NOTE: This is not an anti religion post, simply a philosophical and age old debate.
Ok, so very very basically, here is an issue with the typical Christian view of God, a view shared by other religions, aside, however.
God is all good God is all powerful (omnipotent) God is all knowing
If God is all good, then why does he make evil things happen? Why does he create murderers and tsunamis?
Some say God creates us with the choice to do good and bad that we may have free will.
So, in this case God creates us without knowing if we'll choose to be good or bad people, or even if we will believe in him/her.
So God doesn't know if we're going to be good or bad, so God is not all knowing.
BUT - Imagine we still want to hold that he his all knowing, i.e he knows everything about everything. This means God creates us knowing that we're going to be good or bad people, this means that he condemns those he creates bad to a life of sin and ultimately hell, so he can't be all Good.
BUT - if we want to still hold that he is all good, then there must be another reason murderers and tsunamis exist, but what? Maybe God created the world, and is not powerful enough to intervene. Then God is no longer all-powerful. Either that or he is powerful enough to intervene, and simply doesn't want to, in which case he is not all good. What do you think about all this?
This conversation is pointless. Has anyone else worked out that every idea we have has a counter? There is a way to disprove everything that has been said and then something else to counter that disproof. Like Somewhat said, there is no way to win this argument.
But that's what a debate is. Just an intellectual brawl, and there's no certainty at all we will reach a conclusion. It's just an arena for us to show our own opinions, try to undermine others', not to convince people.
Zero is not undefined...zero has many identifiable characteristics. It is for instance neither positive nor negative. It is an even number. It can be counted as a natural number.
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ither way there is no control involved unless he personally controls people.
So all this stuff about god being all good, all powerful, and all knowing is told by humans who are imperfect. So who says any of that is true?
No one I know of here? I personally think it's tosh, but for me it's better to do so logically instead of tossing religion straightaway into a rubbish bin.
Kind of amusing, that the OP has not posted since....
errr, i didn't mean to hit the submit button. To continue, what if god isn't all good and has no plan and is improvising and we are all just puppets? The only source we have on any of this is humans and a book written by humans. And why are people trusting the imperfect human? And no one has even mentioned what role the Devil might be playing in all of this.
errr, i didn't mean to hit the submit button. To continue, what if god isn't all good and has no plan and is improvising and we are all just puppets? The only source we have on any of this is humans and a book written by humans. And why are people trusting the imperfect human? And no one has even mentioned what role the Devil might be playing in all of this.
Well then religion or Christianity on the whole will be thoroughly undermined by us bunch of skeptics. What you say is true, we just have a book written by humans. But what Christians who believe profoundly is that the Bible is God's Word, meaning all that transpired inside was by God himself, not a bunch of humans.
We have to have a framework to argue, no matter how flawed, and that's the Bible.
We need devout Christians to start posting so we have a believer to argue against, not just skeptics. =P Maybe a Catholic and a Protestant. The problem with the Bible is the amount of versions there are. There is almost zero way to tell which one is the original, if it even exists anymore.
But what Christians who believe profoundly is that the Bible is God's Word, meaning all that transpired inside was by God himself, not a bunch of humans.
See, this is where I get confused. I'm a Christian, but I don't beloved god made the bible. I don't and can't just ignore evidence that is found on something. So for the claims about god making people, and god making clouds rain, and god making natural disaters, I get confused. Because I already know what causes these and I have proof of it. So how does it relate?
See, this is where I get confused. I'm a Christian, but I don't beloved god made the bible. I don't and can't just ignore evidence that is found on something. So for the claims about god making people, and god making clouds rain, and god making natural disaters, I get confused. Because I already know what causes these and I have proof of it. So how does it relate?
Clarification, I was referring to the more devout Christians, who take the Bible more literally.
Even if he did, people have already made different versions of it to fit their little sect. So like i said earlier, the original Bible has probably been lost in time.
