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Forums → Support Forum → Suggestion : overall justice system
| 43 | 5584 |
Now, I don't want to tell you guys how to do your jobs, but this is a suggestion. This suggestion will regard mainly the way to deal with all infractions based on messages (spamming, trolling, flaming, excessive swering and use of slurs, etc)
If this does not interrest you, you may not read the rest and I will respect that.
Now I am basing these suggestions based on the fact that this community is growing.
1.Ban system.
I understand, correct me if I'm wrong, someone makes a complaint if the moderators feel that there should be something done here, then they ban the person for the reason they feel is correct.
I would suggest a system where you have a section opened to the public, where you can post a ban request. Then, send an Email to the person with the ban. if they feel like it, they can appeal and get a "fair trial".
2. De-Merit system
If you get a ban, there should be a system to keep track of those things and it may or may not decrease your points (opposite of Merits) and this can also display publically who have commited these infractions to keep an extra eye on them.
3. Rules
I have read and understand the rules of the forum and i personally would raffine them. For example, the rule about not complaining if you got banned, just makes the staff here look bias in my opinion. I understand that you don't want to get harassed all day by someone who got banend, but that's the way it works. And hey, if they got a fair trial what do they have to cry about?
Another example would be the anti-spam rule. Now I understand you have a 30 second wait period, wich just pisses off the spammer, but doen't stop him. If you don't believe it, check my profile. Now spam may have many different meanings or definitions to different people, meaning you will have to explain more precisely the meaning of the term.
4. Spam/Flaming section
No one is immuned from spamming or flaming, especially forums. my suggestion to you would simply be to give a section entirely to spamming and flaming (either light flaming or excessive flaming) will have to be contented in this section. That way, people who feel the need to do so, can in the appropriate place and the appropriate time, reducing flaming greatly in all other places ( I can tell you from my personnal experience where n a forum we had a section for flamer's high horse)
5. A search Bar inside the forums
Every time I want to either learn about something or want to create a new topic and I don't know if it already exist. This will also make it easyer to track old posts you've posted in.
Also having a page with all the members when you want to find someone with ease.
That will be all for now. I have kept all my suggestions as brief as possible and if you wish I could further explain or develop these suggestions.
I would like to appologise for any mistakes or mis-usage of certain words as English is not my first language.
Thanks for your time.
BlooodBath.
- 43 Replies
 I would suggest a system where you have a section opened to the public, where you can post a ban request. Then, send an Email to the person with the ban. if they feel like it, they can appeal and get a "fair trial".
How would this be different from just knowing who to contact and having them decide?
1.Ban system.
I understand, correct me if I'm wrong, someone makes a complaint if the moderators feel that there should be something done here, then they ban the person for the reason they feel is correct.
I would suggest a system where you have a section opened to the public, where you can post a ban request. Then, send an Email to the person with the ban. if they feel like it, they can appeal and get a "fair trial".
I suppose in some degree.. it's fair, but why? The person who is getting banned knows why thy are getting banned, so why have a trial?
3. Rules
They are fair and good the way they are.
4. Spam/Flaming section
No one is immuned from spamming or flaming, especially forums. my suggestion to you would simply be to give a section entirely to spamming and flaming (either light flaming or excessive flaming) will have to be contented in this section. That way, people who feel the need to do so, can in the appropriate place and the appropriate time, reducing flaming greatly in all other places ( I can tell you from my personnal experience where n a forum we had a section for flamer's high horse)
Why do this when spam and flaming is already frowned upon? This will actually just make it worse and there is no point in making just one section for flaming and spamming.
5. A search Bar inside the forums
This has to be the only one I agree with.. this is because I don't want to go through a section then get to te thread, then click the link and then search.. Why take up my time? As for having all the members on one page to see if they are offline or whatever.. They used to have it. They took it down due to lag.
Agh, submit button went in text box, I'm using mobile.
- there are too many different decisions and too little mods for each to have a "trial".
2. De-Merit system
If you get a ban, there should be a system to keep track of those things and it may or may not decrease your points (opposite of Merits) and this can also display publically who have commited these infractions to keep an extra eye on them.
Sure there could be a tracking system, but not publicly or subtracting AP. Publicly would cause flamings & discrimination & prejudice & stuffs. Subtracting is justa no-no, unless they revoke for the cause of spam or something.
3. Rules
I have read and understand the rules of the forum and i personally would raffine them. For example, the rule about not complaining if you got banned, just makes the staff here look bias in my opinion. I understand that you don't want to get harassed all day by someone who got banend, but that's the way it works. And hey, if they got a fair trial what do they have to cry about?
Another example would be the anti-spam rule. Now I understand you have a 30 second wait period, wich just pisses off the spammer, but doen't stop him. If you don't believe it, check my profile. Now spam may have many different meanings or definitions to different people, meaning you will have to explain more precisely the meaning of the term.
The mods and admins interpret the rules to their own free will, if you're that persistent with denying a mod's claim take it up with an administrator; if it's an administrator, too bad so sad. They make the rules.
There will always be spam. The general rule used is less than 7 words is spam.
4. Spam/Flaming section
No one is immuned from spamming or flaming, especially forums. my suggestion to you would simply be to give a section entirely to spamming and flaming (either light flaming or excessive flaming) will have to be contented in this section. That way, people who feel the need to do so, can in the appropriate place and the appropriate time, reducing flaming greatly in all other places ( I can tell you from my personnal experience where n a forum we had a section for flamer's high horse)
Wouldn't tempers flair up more in other categories BECAUSE there is a flaming section? Another no-no. If you want to flame, take it out of AG.
5. A search Bar inside the forums
Every time I want to either learn about something or want to create a new topic and I don't know if it already exist. This will also make it easyer to track old posts you've posted in.
Also having a page with all the members when you want to find someone with ease.
There is a search, look through the stickies in this section.
Ban system: Five Point infraction system. How this would work would be like this:
1st Infraction - Warning
2nd Infraction - Week Ban
3rd Infraction - Month Ban
4th Infraction - Warning
5th Infraction - Year Ban
I doubt anyone would want to come back after a year, but if they do want to, they should. I also think the warning on the 4th offense would be a little break from the bans. If it is a less serious offense, like a newbie accidentally spamming, then they should just get a warning.
The appeal process should be by e-mail. The banned person would e-mail an appeal to any moderator, and the moderators would review the appeal to determine if they should be banned or not. Appeals asking for clemency in bans less than a year would be ignored. Appeals stating the moderators decision was unjust and explaining their side of the story would be accepted.
The flaming/spamming section is TERRIBLE. No person should be flamed, that's called cyber bullying. A Spamland would be better, so the mods have a place to move spam threads.
I thought it'd, be,
1: Warning
2: 1 or 3 day ban
3: week ban
4: probably another week ban
5: Perma' ban
Or if you plagiarize, it can be led to a week ban or perma ban, without warning. Trolling/flaming, will most likely you get a warning. Advertising is not welcome here either. I'm not sure about the ban system for that though. Most of the rules, have their own ban system.
If Cenny or Zoph comes here, they'll explain, "much better".
If Cenny or Zoph comes here, they'll explain, "much better".Gladly, in about ten hours. Damn school. But yeah, I definitely have something to say here if someone else haven't said it by the time I get back online.
1.Ban system.
Works fine. People report stuff (openly) on the profiles, and the ban is kept where it belongs. Sending a ban via email seems to be unnecessary, because the reason for the ban is displayed when you try to log in anyway.
As for appeal: We would not be mods if we couldn't handle the "ower" of choosing whether a user should be banned or not. So logically, our judgements are fair. We don't go about banning left and right, and for most parts, unless you are a repeat troll or a spam account (both types of account where the user doesn't care if or why they are banned anyway), you will most likely get a warning beforehand. Of course, there might be issues where the ban falls promptly (a user making a thread and links to scam sites, exploits the site, breaks the TaC), but otherwise, a user would have been warned, and the ban would be because they continue to break the rules.
Besides, if you were banned, no matter how fair it was, you would still appeal to get a fair trial, wouldn't you? Breaking the rules after the warning is either conscious (thus, ban should be issued) or really, really thoughtlessly done (and a ban should be issued to get the user to understand the rules).
2. De-Merit system
AP is a measure of activity on the site. You loose points when your comments or posts are deleted, but otherwise not, because it is a display of your activity.
If such a system was to become a reality, the point system should be entirely redone.
3. Rules
1. The stickies are being redone in order to make the information available and to make them more precise.
2. The help-page and "rules and guidelines" should be redone as well.
As for the 30 seconds rule: It at least limits the damage. And pissed off spammers are better than happy spammers, because happy spammers can spam more.
4. Spam/Flaming section
No.
Spamming is against the rules on the entire site. Same goes with flaming. It should not happen. At all.
This means a section for crap would be heavily moderated, and people would get banned even if they are doing it only in that section. This is the internet, people are idiots, people will take flaming serious and be offended, people will go "But it is allowed theeereeee".
To give you an example: There was a thread made for flaming for fun. Most of the participants got banned because they were flaming. There is no "for fun" in swearing at other people or calling them names.
To recap: As long as spamming and flamming is against the overall rules, such sections, threads, comments, you name it, will be acted on and removed, and the participants punished.
5. A search Bar inside the forums
Had that, didn't work. Most searches don't, because they are of the "quick'n'dirty" type.
Use the custom one.
Also having a page with all the members when you want to find someone with ease.
If you know their username, you can find them a lot easier than looking on a list.
Besides, as said, people are idiots. The active userbase is rather limited, and a list would give a wonderful source for spammers to find un-used accounts and gain points by spamming those.
1st Infraction - Warning
2nd Infraction - Week Ban
3rd Infraction - Month Ban
4th Infraction - Warning
5th Infraction - Year Ban
No, please.
Say your first - crime is to post links to scam sites. By that one, you should only be warned. Then a moderator find that you have been flaming someone in a fit of anger. This would give you a week. Then you have been seen necroing a few threads. Congratulations you just got a month.
Or you spam about a bit, being a newbie. You are warned. You end up in a conversation, and spam again. A week. You get back, and a mod find out you have been less than good at writing comments, and thus spamming. Say hello to a month.
You get tired of mods being incredibly unfair, create and alt account and post a lot of porn links, porn images, and everything you can find on the Offended-page. You get a warning....
Just saying there is a reason mods are humans, and not robots. The users are humans too.
Lalalalalallalaaa.
Alright then, I see why this system is the way it is and that's just fine. To me it feels under-developped and like Russia in the time of Ivan the Terrible. But if everyone is ok with this on these forums, all I can do is adapt. The way I see this, Mods here are god, you mess with them you get banned. I could get banned for this coment for all I know.
I could show you the message of how poor, in my opinion, a ban they have sent out was. Basically mis-targeting the whole point.
But hey, if that's the way you guys work around here, all i can do is adapt.
The way I see this, Mods here are god, you mess with them you get banned. I could get banned for this coment for all I know.This is technically true, however: We have all been picked for the mod position because the devs trust us to act fairly and according to the site rules.
An important thing Cen forgot to mention (although saying pretty much everything I would have otherwise) is that you can always complain via the Contact link.
If you have been banned and find it unjust, you can send a message to the site's staff (not the moderators, the actual we-get-paid staff if I've understood correctly). You can do this too if you believe a moderator is treating you or someone else unfairly. You can also report a moderator to another moderator. We will take action if the complaint is justified, but I have a feeling you'd trust the Contact link more.
Mods here are god, you mess with them you get banned
Uhm... This is the reason why we have so few mods. To make sure that doesn't happen. More specifically, if you mess with a mod, it won't be that mod banning you.
If you have problems with mods harassing you, you should go to another mod, or Carlie. Mods have been banned for being jerks to users, and those were single issues a long time ago.
If it is such a problem to you, perhaps you should go suggest it to the actual staff, and not in the forums where the mods and users will pick it down and curl it up.
You could also just leave, if it is such a problem?
To me it feels under-developped and like Russia in the time of Ivan the Terrible.
It works, and it works well. No need for fixing something that has worked well for a long time, just because something else has worked somewhere else?
We have a fairly simple forum, with a few selected mods and a staff that mainly works on games. Having reputation, emoticons, fourteen fonts, sixteen sizes, a hundred and seven colours... It would seem... Overwhelming to say the least.
Trust me when I say we mods would want a few extra tools to work with. The system isn't perfect, but no one can work with a perfect system...
As for your question: If people want a reply, but their messages are closed, it is their problem all together, that they doesn't get a reply. In most urgent cases, you could reply through your own comments, but it should not happen repeatedly, nor should it be done out of simply chatting about with another user.
Say your first - crime is to post links to scam sites. By that one, you should only be warned. Then a moderator find that you have been flaming someone in a fit of anger. This would give you a week. Then you have been seen necroing a few threads. Congratulations you just got a month.
Or you spam about a bit, being a newbie. You are warned. You end up in a conversation, and spam again. A week. You get back, and a mod find out you have been less than good at writing comments, and thus spamming. Say hello to a month.
You get tired of mods being incredibly unfair, create and alt account and post a lot of porn links, porn images, and everything you can find on the Offended-page. You get a warning....
You don't understand. You only need to break the rules five times to get a year ban. Infractions are expire after a year. There would be no case where someone spams twice and gets the same punishment twice.
Spaming - Warning
Flaming - Week Ban
Illegal Site Links - Month Ban
Trolling - Warning
Spamming - Year Ban
Get it?
Uhm, Kevin... The examples given are using it like it's written there, I don't think you needed to explain it.
You only need to break the rules five times to get a year ban.
You don't get it either, then. Is there anything fair in getting a year long ban for necroing a few threads or spam by accident?
And not all alts are noticed, sadly. This means the offender would simply make a new account, and go ruin the site entirely... And get a warning, by your system, because it would be a new user in the system, and we might not notice that it is an alt.
It would be similar to, idk, that you get 15 years for stealing candy, because you have been in jail before. And get out, get a new pasport, and go on a massmurdering spree, and get a slap on the wrist.
As it is now, the punishment fits the crime as well as we can get it to fit.
With that up there, most of our regular users that have been around forever would be at the month long ban, the warning after that, or would be having a year long ban.
Zophia, stop ninjaing me - -;
To explain my own example post (that Kevin quoted):
Scam - Warning
Flaming - Week
Spam - Month
NEW ACCOUNT
Breaking every rules in the TaC down to hacking the accounts of every member and get them into trouble as well, while leaving evidence that you did it, and you hate everyone - 1st warning.
See the problem? Even if the alt is found out, and the original user is punished... They still get only a warning.
I think that post may confuse many people but yes its very true there is a problem there
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