I was reading over some arguments, when I saw some things that went against usual Christian logic. Apparently, against popular beliefs, you do not need to be a Christian to go to Christian heaven. This is just one example of ignorance about your own religion. So, I ask, do you theist know everything, or at least the fundamentals, of your religion? If you do not, how can you justify fully devoting yourself to said religion?
Prayer get answered to help you to further the kingdom of God and sometimes to help you in your times of desperate need really nothing more;
I have a desperate need for some money, seeing as creating matter/energy isn't out of the realm of the impossible for this deity maybe get some prayers for a few pounds of gold maybe? Heck even a few ounces will be fine, no need to get greedy.
Not only would the spontaneous creation of the stuff be useful for getting me out of this slump it would also go a long way to showing me there is indeed a deity out there.
if flying over the Earth would convince someone God existed than so be it but I highly doubt it would.
I would consider a direct correlation with prayer to physically improbable events good evidence for a deity.
To be fair I doubt anyone has so much faith that they would believe God would allow them to do that anyway.
And you end this with doubting the deity?
You coulda said 'answering those prayers would prove the existence of God, but with proof and not faith - people have no free will. With faith alone people can believe in God but don't have to.
Having evidence for something doesn't eliminate free will. Sure denying the existence of god would be foolish to disbelieve, but we could still have free will to choose to follow that god.
I would consider a direct correlation with prayer to physically improbable events good evidence for a deity.
Then I guess my reasons for belief are good enough.
Okay just wondering but what does this have to do with the question of do religious people truly know there religion?
Probably nothing, but its much more interesting. Obviously not all religious people do. Obviously few people with an "I don't care" attitude have no good reason for not caring. Obviously some religious people do know their faith. The question is now answered.
Then I guess my reasons for belief are good enough.
As 314d1 and Avorne illustrated this isn't that case though. There is no indication that prayer has any effect on the world at all. For instance using Avorne's example he survived because the pole was exactly there, he didn't survive because the pole was exactly there. The odds are good either way.
Truth only goes as far as what you believe to be true. In a sense truth is an opinion. Ego-centrism in humans; yes, religious people believe they know their religion.
So, I ask, do you theist know everything, or at least the fundamentals, of your religion?
Does anyone know everything? The fundamentals is opinion.
If you do not, how can you justify fully devoting yourself to said religion?
You cannot perfectly devote yourself without you being perfect in the first place.
I have a desperate need for some money, seeing as creating matter/energy isn't out of the realm of the impossible for this deity maybe get some prayers for a few pounds of gold maybe? Heck even a few ounces will be fine, no need to get greedy.
1.Would you fully know that God gave you the money because of your prayers? 2. Would you truly put faith in God to answer your prayers? 3. Would you give some of the money to the church and poor to further God's kingdom?
If the answer to any of these is no that's why you wouldn't/haven't got your prayers answered.
it would also go a long way to showing me there is indeed a deity out there.
You just said
As 314d1 and Avorne illustrated this isn't that case though. There is no indication that prayer has any effect on the world at all. For instance using Avorne's example he survived because the pole was exactly there, he didn't survive because the pole was exactly there. The odds are good either way.
Would it show you the existence of the deity or would you chalk it up to coincidence?
And you end this with doubting the deity?
No doubting the completeness of my own faith.
Sure denying the existence of god would be foolish to disbelieve, but we could still have free will to choose to follow that god.
Several times during the life of Jesus he was asked by Pharisees to prove that he was God's son by performing miracles but he didn't. Why? Because he knew that even if he showed them he was God's son they would give a reason why it was only a cheap trick or from the devil; the same applies today to many non-Christians.
If god can make the dead live again I'll have faith in him. Good men have died in vain too many times. That would be no cheap trick and I have no belief in the devil
Personal history really. And this is a thing that needs to be seen.
I see well I agree being good in a secular or religious way seems to attract death but the question is does their death promote their cause because if it does, well, they would be happy with the outcome.
Then again it isn't difficult to die for what you believe but living for it, that's nearly impossible.
1.Would you fully know that God gave you the money because of your prayers? 2. Would you truly put faith in God to answer your prayers? 3. Would you give some of the money to the church and poor to further God's kingdom?
Make the evidence fit the conclusion huh?
If God does exist he gave me my ability to reason. If so why would he want me to then go against that ability by just excepting things without proof?
Would it show you the existence of the deity or would you chalk it up to coincidence?
Pray for a pet cat and a cat suddenly walks by, likely coincidence. Pray for a pet cat and one materializes right in front of my eyes, This would be a lot harder to right off as being just coincidence.
Also if there were a significantly higher rate of prayers being answer over not would also help to overcome the possibility of it just being chance. As the video said those being prayed for showed no higher rate of recovery then those who were not.
Jesus, Lazarus, others. You haven't seen it but it has happened and may still be happening we just don't directly attribute it to God.
South Park Jesus: Yeah I can do miracles, but first you all have to turn around. And no peeking!
If God does exist he gave me my ability to reason. If so why would he want me to then go against that ability and just accept things without proof?
No sane human waits for proof before accepting every idea. I can't prove Mars exists, but I accept that it does. An idea may be reasonable but not provable.
Pray for a pet cat and a cat suddenly walks by, likely coincidence. Pray for a pet cat and one materializes right in front of my eyes, This would be a lot harder to right off as being just coincidence.
God also made the natural laws that govern our universe. He sticks to them most of the time- that way we can all know what to expect from this world. If he broke them every time someone prayed, none of us could take any sort of guess at what the future might be.
The prayer video's study has some problems. First of all, you can't say that God didn't answer the prayer. He didn't always give the result you wanted, but he did answer: no. You think, "Why would he answer no? How could healing be a bad thing?". We must remember that we are human, and can't see all the results of a certain thing. I once knew a woman who prayed to be desperate because she relied more on Jesus when she was in trouble. We can't know whether, in the long run, a circumstance will be good for us. A parent may push a child to learn multiplication tables when the child could be playing outside. The child thinks that play outside is better, but the parent knows that in the long run the child will be able to accomplish more if he learns multiplication tables.
I also find it hard to believe that these prayers were the only ones for these patients. Of course some in group two received prayers. The study cannot account for all prayers.
Bad example. Mars can be seen quite easily with the naked eye. You consider a "no answer" an answer, but you have not proved that He hears every prayer. For example: you ask somebody something, that person does not answer. Isn't it possible that he did not hear what you asked? So, the reason to God's silence might be that He either does not exist or that he does not hear all prayers, which means that he is not omnipotent.
