God sends two bears to rip up 42 little children for making fun of Elisha's bald head. 2nd Kings 2:23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him. âGet out of here, baldy!â they said. âGet out of here, baldy!â 2:24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys. 2:25 And he went on to Mount Carmel and from there returned to Samaria.
You must hate your father, mother, wife, children, brothers, sisters, yourself, and carry a cross on your back to become a disciple. Luke 14:25 Large crowds were traveling with Jesus, and turning to them he said: 14:26 âIf anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sistersâ"yes, even their own lifeâ"such a person cannot be my disciple. 14:27 And whoever does not carry their cross and follow me cannot be my disciple. 14:28 âSuppose one of you wants to build a tower. Wonât you first sit down and estimate the cost to see if you have enough money to complete it? 14:29 For if you lay the foundation and are not able to finish it, everyone who sees it will ridicule you, 14:30 saying, âThis person began to build and wasnât able to finish.â
Sell your clothes for a sword. Luke 22:35 Then Jesus asked them, âWhen I sent you without purse, bag or sandals, did you lack anything?â
âNothing,â they answered.
22:36 He said to them, âBut now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you donât have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. 22:37 It is written: âAnd he was numbered with the transgressorsâ[a]; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in me. Yes, what is written about me is reaching its fulfillment.â 22:38 The disciples said, âSee, Lord, here are two swords.â
âThatâs enough!â he replied.
Beat your children Proverbs 23:13 Do not withhold discipline from a child; if you punish them with the rod, they will not die. 23:14 Punish them with the rod and save them from death.
Moses's Vengence Numbers 31:1 The LORD said to Moses, 31:2 âTake vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites. After that, you will be gathered to your people.â 31:15 âHave you allowed all the women to live?â he asked them. 31:16 âThey were the ones who followed Balaamâs advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the LORD in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the LORDâs people. 31:17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.
God & Slavery Leviticus 25:40 They are to be treated as hired workers or temporary residents among you; they are to work for you until the Year of Jubilee. 25:41 Then they and their children are to be released, and they will go back to their own clans and to the property of their ancestors. 25:42 Because the Israelites are my servants, whom I brought out of Egypt, they must not be sold as slaves. 25:43 Do not rule over them ruthlessly, but fear your God.
25:44 ââYour male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 25:45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 25:46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.
Old Testament Counts Matthew 5:17 âDo not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 5:18 For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 5:19 Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
21:15 And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death. 21:16 And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death. 21:17 And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death.
I guess that's true but don't people generally kill all the men, which leaves the women and children? (i don't actually know the answer) Because women and children don't make great slaves.
If it said it in hebrew why wasn't it translated? And can you read hebrew
Because it doesn't directly say it. I think the place i saw was implied with the roots of the words but i can't remember. I can't find the place i found online explaining this, i probably should have posted a link the first time. And yes, i can read hebrew. One thing i just realized is it says "you may be intimate with her and possess her, and she will be a wife for you" which here "may" might not be your choice, it might be you may have sex if she says yes, and i don't know if it was true back then*, but most jews hold that you have to wait for marriage to have sex. And if you need to be married than she needs to convert to Judaism which has to be done on free will.
*it seems to be because it says that she will be a wife for you
Because either everyone is just a slave of other people or no one is ever a slave. Since the latter is a better option slavery is considered immoral. And I take it you suport incest and genocide as well as all the other bad things in the bible god endorses.
I'm going to refer people again to the definition of "morality" i posted.
Moral is a relative term. It changes with society. It is what society currently views as the correct thing. 2000 years ago almost anyone would view slavery as normal. Now almost no one will view slavery as normal. Really morals are a lot like common sense, and quoting einstein "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen." If we were told growing up that slaves were okay than our society would believe slavery is moral. Society is like evolution, it keeps changing (but we don't know for better or for worse).
and if i never said i supported slavery than why would you assume i support incest and genocide?
no exodus
15: if you try to kill your parent. 16: if you kidnap a man. 17: if you curse your parent.
The only one of those that sounds unreasonable is 17 and "shall surely be put to death" doesn't sound like it means they will be killed. It more sounds like the parents have a choice in the matter.
Also, master I'm guessing a Jew
I'm waiting for Mage's guess and a reason to say it.
Of course i see it as morally wrong but I'm going to repost my definition of "moral" from page six.
God could have saved a lot of trouble by just saying "You know that whole slavery thing? Maybe it's not such a good idea to do. Could you knock it off?"
I have been hiding it but i kind of feel like telling. If you can give me a reason to tell i will do so. (you can also make a guess)
It makes it easier to hold a discussion on religion when I know where they are coming from. No guesses.
2. I'd define morality as actions that are considered 'right' based on the agreement of society
Than no wonder you have problems with the Bible, you're using a flawed definition of morality. For example, if moraliy is based on what a society decrees is 'right', than a society of canibals would declare it 'right' to throw people into the cooking pot.
The Ethics of the Bible are good, not because of us, or because God says it is, but because it is God's nature. Rather than trying to fix the Bible to suit our current situations, we should fix ourself to suit God's word.
The Ethics of the Bible are good, not because of us, or because God says it is, but because it is God's nature. Rather than trying to fix the Bible to suit our current situations, we should fix ourself to suit God's word.
Why is God's nature moral? If I read the bible it looks totally different. I don't think that slavery, killing homosexuals, killing rebelling childs etc. is moral.
God could have saved a lot of trouble by just saying "You know that whole slavery thing? Maybe it's not such a good idea to do. Could you knock it off?"
Thats not my definition of moral. I said morals change. At the time with slavery people saw slaves as moral, now we see them as immoral. We can't compare their morals with ours. I can guarantee if you lived back then you would see slaves as moral.
Than no wonder you have problems with the Bible, you're using a flawed definition of morality. For example, if moraliy is based on what a society decrees is 'right', than a society of canibals would declare it 'right' to throw people into the cooking pot.
That's the point i was trying to make.
Why is God's nature moral? If I read the bible it looks totally different.
He didn't use the word moral in that sentence. You can't assume that's what he meant.
I don't think that slavery, killing homosexuals, killing rebelling childs etc. is moral.
Than you still don't understand what the definition of morality is. Also, homosexuals? Where did that come from...
Leviticus 20:13 ESV: (English Standard Version): "If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."
He didn't use the word moral in that sentence
But he said: The Ethics of the Bible are good, not because of us, or because God says it is, but because it is God's nature.
What is ethics? From wiki: Ethics, also known as moral philosophy, is a branch of philosophy that addresses questions about moralityâ"that is, concepts such as good and evil, right and wrong, virtue and vice, justice, etc.
Leviticus 20:13 ESV: (English Standard Version): "If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."
Okay, next time quote it when you say it.
The Ethics of the Bible are good, not because of us, or because God says it is, but because it is God's nature.
Well i can't speak for him so i don't know if its the word he meant.
Than you still don't understand what the definition of morality is.
Again from Wikipedia: In its "descriptive" sense, morality refers to personal or cultural values, codes of conduct or social mores that distinguish between right and wrong in the human society. Describing morality in this way is not making a claim about what is objectively right or wrong, but only referring to what is considered right or wrong by an individual or some group of people (such as a religion). This sense of the term is addressed by descriptive ethics. In its "normative" sense, morality refers directly to what is right and wrong, regardless of what specific individuals think. It could be defined as the conduct of the ideal "moral" person in a certain situation. This usage of the term is characterized by "definitive" statements such as "That act is immoral" rather than descriptive ones such as "Many believe that act is immoral." It is often challenged by moral nihilism, which rejects the existence of any moral truths,[5] and supported by moral realism, which supports the existence of moral truths. The normative usage of the term "morality" is addressed by normative ethics.
And yes, I believen in an "objevtice morality".
[Sam] Harris urges us to think about morality in terms of human and animal well-being, viewing the experiences of conscious creatures as peaks and valleys on a âmoral landscape".
(Source It's not really objective because it depends on the well-being of conscious beeings. But there are things we can definitely say, like it's not really good for the well-being of humans if we kill homosexuals. I know that most of the people on AG probably don't agree with me on Sam Harris' idea but I still wanted to say that
First of all, wikipedia is never the first site you should go too. Second, giving me a definition and understanding the definition are two different things. Right now all i believe is that you understand how to look up the meaning of morality. Explain it to me in your own words.
Thats not my definition of moral. I said morals change. At the time with slavery people saw slaves as moral, now we see them as immoral. We can't compare their morals with ours. I can guarantee if you lived back then you would see slaves as moral.
Probably and it is what would be expected from people of that time, not what would be expected from a supreme beings dictations.
Really? I would assume its easier not to know to avoid bias. That was the reason i haven't told anyone yet.
Religious beliefs can be extremely varied so just saying that you believe in God doesn't tell me anything about those beliefs. Giving a religion and a denomination there in give me a basic frame work from which your coming from.
First of all, wikipedia is never the first site you should go too.
Wiki can be a good starting source if used correctly.
Than no wonder you have problems with the Bible, you're using a flawed definition of morality. For example, if moraliy is based on what a society decrees is 'right', than a society of canibals would declare it 'right' to throw people into the cooking pot.
But if you were brought up in the society cannibalism would be moral
not what would be expected from a supreme beings dictations.
And why is that? God never said that you should take slaves, he said if you do than follow these rules.
Wiki can be a good starting source if used correctly.
It can also be completely unreliable.
Religious beliefs can be extremely varied so just saying that you believe in God doesn't tell me anything about those beliefs. Giving a religion and a denomination there in give me a basic frame work from which your coming from.
