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EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,220 posts
Nomad

I despise the word 'club,' but nothing else describes it. So that's what it is.

Oh yes, and this may be quite an OP. Read very carefully, I'll explain EVERYTHING, including organization, rules, and why we're doing this. These will be static until it needs to be changed, in which case a new thread will be made, with the rules in the OP.

*Note*: This was not put into the forum games because I feel it's a little more than that. It requires complex posting, not a one sentence post that says to nuke them.

If you want the tl;dr version, it's under Review. Although you should read through it at least once, to get knowledge of the finer points.

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I've had this idea for a while, and was inspired by a debate I had a few weeks ago to make this. A Battle Strategy Club, I thought would be a great idea. I'm fairly positive there has been one, maybe others in the past. However, with the organization required to make such a club, or any club with a purpose, they died. I'm trying to make a club that is as sustainable as possible, and let's face it, battle strategy is interesting. One of the most interesting things around, and it is very similar to any strategy game. This club, however, will not abide by standard gaming rules, but rather will be as realistic as possible. War is simply put, be it a small skirmish in Khandahar, or an all out WWII scale invasion, a logistical nightmare. You do not have an infinite amount of troops, nor an infinite amount of munitions. Bombs, guns, even bullets, are not infinite. You must ration, and a simple rule to all invasions is this: An army marches on its stomach. Even food is a priority in warfare.

Fortunately for us, most of these scenarios will not be logistical nightmares. Unless it's an all out invasion, the battles will not be so complex. You should have a limit on munitions, however. Otherwise, you just rain thousands of 155mm artillery shells on them, and no one of your soldiers die. Fairly simple.

I'm not an expert in battle strategy, nor is any of us here. I'm here to get better at strategy, which can and will help me in life as a whole. Making strategic decisions, even on something as innocent as this, is a vital skill. For all you gamers out there, this may also teach you some strategy tips, for use in any RTS game you might play. While flanking doesn't necessarily give you a bonus damage roll, learning to maintain reserves can help you not get destroyed on the hardest difficulties.

Enough of that, that's a long enough forward. Now for the next part.

Organization of the Club

It's a fairly simple organization, tried and tested by the ZSC (Zombie Survival Club), and that's where I will heavily borrow many of the organizational points. It will not be too complex, there will not be ranks, only opinions. Some people are better than others, and may point out to others what a flaw in their battle plan is. Everything is opinionated, so if you want to feel that everyone is equal, that's you, if you want to feel some people are more reliable than others, that's fine too.

To start, there is no predefined 'leader,' other than me. Really, unless something needs administrative work, I'm just another member. I shouldn't need any help, although if I do, I would ask another member to help. It would not be permanent, so don't get you hopes up for becoming vice president. Unless this becomes very large, something I hope will happen but is not likely, it will be just me.

As a general rule, only members can post scenarios. Anyone can answer, and this will help them with becoming a member. Membership is gained simply by me saying so. Anyone can post an answer, and participate in the activities, but to become a full member is my choice. Typically this will happen after one or two successful, or deemed successful battle plans. If you never seem to learn that simply rushing them every time isn't going to work, you're not going to make it.

Scenarios, are a little complex, and should be organized as best to your abilities. Use common sense, and put all needed information, including terrain, enemies, the size of your force, the perceived difficulty, etc. Any information that might effect the battle plan must be included. You don't need to go into detail on every soldier, we don't need to know their favorite color. Just give us a rough picture. 10 guys with AK's, two guys with an RPG, maybe three or four I.E.D.s. Maybe they're all in one trench, maybe some are on a hill. To equate everything, it should be about two or three paragraphs long, unless it's REALLY complex.

That's about it for organization. Nothing terribly difficult. Now for rules, and the last section before my scenario I will give you all. These are simple, and easy to follow.

Rules

1. ABSOLUTELY NO GOD MODDING. I cannot stress this enough. The creator may not god mod, nor may those trying to answer it. You do not have a nuke, and your troops are not Master Chief. If I see this happen, I will see to it that you will not post again in this thread. If this happens, you will receive a warning, and if you are a member will temporarily lose that right. If it happens again, I will request a mod to not allow you to post again, and request you posts from that point on be deleted. This is to help your mind, not make you god.

2. Be courteous or others, especially people who might not be very good at it yet. Everyone was a newbie once too, so don't get into an argument with them over it. This is friendly competition, and I will not stand for it. This is directed at veterans especially, I will revoke membership if you have attained it.

3. This is not a debate club, guys. You can debate the effectiveness of a policy, but don't bring subjective things into this.

That should do for the time being.

Review

1. I am the only leader

2. Membership is attained by my saying so

3. Scenarios should give all required info

4. No god modding, lest you be banned from the thread

5. Courteousness is central to the thread; play nice with newbies

6. Subjective things such as public opinion should be left out of battle plans, and if possible scenarios. For max realism you can use it though.

Simple, isn't it? Just be nice and be serious. Some lulz activities are fine, just don't get carried away with off topic posts. We can have fun, but making fun of mods in your battle plans is a little much.

*This is VERY IMPORTANT*

Scenarios do not have to be realistic. If you want an American invasion in South London, that's fine. If you want Frodo fighting the Roman empire, that's fine too. It can be anything you want, just keep up to a respectable standard. It's fine to be funny, just not fine to be a total idiot.

============================================================

The First Scenario

This is the first scenario. I will try to be as informative as possible, as stated in the Organization section. This is what you will make to try and get in at first. Make a battle plan I'm satisfied with, and it's good. Remember, anyone can give criticism. If I make an unfair decision in your eyes, fight for it and try to sway me. Politely. Make corrections where necessary.

This will be simple, an example really. Average difficulty, and anyone with any knowledge of strategy should be able to do it.

Location: Desert of Iraq

Terrain: A flat, open area with little to no cover anywhere outside of the main base and vehicles.

Enemy Force: A detachment of insurgents, numbering 150 strong, are assaulting a position of coalition forces, made primarily of US and British troops. 70 of them have AK47's or 74's. 20 of them have various other assault weapons, primarily stolen. 5 of them are equipped with RPG-7's. There are around 15 snipers equipped with Dragunov SVD's. 20 of them are poorly armed, having nothing but pistols and a grenade or two. The remaining 20 are equipped with squad based automatic machine guns. They have no body armor or vehicles beyond the trucks they came in.

Your force: Standard issue M16s and L85s. There are about 75 in all, in full battle gear. You are in an entrenched position, forming a crescent around the enemy. You currently have an F16 on stand by with four 500 pound JDAMs. Use them wisely. You have four Humvee's, each equipped with one .50 caliber machine gun, capable of fitting 7 men, and one gunner. You also have an outdated M551 Sheridan. Remember this is a '60s tank, it does not have heavy duty battle armor. Much the like Humvee's, a direct RPG attack is likely to kill it.

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/zz40/EyesoftheSky_2009/bp1.jpg?t=1277862273

I'm not an artist thank you very much.

The insurgents are tightly knit together, whilst the allied troops are heavily dispersed. The two black dots on the right are RPG operators. The two black dots in the back are snipers. It's about 900 yards to them. Use that for scale.

What will you do?

This isn't anything complicated for a reason. I need other people in soon enough to help build up a decent scenario base.

  • 50 Replies
pHacon
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pHacon
1,903 posts
Nomad

I was wondering if this was ever going to be made...

I'll try my hand, this is gonna be a mother.

Call in the JDAMs, priority target is the group of insurgents with RPGs, vehicles are secondary, I'm taking full battle kit as meaning boron-carbide body armor, that should keep 7.62 rounds from an SVD from being lethal.

I keep my troops entrenched at first, moving them into a unit of 20 at the left 30 at the center and one of 25 at the right, those at the right trying from the get to take out enemy RPGs.

Wait until the Falcon has destroyed the enemy vehicles, and attempt to use that as a distraction in which to move my troops.

I move my vehicles (all but the tank and one Humvee) across to the left before the RPGs get at them and push them, along with my left squad of infantry into the enemy vehicle emplacements at the left (or what is left of them), trying to take them out if the Falcon hasn't bombed them yet, or missed (I know JDAMs are accurate, but it would probably be a rushed aim).

Using the tank as cover from the snipers, the right infantry unit will attempt to take out the RPGs if they are still there, or flank the remaining insurgents while the Humvee provides cover for those I have advancing up the center.

Distribution of weapons, I'll have the left and center with mostly M16s, will mainly use for suppressive fire, the right should have mainly SA80s (L85), or the LSW (Light Support Weapon, it features a longer, heavier barrel and a bi-pod for use as a section automatic) variant if it's available, M16s if not.

Hope that's good enough, and if it is, that I'm not rap*d.
Neither Rome: Total War or Empire: Total War can really prepare you for mechanized strategy.

EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,220 posts
Nomad

More than good enough. They're toast.

Not particularly hard, so that's good. You're in.

vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

Before I get started on this. I kind of get bored or lazy at "same points" so the strategy might be messed up.

Here I go!

----------------------

Right now, I'd hold on the JDAMs. As all of my troops are fully geared. I still tell them to keep low. From snipers.

I put some of my infantry troops behind and to the side of the tank to try and help it out. So, I put 2 on the sides. And 2 in the back. Keep in mind that my troops are not really close to the tank. Because if the tank is "RPG'd" it would explode and my 6 troops would be gone.

While talking about that, I entrench my troops. So, I have 69 troops to entrench. 23 in the middle, to the left and right. To balance it out.

The jobs of the trenched are:

The middle: They do whatever they can to knock out enemy forces.
The left and right: Try to take out all of the RPGs and snipers.

If the left and right entrenched troops can't knock out the enemy forces. I use 1 JDAM on them. If it doesn't work then I try a second one. But JDAMs are pretty accurate. Still you never know. Things happen.

As I'm done with the RPGs and snipers. I use that last of my JDAMS to knock out the enemy vehicles. When that is done. As when I order all of my troops to kill all of the "leftover" enemy troops. My tank and the 4 Humvees move in to help.

And pretty much the enemy forces are down. Since those that were weak with the pistols are easy to take out.

Entrenched Weapon Placements:

The middle: Most of them have the M16s. Because they have a job of taking care of everything.

The left and right: They have support weapons. As their jobs are to take out RPG and sniper units.

When the left and right entrenched troops are ordered to take out anything they can. They already have packs of M16s. In a box at the ends of the trench.
-----------------------


I think that's it. This is probably gonna be a bad strategy. Lol... At least I take tries. -_-

Also, sorry IF it's too long haha....

EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,220 posts
Nomad

The left and right: They have support weapons. As their jobs are to take out RPG and sniper units.


I have a slight problem with that. Only the center has a direct line of sight with one set of snipers (the left), and would be left to pick them off.

The rest is fine though. Just clear that bit up, maybe use a JDAM on them.

While they're on hold you could probably have the pilot begin to set in coordinates. Just a suggestion.
pHacon
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pHacon
1,903 posts
Nomad

Ha, I knew the name of this thread sounded familiar...

Earlier Battle Strategy Club.

EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,220 posts
Nomad

Yeah, I knew there was bound to be some in the past somewhere. That one adds more of a role playing aspect though.

vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

I have a slight problem with that. Only the center has a direct line of sight with one set of snipers (the left), and would be left to pick them off.

So, you're saying that the center should be the ones taking out the snipers and RPGs? And the left and right taking out whatever they can?
thoadthetoad
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thoadthetoad
5,633 posts
Peasant

Question: What's the big black line in the middle?

vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

@Thoad

That's probably the trench.

MRWalker82
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MRWalker82
4,005 posts
Shepherd

This is an extremely simplistic scenario.

With a range of ~400 yards to the insurgents with RPG-7s the Ma Deuce's on the nearest hummers would be easily capable of eliminating that threat with short bursts.

The sheridan crew needs to place suppressing fire on the sniper positions while 2 squads move in around the outside flank using a hummer as mobile cover. The other hummer crews should focus on eliminating the other vehicles.

When the RPG threat is eliminated and as the 2 squads are engaging the sniper position the remaining hummer crews will act as mobile cover as the units converge on the enemy location, laying suppressing fire from the M2 as they advance.

The thing to keep in mind is this: entrenching is a time consuming process and leaves you very exposed, especially in a flat and arid environment, so that's not a realistic option.

Also, even with F-16s on standby your air support is typically 3-5 minutes out, and in an engagement like this it will be over in about 2 minutes. Air support is not a viable option.

EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,220 posts
Nomad

This is an extremely simplistic scenario.


I know that. Wasn't aiming for pure reality, just trying out and giving an example for scenarios. I don't want to scare everyone away with an enormous logistical nightmare.

As for your plan, I can't argue it. You're in.

So, you're saying that the center should be the ones taking out the snipers and RPGs? And the left and right taking out whatever they can?


No, just leave the center to deal with that one sniper nest. The rest are fine.

The thing to keep in mind is this: entrenching is a time consuming process and leaves you very exposed, especially in a flat and arid environment, so that's not a realistic option.


Well, you were already entrenched more or less.
MRWalker82
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MRWalker82
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Shepherd

As for your plan, I can't argue it. You're in.


Thanks. Glad I retained some bit of knowledge from the Army

Well, you were already entrenched more or less.


Why the hell would such a small unit be entrenched in the middle of nowhere? Just wondering. It didn't make any sense to me at all.
thoadthetoad
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thoadthetoad
5,633 posts
Peasant

Dang man, that's fairly difficult.
Lemme see what I can do here.

First off, I'll order the JDAM to hit the place with the most soldiers. If it's within the blast radius, I'd order it to attack a few meters behind the closest vehicle (hopefully to disorientate/kill ~5 soldiers according to your handiful map). I'd order a small group of 1 full humvee (all 8 slots taken), as well as about 3 more ... units? Or people? Dunno what to tell them. Anyway, I'd give them m16s and order our light tank to make something of a cover-convoy line. Primary objective would be to take out those RPG buggers.
Once those were taken out I'd get the rest of the humvees (again, fully loaded) to the line, making a diagonal line facing northwest (assuming that up is north on your map). I will assume the JDAM had taken out the snipers from before. I'd use the rest of the forces as reinforcement (if needed).
If heavy losses are found, I'd tell 2 humvees (loaded with 1 gunner, 1 passenger and 1 driver) to pincer the last group of ... insurgents, i think they were?

So, am I good or what's wrong with it?
Other soldiers

vinster132
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vinster132
5,874 posts
Jester

No, just leave the center to deal with that one sniper nest. The rest are fine.

Okay then, it's set to that. The center deals with the one sniper nest. Everything else is already fine.
EnterOrion
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EnterOrion
4,220 posts
Nomad

Why the hell would such a small unit be entrenched in the middle of nowhere? Just wondering. It didn't make any sense to me at all.


Not supposed to. Just a scenario.

Okay, well Thoad and Vinster, you're in.

Now, you all can make a scenario if you guys want. I'd be rather interested to see what you guys can do.
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