Forums → WEPR → Do you think time is real?

I dont use a link because this is not something that can be proven thru some random article.

It's not random, it's proof for what i'm saying.

What gravity does to say, for example, the light from a star travelling to us, is warp the way it travels to us. There is not an actual force called time that literally changes it.

How is that relevant? The star from the light is affected by gravity, not time.

because the very fabric of space will be different

I.e space-time.

None of your links prove anything towards an argument that time, as a physical object, exists.

No one said it has to have mass to exist.

Einstein's theory doesnt prove the existence of time, it proves what happens to reality when you change its state.

How can we change something that doesn't exist?

Einstein's theory doesnt prove the existence of time, it proves what happens to reality when you change its state.

I was in a hurry typing the last post, so I'll expand on it. We aren't changing reality, we are changing time. That isn't up to debate, it's the whole point of the theory. You can't even change the state of reality, that doesn't even make any sense.

Like I said. Give me a Meter. Or a second. Or any measurement.

But you cant. Because it doesnt exist.

First of all, you need to expand on that because you aren't making sense. Second, why do people keep bringing up measurements?

First of all, you need to expand on that because you aren't making sense. Second, why do people keep bringing up measurements?

Because time is a relative measurement, it is as real as every other measurement.

Because time is a relative measurement, it is as real as every other measurement.

But space-time isn't measuring anything. And either way, the part i don't understand is why he is saying they don't exist.

But space-time isn't measuring anything. And either way, the part i don't understand is why he is saying they don't exist.

Yes it is...Why wouldn't it be?

He is saying that they don't exist as in you can not use it, such as you can't touch a meter or a yard.

Yes it is...Why wouldn't it be?

What is it measuring then? Hours are measuring the position of the sun, but that is time. What is space time measuring?

He is saying that they don't exist as in you can not use it, such as you can't touch a meter or a yard.

Thanks, that's what i was looking for. But the measurements still exist, even if they don't have physical substance.

What is it measuring then? Hours are measuring the position of the sun, but that is time. What is space time measuring?

The units time is moving, like a four dimensional grid. Moving across the grid is measured in meters, yards, feet, or whatever else you use to measure, since that is the space. Time, apparently the fourth dimension, also moves, in one direction, which we measure in seconds, minutes, hours, etc. Time is just a relative measurement.

Or at least that is my understanding of it.

The units time is moving, like a four dimensional grid. Moving across the grid is measured in meters, yards, feet, or whatever else you use to measure, since that is the space. Time, apparently the fourth dimension, also moves, in one direction, which we measure in seconds, minutes, hours, etc. Time is just a relative measurement.

But it's so much more complex then that. It isn't just one direction. There are infinite alternate timelines (parallel universes), It can be warped, and It isn't even going one speed in our universe.

But it's so much more complex then that. It isn't just one direction. There are infinite alternate timelines (parallel universes), It can be warped, and It isn't even going one speed in our universe.

It is just one direction, no matter what speed it is going. Like in a race, no matter how fast you go the runners are all in the same direction. Who cares about having several timelines? Even assuming that the parallel universe theory was true, time would still be going in the same direction in all of those.

It is just one direction, no matter what speed it is going. Like in a race, no matter how fast you go the runners are all in the same direction. Who cares about having several timelines? Even assuming that the parallel universe theory was true, time would still be going in the same direction in all of those.

No it would be branching off in other directions in other universes.

It's not random, it's proof for what i'm saying.

Its an article that doesnt really expand on the subject. Its also not proof. Perhaps not quite so random tho

You can't even change the state of reality, that doesn't even make any sense.

Then how can you change time, if time exists as a malleable force then you can change reality. By going at the speed of light and becoming older than everyone else, you are changing reality.
I would say this is not proof of times existence, its a theory that if you travel that fast, you alter your reality.

No it would be branching off in other directions in other universes.

I feel like your clutching at straws here. You cant argue that time has been proven, gravity has been proven or black holes have been proven then go on to use something that is total speculation i.e. multiple timelines or universes branching etc... None of this has any concrete proof, and is all theory. Im not saying its wrong.

I know what you mean when you say time exists. I know what I mean when I say it doesnt.

And when I say the passing of states, what I mean is, your atoms, and everythings atoms and all that craaazy stuff that goes waaay beyond me, are in a constant state of change. The electrons are never in the same place (although thats an argument all in itself), your body changes, sheds atoms, gains atoms, etc etc etc...

We use time to measure the changes that happen.

I apologise that I have a hard time getting all thats in my head onto paper. Or screen

I would like to say more, and given time might work out how to, but for now, Im hungry.

Its an article that doesnt really expand on the subject. Its also not proof. Perhaps not quite so random tho

I'm not going to pursue this. If you can't understand I'm not going to explain it.

Then how can you change time, if time exists as a malleable force then you can change reality. By going at the speed of light and becoming older than everyone else, you are changing reality.
I would say this is not proof of times existence, its a theory that if you travel that fast, you alter your reality.

You can change reality. I don't know what you mean by the state of reality.

I feel like your clutching at straws here. You cant argue that time has been proven, gravity has been proven or black holes have been proven then go on to use something that is total speculation i.e. multiple timelines or universes branching etc... None of this has any concrete proof, and is all theory. Im not saying its wrong.

The alternate reality theory is just a theory, but the point is that time isn't just a line.

We use time to measure the changes that happen.

We use measurements of time to do that. Not time itself.

If you can't understand I'm not going to explain it.

You dont need to explain because i already said the links you provided, while informative and right up my ally (lol) do not actually prove, anything. So nothing to explain here.

I don't know what you mean by the state of reality.

If you dont understand Im not going to explain :P

Well actually, I will. dictionary.com says that state means the following:

1.
the condition of a person or thing, as with respect to circumstances or attributes: a state of health.
2.
the condition of matter with respect to structure, form, constitution, phase, or the like: water in a gaseous state.

Well it says more, but this is what I mean, and I think this is clear.

The alternate reality theory is just a theory, but the point is that time isn't just a line.

Well so is the gravity that some claim warp time, I will not use this in my argument tho, because it doesnt prove anything.

We use measurements of time to do that. Not time itself.

Hold on... if you can USE a measurement of time, surely you can give me a portion of time wrapped in a space time flux capacitor with a dash of salt... please.

If use a measurement of flour, or iron, or atoms, I can physically give it to you.

You cant give me time. But I am glad you are giving me your time.

You dont need to explain because i already said the links you provided, while informative and right up my ally (lol) do not actually prove, anything. So nothing to explain here.

I'm not explaining it's relevance if you don't see it.

Well actually, I will. dictionary.com says that state means the following:

So instead of linking definitions (which doesn't necessarily mean you understand the word, it just means you can give me links), tell me what the state of reality means.

Well so is the gravity that some claim warp time, I will not use this in my argument tho, because it doesnt prove anything.

I already said gravity warps time, that was the said in the link i posted.

You cant give me time. But I am glad you are giving me your time.

I don't know what you just said but I don't even know why i am bothering my time with you.

I'm not explaining it's relevance if you don't see it.

I know why you posted it, but it doesnt show time existing. Its people talking about black holes and how they had to compensate for measuring certain things around earth in satelites etc. I stand by what I said, its not relevent because it does not further your point.

tell me what the state of reality means.

As in the way our reality is for us. The way we perceive it and use the information to change the world around us. Its kinda intangible really, like time.

So instead of linking definitions (which doesn't necessarily mean you understand the word, it just means you can give me links), tell me what the state of reality means.

Err... Considering I am writing words to you right now, and you are doing the same to me, I assumed we could both read and understand the definition which pretty much explains what I meant. You know what I mean by state, you know what reality is, you know what I mean by the state of reality. I dont think either of us really know what reality actually is, but what we experience will have to do.

I already said gravity warps time, that was the said in the link i posted.

And I already said gravity could only warp the properties of something, AND I said gravity is not proven, its theory. You cannot use a theory to prove a theory. We can, however, discuss the theories relation to each other and make some kind of connection between them.

Now stop picking apart my words, and give me some darn time!

I don't know what you just said but I don't even know why i am bothering my time with you.

Ah... I see the crux of the problem. You dont like what I have to say and therefore dont like me. If you are unable to take part in a discussion or debate, no matter how heated, without at least retaining some kind of friendly decorum then you definitely dont deserve my time.



Your problem is, your using the words of others to prove something you know absolutely nothing about and telling me that because these guys are so much smarter than me, that makes me wrong! You then proceed to pick apart the words I use when I know for a fact that you can understand what I mean, all the while waiting for me to trip up so you can have your triumph on a subject that you wish you understood.

I have tried to say that Im thinking outside the box, but you keep shouting your arguments from inside yours.

If you cant come out, you will have no more of my time, real or not.