Forums → WEPR → [necro] Why you don't believe in God?

yeah we kinda went over this, so if anyone feels like arguing it they can just look over the recent pages and not waste this guy's time.

THANK YOU.

Lol.

I don't like doing the same argument back-to-back.

i hate going over the same things, especially when it comes to religion.

firefly: how can you say that portraying opinion as fact is crossing the line? that's complete bull. stating your opinion as a fact is Debate 101.

I said this earlier - that's not necessarily true. You're assuming that omnipotent has a limit; it doesn't. If something is omnipotent, it can literally do anything. An omnipotent being could create a rock it couldn't lift, and still be omnipotent. Because if an omnipotent being exists, that being is above logic and therefore immune to fallacies. Of course, an omnipotent being most likely doesn't exist.

Well what I was trying to get at is the very concept of omnipotence is in itself a fallacy.

Has anyone talked about physics yet? I'm sorry, but I tried reading through the fifty pages and only got to about 10 before I skipped ahead.

Anyway, I'm not claiming to be an expert on anything at all, but physics requires a prime mover. Nothing can be in motion without having been set in motion.

Now, some people claim that God is the prime mover, but the theory doesn't really allow for that, because what put God into motion? You know, who created the creator?

It's kind of an endless loop, because no matter what belief one has, there is always the question of, "What came before?"

Well, in theory, the prime mover was the Primeval Atom reaching critical mass and decompressing. It was very volatile, and after a while it couldn't sustain such a small size and it decompressed - and the decompression was powerful enough to set in motion the newly-released gases.

I have always found it funny, the image of God as some old guy with a long beard, sitting on a cloud and throwing lightning bolts down on Earth.

Now, I am not an atheist, but I am by no means religious.

By my understanding, the idea of God is just the idea of what created our universe. People who follow most common religions are unable to concede in their faith that this God may not have been some all-powerful being, but rather a simple atom; matter from which our universe was created.

Once again, forgive my lack of expertise, but I have heard of the "God particle," the particle from which matter and anti-matter were created, thus creating our universe. Perhaps this is not actually God, because its existence implies that something existed before it, but it's probably as close to God as humans will ever comprehend. I'm not too concerned with what created existence, but I do believe that our universe was created in the Big Bang, and that the atom that sparked said Bang was, in fact, God. Not in the omnipotent, bearded-watcher idea of the word, but in the idea that this atom created life as we know it.

This can all be proven and disproven at the same time by the theory of relativity, of course. You can say nothing actually exists, thus nothing would have to exist to have started us. That's just a cop out, though.

Now, some people claim that God is the prime mover, but the theory doesn't really allow for that, because what put God into motion? You know, who created the creator?

That is a version of the Ultimate Boeing 747 theory. We as humans will look at a clock and will then say think someone had to create it. So it is easy of us to then apply that logic so that God created us but then he would have to have had a creator and so on to infinitum. It's not a fantastic argument really but you can add it on top of all the other Atheistic evidence and build a strong argument.

It really is a poor argument, because it doesn't allow for an end unless one has a firm belief in God, and would content themselves by saying he is the beginning.

Because, if you think about it, whether atheist or believer, that argument will go on forever. Like the child who keeps asking his mother, "Why?" you can keep asking what came before. You know, what came before the Big Bang? And before that? Etc., etc.

I wasn't actually trying to make that point, though, I was just posing it for discussion.

You know, what came before the Big Bang?

Seeing time and space started with the big bang there is not such thing as before the big bang. Kinda a head trip, huh?

But, the Big Bang was influenced, it was caused by something else. Thus existence was before the Big Bang. It is my belief that the Big Bang created only our universe, that there was existence before it.

Seeing time and space started with the big bang there is not such thing as before the big bang. Kinda a head trip, huh?

Do you not get those moments where you just think how are you actually here? What if you weren't? What if what a giraffe looked to you looked completely different to me? What if that colour orange looked completely different to you than to me. It's a strange way to think about things as we are never sure how other people actually view the world.