ForumsWEPRDo religious people truthfully know there religion?

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314d1
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314d1
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I was reading over some arguments, when I saw some things that went against usual Christian logic. Apparently, against popular beliefs, you do not need to be a Christian to go to Christian heaven. This is just one example of ignorance about your own religion. So, I ask, do you theist know everything, or at least the fundamentals, of your religion? If you do not, how can you justify fully devoting yourself to said religion?

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samy
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samy
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all as "impossible prayers" witch never happen no matter how well they fit the criteria.


"Which"

Prayer get answered to help you to further the kingdom of God and sometimes to help you in your times of desperate need really nothing more; if flying over the Earth would convince someone God existed than so be it but I highly doubt it would. To be fair I doubt anyone has so much faith that they would believe God would allow them to do that anyway.
Avorne
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Avorne
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Samy, you're missing a trick here. You coulda said 'answering those prayers would prove the existence of God, but with proof and not faith - people have no free will. With faith alone people can believe in God but don't have to. God values free will within humans and so won't do anything that completely proves His existence.'

samy
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samy
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Samy, you're missing a trick here. You coulda said 'answering those prayers would prove the existence of God, but with proof and not faith - people have no free will. With faith alone people can believe in God but don't have to. God values free will within humans and so won't do anything that completely proves His existence.'


Miracles much? God doesn't reveal himself to humans directly because we would die; he is a being of pure glory while we are corrupted by sin. As C.S. Lewis once said

âMiracles are a retelling in small letters of the very same story which is written across the whole world in letters too large for some of us to see.â
Avorne
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Avorne
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But miracles by their very nature are rare. They can be attributed to God or Luck or whatever. We are not in the grip of constant miracles. Although for that matter, just because something isn't good doesn't mean it isn't miraculous - instead of 'he survived because the pole was EXACTLY there.' it could just as easily be 'he died because the pole was EXACTLY there.'

samy
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samy
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But miracles by their very nature are rare. They can be attributed to God or Luck or whatever. We are not in the grip of constant miracles. Although for that matter, just because something isn't good doesn't mean it isn't miraculous - instead of 'he survived because the pole was EXACTLY there.' it could just as easily be 'he died because the pole was EXACTLY there.'


Are they or do they occur in everyday life? As you said it isn't possible to prove whether something was mere luck or an actual miracle which generally means this debate has a moot point unless you wish to continue it?
Avorne
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Avorne
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No, I think we've reached the end of this line. Any further points we made would indeed be moot

samy
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samy
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Indeed;

So let's drift away to another point perhaps with a verse as the beginning:

The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.
-John 10:10


Perhaps my favorite passage of scripture. Anything you feel like debating about it?
Avorne
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Avorne
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Mind if I bring Exodus into this?

"If a thief is caught breaking in and is struck so that he dies, the defender is not guilty of bloodshed;"
Exodus 22:1-3

Whereas John shows mercy to the thief, Exodus does not.

samy
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samy
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Maybe I should clarify the verse first =P

In John 10

The words are being said be Jesus.

The thief is referring to Satan.

He comes to steal, kill, and destroy our chances at full life in Christ.

Avorne
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Avorne
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Oh right. I was gonna mention the contradiction. Erm, no quarrels there then. Can I ask why God created Evil if he is a benevolent Lord?

samy
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samy
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Can I ask why God created Evil if he is a benevolent Lord?


Creating good would create evil as creating light creates dark, creating heat creates cold, etc.

God gives free will but also expects us to attempt to adhere to a certain moral standard (good) by not following it we are being, in a way, evil.
Avorne
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Avorne
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Well, yes but isn't God a hypocrite then?

I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God - Jealousy is a Sin

The destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah - Death does nobody any favours...

"Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones." - ???

samy
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samy
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"Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones."


Verse?

I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God - Jealousy is a Sin


In circumstances yes. However not all sins are end alls for what they entail.
Avorne
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Avorne
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psalms 137 I believe. I can't where abouts in 137 it is though, sorry.

samy
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samy
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Found it; basically from what I got it was a cry from the Israelites for God to destroy Babylon including their infants.

Apparently they weren't particularly happy.

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