I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done. I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please
1) My religion is the only true one, thus every other is false. This applies even if I have never read my book of scripture, and if someone else makes the same claim, they're wrong.
One amendment to this is also to claim that they are following the same god just in a different way. In some cases claiming that the other person is just doing it wrong.
I'm saving this for future reference. It seems to fit the pattern I've seen with pretty much every single argument I've ever had.
[quote]...following the same god just in a different way. In some cases claiming that the other person is just doing it wrong.
The same could be said for every religion's denominations. I don't understand why there are 54,000 denominations of Christianity. And they all judge each other anyways. Which would make that guy in the sky seem a little angry.
The same could be said for every religion's denominations. I don't understand why there are 54,000 denominations of Christianity. And they all judge each other anyways. Which would make that guy in the sky seem a little angry.
The reason is because of various upbringings and indoctrination, as well as because the Bible can be interpreted pretty much any way you want and also because religion has only a small anchoring in reality. People believe what they're told and then cling to those beliefs.
The 52 authors of the Bible could've just picked any single item,
Where are you getting 52?
There's over 60 "books" in the Bible, and many had multiple authors/editors/revisionists.
Not to mention the Bible IS picking whatever item they want. There are many "books" which were intended to be in the Bible, controversial gospels and a myriad of Hebrew texts which were left out because the glaring contradictions and inconsistencies were too much even for the faithful to accept.
and make a fictious story to make people believe.
I doubt religion emerged as such. I wouldn't put it past the large organisations like the early Catholic church (which basically controlled everything in Europe from 400 C.E to 1400 C.E) to deliberately misconstrue or change things to make it more acceptable. Oh wait, they did do this. Conversions of pagans were partially done through integration of holidays and beliefs.
can any christen answer this? is god willing to prevent evil but unable? then he is not omnipotent is he able but not willing? then he is malevolent is he both able and willing? then why come of the evil? is he nor able nor willing? then why call him god? and if god created the sun on the fourth day then how did the first four days pass? can any remaining religious person answer this to killersup?
and if god created the sun on the fourth day then how did the first four days pass? can any remaining religious person answer this to killersup?
Let's take a look at Kasic's list to see what sort of answer we are likely to get.
he Bible has light and days existing prior to the light source existing. This is literally impossible. So it would seem situation #2 applies.
"2) If a belief I have is proven literally impossible, untrue, or illogical it is now and always was a metaphor and you are a unenlightened heathen for thinking otherwise."
So our likely answer to this question is to just call the story a metaphor.
Let's take a look at Kasic's list to see what sort of answer we are likely to get.
he Bible has light and days existing prior to the light source existing. This is literally impossible. So it would seem situation #2 applies.
"2) If a belief I have is proven literally impossible, untrue, or illogical it is now and always was a metaphor and you are a unenlightened heathen for thinking otherwise."
So our likely answer to this question is to just call the story a metaphor.
And this most often is the case. Even some of the most die-hard creationists have that "a thousand days of man is a day for God" thing, or just believe that everything was created but not in 7 days.
Sometimes you get the literal "7 days" in which case this applies: "3) If something contradicts, ignore it. If I'm pressed about the contradiction, apply the following which fits best:"
where the following would be "Only God knows" "God is all powerful and can do whatever he wants" "Nothing you can say will change my mind you close minded atheist." etc.
And this most often is the case. Even some of the most die-hard creationists have that "a thousand days of man is a day for God" thing...
Just to back this up, I'll add on. On the third day, God created plants. On the 4th day, he created the very thing that they need to survive in the first place. Plants could possibly live 42 hours without sunlight, but for the "a thousand days" thing, a plant would supposedly survive for 2 3/4 approx. When that is brought up, you're likely to get the number 3 answer. Which I think the best answers for them to come back with is "God can do whatever he wants with his creation," or "God is omnipotent," or something along those lines.
Just to back this up, I'll add on. On the third day, God created plants. On the 4th day, he created the very thing that they need to survive in the first place. Plants could possibly live 42 hours without sunlight, but for the "a thousand days" thing, a plant would supposedly survive for 2 3/4 approx. When that is brought up, you're likely to get the number 3 answer. Which I think the best answers for them to come back with is "God can do whatever he wants with his creation," or "God is omnipotent," or something along those lines.
A bigger concern would be how God by this story created the Earth before the Sun. Based on how planetary formation occurs this is doing things incredibly backwards. If a planet were created before it's solar body there would be no stable orbit and for those first few days the Earth would just be hurtling through space out of control, unless God was standing in for the Sun to provide a stable orbit. In which case he was just making more work for himself.
This point also makes the argument of a non literal 7 days problematic. This version likes to claim that a day was like thousands or even millions of years. Any planet life by then would have been long dead.
Everyone can have a view. That's fine. Structured, intelligent arguements? Also fine. Stupid people (Religious and atheist and agnostic) are not![quote]Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind Then WHY in the name of all that is holy to anyone anywhere (including Prince Phillip) are you a christian.
