ForumsWEPREvolutionism or creationism

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Freon
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Freon
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Nomad

im just opening this topic so that people can have a NICE, FREINDLY place to talk about their beliefs, i Myself believe in evolutionism

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iMogwai
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iMogwai
2,030 posts
Peasant

I meant today. There is not even in 10000 years a creature showing tendency to be in transition. As i said I am not agains evolution but the monkey part.


What the hell are you talking about? This evolution has already happened, that's why there aren't any neanderthals walking around on our streets today. They've already been around, and they evolved into the next type of human, eventually reaching today's Homo Sapiens Sapiens.

Here's a list of fossils from earlier humans.
akqpars
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akqpars
190 posts
Nomad

What the hell are you talking about? This evolution has already happened, that's why there aren't any neanderthals walking around on our streets today. They've already been around, and they evolved into the next type of human, eventually reaching today's Homo Sapiens Sapiens.


This is a cycle you see ?It have to be continued forever. I am stating the fact that in 10000 years monkeys must not like the idea to evolve than ? Even a single phase.
indie55
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indie55
610 posts
Nomad

This is a cycle you see ?It have to be continued forever. I am stating the fact that in 10000 years monkeys must not like the idea to evolve than ? Even a single phase.

Do you realize that when species evolve they tend to 'branch' off like this here? Not all the organisms from the same species will evolve, or evolve the same way.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
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Farmer

The theory also a flow which we have monkey anchestors while there is human and monkey existing but no creatures in transition process.


The fossil record has plenty of examples of this.

I meant today. There is not even in 10000 years a creature showing tendency to be in transition. As i said I am not agains evolution but the monkey part.


Look in the mirror if you want to see a transitional form.

9th Foundational Falsehood of Creationism

Sea creatures are creatures that swim. The bible doesn't really decide what an animal that swims would be called. Since we know theropods [the dinos that became birds] were able to swim, that goes in line with our evidence. You've got the sea creatures, you've got dinos that swim, you get birds, dinos die, you get cattle.


The dinosaur ancestor for birds are raptors. They didn't swim. Further more we still don't see this order, we had fully terrestrial life for quite a long time before bird came into the scene. So no the Biblical account does not go in line with the evidence.

Also, there is a high possibility of feathered dinosaurs. So the birds, made first, might have taken some time to start flying [By evolving into more aerodynamic creatures], just as young birds do in nature by growing until they can take the leap of faith.


Had nothing to do with taking a leap of faith into flight. Anyway it clearly mentions flying birds not terrestrial ones. Further more this just shows how wrong the passage is, as you have to insert a land animal as the transitional form to bird!

It is a little twisted, but it can fit in line.


Yeah twisted to the point where your making it say something it doesn't.

My only issue is that I have loads of trouble with debating this stuff by quoting the Bible. I'm for one not Christian, so I haven't read it or anything. Also, my understanding that I've gotten, whether through religious bias or just research is that the Bible has been changed a bunch over time, so it's questionable.


Very well, it is just one example from the bigger proponents of creation. But really any of these holy text are still arguing magic and inserting god when ever we run into a gap in our knowledge. Or trying to insert god when we already have a reasonable explanation for the cause of events leading to that gods intervention becoming completely superfluous.
Jefferysinspiration
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Jefferysinspiration
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Farmer

[/quote]What the hell are you talking about? This evolution has already happened, that's why there aren't any neanderthals walking around on our streets today. They've already been around, and they evolved into the next type of human, eventually reaching today's Homo Sapiens Sapiens.[quote]

To back this up -

Here is an advert which explains quite simply :P

Jefferysinspiration
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Jefferysinspiration
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Farmer

Quote reversal - my bad.
The top bit is supposed to be quoted, the bottom bit is not.

Armed_Blade
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Armed_Blade
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Shepherd

Here's a list of fossils from earlier humans.

These earlier humans still don't look at all like human-monkeys in the making.

Also, lets face it -- we're a rather successful bunch. Why is it that every other group died out?

the next type of human, eventually reaching today's Homo Sapiens Sapiens.


They did not 'evolve' into Humans. They were, essentially, a different species that disappeared. [Or, some classify them as a subspecie of Human] It is possible they shared a common ancestor.

The best guesses I can find for the Neaderthals going away is that there was interbreeding with normal humans, us owning them, or climatechange/volcano.
indie55
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indie55
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Nomad

Also, lets face it -- we're a rather successful bunch. Why is it that every other group died out?

Yes, but we also haven't been around as long as other dominant species have.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
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Farmer

This evolution has already happened, that's why there aren't any neanderthals walking around on our streets today.


Neanderthal wasn't a direct ancestor. We did exist along side them and eventually out competed them for the same niche due to them being over specialized for their environment.

This is a cycle you see ?It have to be continued forever. I am stating the fact that in 10000 years monkeys must not like the idea to evolve than ? Even a single phase.


A species doesn't choose to evolve. It does so due to environmental pressures.

These earlier humans still don't look at all like human-monkeys in the making.


All apes evolved from old world monkeys. and you really think early hominids didn't show any sign of this transition?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/32/A.afarensis.jpg/220px-A.afarensis.jpg

And further ignoring the fact humans still have the genes for making tails?
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/MageGrayWolf/human_tail.jpg

Also, lets face it -- we're a rather successful bunch. Why is it that every other group died out?


That's because they competed for the same niche as we did or they became us.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
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Farmer

Our common ancestry between us and the rest of the primates is catarrhini.

Armed_Blade
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Armed_Blade
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Shepherd

And further ignoring the fact humans still have the genes for making tails?


Actually, those pictures are rare cases of spina bifada, not actual tails. What we have is, at best, a prenatal tail that we get rid of before birth. Also some long forgotten tail bone.

Our common ancestry between us and the rest of the primates is catarrhini.


That is just a taxonomy classification.

That's because they competed for the same niche as we did or they became us.


So do other primates and many other organisms, yet in most cases none of their other counterparts die out as quick as some of the counterparts of ours did.
Also, I don't even get why the Neanderthals lost a fight.
Recent evidence keeps making them look better.
They were about 5-5'5ish, same as Humans back in the day, but they were stronger with brains sizes of ours or bigger, the only thing they were thought to have lacked was communication [and recent evidence is showing that they infact could speak, but their speech was very slushy and deep, so not too hot for modern languages].
Moe
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Moe
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Actually, those pictures are rare cases of spina bifada, not actual tails. What we have is, at best, a prenatal tail that we get rid of before birth. Also some long forgotten tail bone.


While it is possible for spina bifida to cause something like a tail, we do have documented case of humans having actual tails.
HahiHa
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HahiHa
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Regent

I meant today. There is not even in 10000 years a creature showing tendency to be in transition. As i said I am not agains evolution but the monkey part.

We are in transition; so to speak. You must understand that each 'hase' between one organism and his ancestor was adapted to it's environment as well, and was not only a transition phase; which would be stupid to think, since evolution has no aim so you don't know before what comes next.
But now let's look at us: are we fully adapted at walking on two legs yet? Almost, but not quite. Ever asked yourself why so many people had back problems?
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
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Farmer

Actually, those pictures are rare cases of spina bifada, not actual tails. What we have is, at best, a prenatal tail that we get rid of before birth. Also some long forgotten tail bone.


No that's spina bifada.
http://wiki.cns.org/wiki/images/thumb/4/49/Spinabifida.jpg/300px-Spinabifida.jpg

We have the prenatal tail because we still have the genes for making a tail, the same as how chickens still have the genes for making teeth.

That is just a taxonomy classification.


And that is for... MONKEYS! Though some refer to it as old world primates. But this is arguing semantics.

So do other primates and many other organisms, yet in most cases none of their other counterparts die out as quick as some of the counterparts of ours did.


No they don't, and when we do have competing groups the one that isn't as well adapted goes usually goes extinct.

Also, I don't even get why the Neanderthals lost a fight.
Recent evidence keeps making them look better.


Like I said they were to specialized for the environment they were in. Once that started changing the more adaptable group (us) was able to take over.

the only thing they were thought to have lacked was communication [and recent evidence is showing that they infact could speak, but their speech was very slushy and deep, so not too hot for modern languages].


Last I heard they had a higher pitched voice.
akqpars
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akqpars
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Nomad

quote]Look in the mirror if you want to see a transitional form.[/quote]

I thought, evolving meant to becoming in a better state,to put it lightly. Or you may claim that it is not a downgrade because you seem to believe we are apes.

A species doesn't choose to evolve. It does so due to environmental pressures.

As you know, all different species of monkeys have their habitats and never to leave there, and no ice age within too much time to talk about certain environmental changes or climate changes because we caused it lately.

All apes evolved from old world monkeys. and you really think early hominids didn't show any sign of this transition?


So actually probability of forming these species in a healhy form... You must call "O' my lord" to the entrophy.

And further ignoring the fact humans still have the genes for making tails?


Mage it is obvious the difference between diamond and coal. You must know also about the reptile humans around the world, which does not make us relatives with reptiles.

We are in transition; so to speak. You must understand that each 'hase' between one organism and his ancestor was adapted to it's environment as well, and was not only a transition phase; which would be stupid to think, since evolution has no aim so you don't know before what comes next.
But now let's look at us: are we fully adapted at walking on two legs yet? Almost, but not quite. Ever asked yourself why so many people had back problems?


Today, there are tribes live in stone age to the medieval and modern age. There is no sign of transition by actual means which is between species, besides of lazy butt humans causing troubles to themelves by playing with genomes of food, animals, plants etc. or their irreponsible behaviours against their body, in the modern age.

Like I said they were to specialized for the environment they were in. Once that started changing the more adaptable group (us) was able to take over.


Either this claim is too weak or i dont get your point.
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