who thinks communism is good, bad , or misunderstood? i think communism was currupt by that monster Stalin an therefore, it became hard for that form of government to be truely used as Marx had intended it.
I'd rather go toward socialism. Capitalism, like what was argued by Drace and friends, allows the people to be exploited left and right. Capitalism is proven to work with a democracy, but has many internal errors. Socialism is a bit more flexible in nature, and allows the government (if it contains the right people) to have a strengthened control over greedy corporations. It accounts for the individual selfishness of the people and their natural affinity towards competition, superiority (ego-terms apply), and desire for luxury.
(I find Communism has unnecessary flaws that a free market can fix, such as goods distribution/production and the balance of the working class)
Capitalism, like what was argued by Drace and friends, allows the people to be exploited left and right.
It really is the nature of capitalism.
Socialism is a bit more flexible in nature, and allows the government (if it contains the right people) to have a strengthened control over greedy corporations.
I prefer a democratic socialism and not the bourgeois infested Soviet system. So no worries about being the right people.
It accounts for the individual selfishness of the people and their natural affinity towards competition, superiority (ego-terms apply), and desire for luxury.
There is no 'selfishness'. Humans simply strive for happens. They do not reach after money but what makes them happy. In a capitalist society where the message basically is "You need our product to feel happy", a false image of human "nature" is created and the people think only material goods make them happy.
Interestingly, since the 1950s, after the boom of consumerism, national happiness has been declining.
There is no 'selfishness'. Humans simply strive for happiness. They do not reach after money but what makes them happy. In a capitalist society where the message basically is "You need our product to feel happy", a false image of human "nature" is created and the people think only material goods make them happy.
This actually steps into the point I made in the "are humans naturally good or bad". The selfishness I stated was a bit vague, but the term ( to me) is the beneficial or negative effects of the actions specific people make to achieve that happiness.
For example, one person exploits his coworkers to get a better position in his job. That's "the easiest way out" (the most logical). Another person may take the harder route and help his coworkers get to the same position as the other guy, but it takes him another year to get there (which fulfills his "moral" happiness). People can have various degrees of selfishness, and socialism accounts for the individual selfishness, while communism is mostly dependent on the progression selfishness (which in terms is a collection of people's various internal needs to "do the right thing".
The worst thing about communism is that there is no effective way to make people have progressive selfish traits, so they end up dis-unified.
Btw, what is your understand of communism and socialism. Or rather, simply your definitions of them.
My definition of communism is mostly your definition of communism. (From this thread)
I don't have a definite idea of socialism, but it is mostly just democratic socialism.
[i]Comrades, it is pointless arguing with these philistines! All I can say to all of you disagreeing with us and saying that Capitalism is great because you get 'choice' or 'rights' or 'the right to work hard' or 'freedom,' is that you'll be first against the wall when the revolution comes
Are you talking about executions socialist ?( this is a quote from quite a few pages back). If you are talking about executions then you have a great idea there. Lets just kill everybody that disagrees with us. That will really solve all of our problems.
Are you talking about executions socialist ?( this is a quote from quite a few pages back). If you are talking about executions then you have a great idea there. Lets just kill everybody that disagrees with us. That will really solve all of our problems.
any-who..... Democratic centralism ( with help from any communist vangaurds ) protects the best intrest of the people by integrating a little socialism, communism, and most importantly Democracy into one unified system. This has yet to be put into place though because few Dictators allow true democracy!
So therefore, in my books if you have the right examples of people working because they know it is for the best, then they will stop acting like children and put in an honest days work for their nation. But the government must do its part too, it must protect the proletarians' human rights at all costs and be sure to provide enough support for them to live a pretty middle-class life, much like the adverage american family minus the greed. Also the government should be able to make improvments for every ones' daily live, such as game consols, computers, gas or electric stoves, GI Joe dolls ect....
If you were the best in your field in a communist society, you would be head or chief or senior of whatever you specialized it. The government would go to you for advice in your field, and essentially you would be famous, just without the money.
Emphasis mine. That's kinda like buying a sports car without gas. You have what you want, but you can't go anywhere.
Emphasis mine. That's kinda like buying a sports car without gas. You have what you want, but you can't go anywhere.
Well, in a true communistic country, the government would ensure you have a sufficent amount of gas in order to do what ever the fudge you want with that sports car.
There is no "force" that keeps the good things of the market and eliminates the bad. The economy won't evolve under communism, or at least the Russian central planning style communism, since there is no reason to improve the quality of the product, resulting in few/no technological advances.
So therefore, in my books if you have the right examples of people working because they know it is for the best, then they will stop acting like children and put in an honest days work for their nation. But the government must do its part too, it must protect the proletarians' human rights at all costs and be sure to provide enough support for them to live a pretty middle-class life, much like the adverage american family minus the greed. Also the government should be able to make improvments for every ones' daily live, such as game consols, computers, gas or electric stoves, GI Joe dolls ect....
That would require a massively good infrastructure to get it to everyone.
My personal gripe with communism and socialism is that it requires that one perfect person to make it work. Not only that, but it's very hard to instill in people's minds what they're actually working for.
To say that people know they are working for the best and therefore work harder is a very dangerous assumption. What is "the best"? How tangible is it? What promise is there? Put yourselves in Mao's shoes, for example, and think how you would explain the concept of an egalitarian, classless society to a peasant. Peasants are impatient too. How can you convince them to sacrifice a little now for later, when the goal is so lofty? Remember that the World Revolution lies on the shoulders of the not-so-intellectual proletariat.
since there is no reason to improve the quality of the product, resulting in few/no technological advances.
The reason to improve quality is that it thats what people want. When people are in control, it would be in their own interest to improve quality. Technological advances do not happen under the market economy. These things come from advancements in science. What the market economy does produce is a billion useless items with the available technology.
The Russian economy was run by selfish planners who had no interest in the economy. There were many flaws with its system. It shouldn't even be called socialist.
My personal gripe with communism and socialism is that it requires that one perfect person to make it work. Not only that, but it's very hard to instill in people's minds what they're actually working for.
I have written on human nature and to conclude it all... Human nature does not exist. It cannot, as the driving force of action is reason. A law cannot exist unless you are to say reason is limited, but I say it runs free.
One reasons his outcomes to be the best situation. "Best" is determined by what the person values. Because this human 'nature' is flexible, it can be said to come from a capitalist society in which you are reminded so very often that what you should value is yourself.
The argument is a misunderstanding itself as well though. I would assume it comes from the thought that the government is going to control everyone and people are going to obey without question.
