever shiv each other. Solves the problems of jail and limited space.

I don't care about the deterring. I think that there are people out there who are so terrible that they need to be put down. There are people who fight and kill in prison just to fight and kill. There are people that would hurt you just because you exist (and I think are female). These people can also escape from prison and continue to hurt people. What I care about is that person can no longer hurt people. If he wanted to live a care free free life, then he should've thought about that before he did what he did.
Masterforger
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Masterforger
1,824 posts
Peasant

YAY!!!!!!! Someone who agrees with the permanent way o solving problems!

grimml
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grimml
879 posts
Nomad

If you chose to break the law, and then was caught, say, for murder, solitary confinement is the perfect solution. At least for repeat offenders.

Solitary confinment is a form of psychological torture. So I'd say it's only a solution in the extreme cases (to protect other inmates).

Are you going to build and man more jails? We don't have the space as it is. If you wanted to put them in straight jackets and strap them to a bed with a feeding tube for the rest of their lives, then go for it. In this way, we can fill room after room with tons of convicts that won't ever shiv each other. Solves the problems of jail and limited space.

If you worry about space you should maybe ask yourself why the crime rate is so high in the USA. The homicide rate for example is more than 5 times as high as in Germany, Ireland or the Netherlands. You have the highest rate of imprisoned people (except for China, their numbers aren't clear).
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/US_incarceration_timeline-clean.svg
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