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thepyro222
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thepyro222
2,150 posts
Peasant

I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done.
I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please

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SkywardStriker05
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SkywardStriker05
33 posts
Nomad

First off, I don't think Noah's Ark could've happened because of all the damage it would've done to the Earth and all of the species that existed during that time. First off, depending on which scholar you ask, this happened some 6,000 years ago. Nevertheless there were still a lot of animal species back in that day. First off, they believed the number of species 6,000 years ago to be over 40,000 species. And part of the reason I think this is stupid is because, there are of course a lot a habitatual diversity within every species. The Bible claims that every species in the entire world lived within walking distance of Noah's house. But on with the scripture: "Take two of every animal and put them on this giant *** boat." That's a lot of animals. When God said to separate them, separate them with what? The only resource humans probably knew to use effectively back then was wood. And they used it for absolutely everything. "Build a small window every 18 inches for ventilation." That's not enough air for some animals. "The water rose higher than any mountaintop." Here's where I call serious bullcrap. The highest mountain in the world 6,000 years ago was Mt. Everest, we know it was Everest because it's literally 60 million years old. It's height is 29,029 feet as of now, without all the erosion, I'd say back then it was an estimate of about 29,700 feet above sea level. First off, most of the animals that high above sea level would probably freeze to death, and the ones who don't would probably suffocate because there's 33% less oxygen at that height. But let's say that they do live. Once they get off of the boat, all the land animals would probably die because all the vegetation would be wiped out, and plus, if one animal eats another animal of a different species, it causes extinction, thus it will eventually cause the consumer to starve to death because there is no other animals to eat. Plus, there's going to be some inbreeding going on, which is seriously going to screw up the sequence of DNA inside that animal. This I think is enough to disprove that story...

Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

are you sure you want to continue?


Probably not since the last time a theist posted here was a month ago.
Bladerunner679
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Bladerunner679
2,487 posts
Blacksmith

Probably not since the last time a theist posted here was a month ago.


I guess it means that we have to send a challenge to them.

to the armor of god clan:

you have lost these debates repeatedly, you have never been able to prove god's existience, and you have repeatedly made baseless claims that no weight behind them.

My question to said clan is this: if god has been proven a myth, what would you do? would you continue living this proven lie, or would you react violently to the situation?

-Blade
Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

to the armor of god clan:


The clan is pretty much dead. Of the 4 active members there even were, two left and the other two rarely post anything.

you have lost these debates repeatedly,


And here I thought the last 3920 replies were all just a series of circles.

This is a pretty accurate visual representation I believe.

http://www.fastarcade.com/games/images/illusion_32.gif
Bladerunner679
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Bladerunner679
2,487 posts
Blacksmith

The clan is pretty much dead. Of the 4 active members there even were, two left and the other two rarely post anything.


well then, I guess this thread is going to be dead for a while. that's too bad.

-Blade
HahiHa
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HahiHa
8,256 posts
Regent

Actually there's something I've been thinking about, about which other atheists can also give their opinion (although it would be nice to have the opinion of a religious).

Assuming a deity created the world, why did it bother with creating two sexes? I'm sure there would be even better ways but I think hermaphrodism is already a much better idea than male and female separated. This way there's no discrimination based on gender and religious cannot complain about homosexuality or use 'wrong hole' arguments and stuff. Clearly an all-loving, previsional deity would privilege such a situation.

It doesn't make sense that when god created adam, he was like us modern men. That would mean that god already planned to create women, or else what's the need of all this sexual ballast? However in the bible (if I'm not wrong), eve was only created after adam got bored. Was it really part of 'god's plan'?

All of this is hypothetical of course. The best explanation is still that the bible and creation myth was made up by humans unable to think out of the box.

Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

Assuming a deity created the world, why did it bother with creating two sexes?


The most logical explanation for this is just because such stories/beliefs are ignorant attempts to explain the world. Religion takes a look at what it can directly see, makes up a story for it and calls it good.

I'm sure there would be even better ways but I think hermaphrodism is already a much better idea than male and female separated.


Or asexual reproduction.

Clearly an all-loving, previsional deity would privilege such a situation.


There's so many things that are wrong with the claim of an omniscient, all powerful and benevolent god.

It doesn't make sense that when god created adam, he was like us modern men.


Makes perfect sense if you take that he isn't actually real and it's just a story we made up to try and say why things are without any real knowledge.

That would mean that god already planned to create women, or else what's the need of all this sexual ballast?


You can spend your entire life finding errors in the Bible. Contradictions, hypocrisy, inaccuracies, multiple personalities of God, the list goes on and on and on...

However in the bible (if I'm not wrong), eve was only created after adam got bored.


Adam became lonely was the reason, not bored. So God "made" a woman for him. Yay sexism.

Was it really part of 'god's plan'?


If God really is omniscient, then even his self narrations of "the LORD regretted his actions" in multiple places in the Bible were planned. Planned regret for your actions...how convoluted does this really need to get before people see?
Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

Just inb4 some irate Christian claims from ignorance of their own scripture that I'm making up the regret part, here's Genesis 6:6.

"And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart."

Different translations offer different synonyms for the word "regret" so don't even go there.

MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

It doesn't make sense that when god created adam, he was like us modern men. That would mean that god already planned to create women, or else what's the need of all this sexual ballast? However in the bible (if I'm not wrong), eve was only created after adam got bored. Was it really part of 'god's plan'?


Originally "God's plan" was to have Adam get it on with some animal that he selected from the garden, but non of them really did it for him.

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/MageGrayWolf/atheistjokes/552841_304238422992677_100002195663559_710831_1081198244_n.jpg
...just saying
SkywardStriker05
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SkywardStriker05
33 posts
Nomad

And honestly, how was Adam supposed to name every species if there was no taxonomy system, and Latin wasn't even a language then?

Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

how was Adam supposed to name every species if there was no taxonomy system,


Everything with hair is a(insert Hebrew word) and everything with feathers is a (insert Hebrew word) and everything with scales is a (insert Hebrew word) on and on.

A taxonomy system is something which categorizes based on related features. It doesn't have to be very good.

and Latin wasn't even a language then?


Irrelevant. It's not like everything that is named in Latin had no name to every culture that had seen it before. We only use Latin for scientific purposes because it is a dead language and therefor does not change, meaning that the words for things never change.
SkywardStriker05
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SkywardStriker05
33 posts
Nomad

Very good points Kasic. Plus taxonomy didn't even come about until Carolus Linnaeus wrote Systema Naturae. You basically destroyed everything I just said. But speaking of Hebrew words, some theists will say that when it said in the Bible "and god took DUST from the ground and created man", they say that being created from dust is sort of figurative, since there was only a certain number of Hebrew words 6,000 years ago. I just need a clarification on that if someone will provide that.

Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

some theists will say that when it said in the Bible "and god took DUST from the ground and created man", they say that being created from dust is sort of figurative, since there was only a certain number of Hebrew words 6,000 years ago. I just need a clarification on that if someone will provide that.


Four rules to remember which are followed by people when arguing against religions.

1) My religion is the only true one, thus every other is false. This applies even if I have never read my book of scripture, and if someone else makes the same claim, they're wrong.

2) If a belief I have is proven literally impossible, untrue, or illogical it is now and always was a metaphor and you are a unenlightened heathen for thinking otherwise.

3) If something contradicts, ignore it. If I'm pressed about the contradiction, apply the following which fits best:

"We cannot know God's will." "He loves us." "You need to have faith."
"God is perfect." "There was a translation error." "God knows all."
"Out of context." "We're sinners." "Nothing you say can change my mind."

Variations in wording may apply; not all possible responses have been listed, Google search the contradiction and find a reborn Christian site to give me a more fitting avoidance.

4) Call for backup and proceed to regurgitate teachings en mass whilst parroting other for good measure. Make sure to also constantly compliment each other as if this somehow helps your argument.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Now that I look at that, it pretty much entirely summarizes every argument about religion that I've had. Go figure.
dair5
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dair5
3,371 posts
Shepherd

It doesn't always happen like that... It happens in a way very very similar. But...

and if someone else makes the same claim, they're wrong.

and you are a unenlightened heathen for thinking otherwise.


I don't think this is true most of the time. I've definitly meet christians who are like this, but there weren't many.
Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

I don't think this is true most of the time. I've definitly meet christians who are like this, but there weren't many.


It's the meaning of the sentence that's important, not the specific wording. Unenlightened heathen could simply be "wrong" or "misguided" or "close minded." Variations.

It doesn't always happen like that... It happens in a way very very similar. But...


It happens in a similar enough fashion and pattern for a general overview of the subject. Every argument I have had has fallen under one of those rules or more in a close enough manner that it's easy to see that they are following that trend.

Let's take some examples.

"How can you say God loves people but then decides to prove it with a barbaric sacrifice."

"God was showing his love by taking sin upon himself through Jesus."

"But couldn't God have done it through a non violent, painful means?"

Invoke rule #3. A contradiction occurs which you cannot avoid. Insert a non-response which attempts to dodge the issue.

Next example:

"Evolution isn't true because God made everything."

"We have extensive evidence for evolution, why won't you accept that?"

"Evolution has been proven false."

"No, it has not. It is scientific fact."

"The Bible says everything was created as is so evolution must not be true."

There #1 was invoked, I'm right so you're wrong, and also #2 would appear if I went further with this.
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