Forums → WEPR → Satan

If said creator was all loving as he claims to be, then he would have a lesser punishment than eternal torture for doing what he felt was right.

Interesting, how does that fit into the concept of God being all for free will? There are also examples of people being killed by God not for disobeying his commands but for others doing so. For instance all the first borns being killed because the pharaoh wouldn't release God's people. Also regardless of the reason according to the Bible, these are deaths that are a direct result of God. So your argument that God doesn't kill people is in error since reason is not a factor.

"Sigh"

You know how hard it is to drive home a point to you? Very.

Satan is the Prince of the Earth he has the power to influence our decisions and is responsible for every death in human history. Why? "For the wages of sin is death". Sin=death Satan wants you to sin so that you will die (in both a literal and figurative way) and join him in his eternal suffering.

Also he rebelled against God and is therefore the epitome of evil.

Well, nothing really fits into the concept of God giving people free will if he says that if you CHOOSE not to worship him you're going to hell... It may be a choice, but weighted choices such as that do not constitute free will.

I would want to go the hell anyways, popular notions of heaven bore me.

Those were because the people were so evil that God removed them from the world; I'm talking the most evil the world had ever experienced.

Satan knew he was wrong, he simply was jealous. Get your facts right please.

Free Will means you choose your own path. It does not mean the path you choose will no bring its consequences.

So evil that an omnipotent being could do nothing other that commit genocide? What had they done to deserve that? The only thing that would be logical would have been if they, every man; woman; child; donkey; tree etc all had committed genocide in some form. Witch they did not do, but God did...

First: What is right and what is wrong is for the person to decide. To me, it seems like Satan was a right hand man. If Adolf Hitler's right hand man started a revelation against Hitler, those loyal to Hitler would think that the rebel was cruel, but the Jewish people he would be saving would think of him positively.

Second, if he was jealous, then isn't that a good thing? Since god is jealous, and god is supposedly all good, than that trait is positive and good for Satan to have.

Chose your own path. Death and torture or slavery. Great choices from an all loving god...

Satan is the Prince of the Earth he has the power to influence our decisions and is responsible for every death in human history. Why? "For the wages of sin is death". Sin=death Satan wants you to sin so that you will die (in both a literal and figurative way) and join him in his eternal suffering.

Also he rebelled against God and is therefore the epitome of evil.

There are hardcore atheists out there, but its hilarious because it's obvious you just want to be a rebel. If there was a "atheist heaven" exactly like God's heaven, you'd be all for it. Of all people here, you may be the most close minded.

Free Will is that you can choose not to follow him. It has repercussions. That's life man grow up and smell the real world.

Yet god created sin and thus is responsible for every death as well. I can't remember the original text, if there was some, that said Satan wanted you to sin, but it is not something we talked about in Bible school. Could you bring them up por favor?

1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"
2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "

4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves.

He rebelled against a genocidal, pig headed, little kid playing with an ant farm. How is that evil?

" It is free will. Take the apple or the orange. The apple is poisoned though" great choice.

Now he could either take away their free will or kill them; I personally would rather die than be forced to do something as extreme as love someone.

Lucifer was God's musician and was one of the three named angels in the bible; he is extremely powerful.

Comparing God to Hitler? Whatever. Satan had other angels follow him, the demon

God is jealous in the way a man is whose wife has had sex with another man and betrayed him.

Satan is jealous in the way that a man is jealous of his boss who is superior to him in all ways.

Death or Life. I choose life.Death or Life. I choose life.

God created good logically sin is the opposite of good so by knowing good you would know sin.

1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"
2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "

4 "You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. 5 "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

Kill or don't kill; killing will get you killed though.

Or, he could have done something less extreme than murder everyone, including the innocents, like putting them in a separate planet for a few years or community service. Why would genocide EVER be acceptable?

That is not much of an argument, Hitler's right hand man would have followers as well.

That is your interpretation. The Bible merely says "jealous" thus can be interpreted as anything.

But with your view, anything god does is good, even if when some one else does it it is bad.

I choose death over eternal slavery.

Lets say there is a planet far away that never has war. It would be peaceful without knowing war, you don't need one to have the other.

Not Satan

He told the truth, didn't he? No reason to force him to eat dirt. Even though he doesn't eat dirt. How did he move before his punishment, anyway?

Yes, don't kill. Not even if there is a guy with a knife going after your wife, never kill or you will be killed. Don't worry, god can kill just fine. It is just you who can't kill.

You're quite insufferable you know. Murder is nearly always viewed as wrong while killing in war is generally not. You don't get context (not just in the bible) which is of utmost importance in any circumstance.

What? That's illogical and pointless what do you want him to do put them in camps where they are brainwashed into loving him? It's the same thing sir.

Do they know that what they are doing is right though? You need both to understand one which was why the serpent (Satan) had Eve eat the fruit.

The serpent is Satan.

The a sense yes but in reality Eve would be spiritually dead.

The sin or crime doesn't matter all are punished it's up to you to do the right thing.

That wouldn't be in the Bible. Bad logic.

Those were because the people were so evil that God removed them from the world; I'm talking the most evil the world had ever experienced.

He is able and willing, yet tests us for our worthiness. Wether you agree with that or not, you know that's what's taught to Christians. Think Avorne, you're better than that.

Free Will is that you can choose not to follow him. It has repercussions. That's life man grow up and smell the real world.

The only thing that would be logical would have been if they, every man; woman; child; donkey; tree etc all had committed genocide in some form. Witch they did not do, but God did..

You must realize that it is because of Satan that God killed all those people. God did not sin, obviously, it was Satan. He convinced Adam and Eve to eat the forbidden fruit. He was punished in Genesis, and will be dealt with in the last days.

God is jealous in the way a man is whose wife has had sex with another man and betrayed him.

Satan is jealous in the way that a man is jealous of his boss who is superior to him in all ways.

Death or Life. I choose life.

God created good logically sin is the opposite of good so by knowing good you would know sin.

Satan is responsible for the first sin; he wanted them to sin.

Kill or don't kill; killing will get you killed though.

What? That's illogical and pointless what do you want him to do put them in camps where they are brainwashed into loving him? It's the same thing sir.

You're quite insufferable you know. Murder is nearly always viewed as wrong while killing in war is generally not. You don't get context (not just in the bible) which is of utmost importance in any circumstance.

The sin or crime doesn't matter all are punished it's up to you to do the right thing.

Angels are creatures of good, spirits of love, and messengers of the savior Jesus Christ, so I really cannot understand why they turn bad some times.
They already have the knowledge of celestial things, therefore if they know the omniscience, omnibenevolence, omnipresence, omnipotence, justice and holiness of God why should they reject and fight Him?

So evil that an omnipotent being could do nothing other that commit genocide? What had they done to deserve that? The only thing that would be logical would have been if they, every man; woman; child; donkey; tree etc all had committed genocide in some form. Witch they did not do, but God did..

First: What is right and what is wrong is for the person to decide. To me, it seems like Satan was a right hand man. If Adolf Hitler's right hand man started a revelation against Hitler, those loyal to Hitler would think that the rebel was cruel, but the Jewish people he would be saving would think of him positively.

Second, if he was jealous, then isn't that a good thing? Since god is jealous, and god is supposedly all good, than that trait is positive and good for Satan to have.

Chose your own path. Death and torture or slavery. Great choices from an all loving god...

Of course, what were you thinking? There obviously no bad logic in the Bible like, people being turned into pillars of salt, talking snakes, a global flood, healing spit. The whole Bible is completely logical.

Yes, but according to the Bible I would go to hell if I shot the man going after my wife and I would be spiritually dead for sinning, according to you.

As stated before not everyone killed by God was killed because of them being evil.

A test that the answer is already known is no test at all.

That is when the consequence is unavoidable. In the case of God the consequence is imposed by God as such could be avoidable if God chose for it to be so.

Let's say a girl walks down a dark ally and a rapist jumps out and rapes her. Is it her fault for walking down the ally or is it the rapists for committing the act?

die free or live on your knees. Liberty or death?

So God didn't want Adam and Eve to know him?

So jail is illogical? Putting them someplace else where they could no have any influence on this world would still allow them to continue living and doing what the please. But instead the choice was to just wipe them out.

As I said before it doesn't say the snake was Satan.

Unless your God.