I've stated my opinions on Socialism before in other threads, but it wasn't the appropriate place to put the. I have debated with several of you on my ideas, but I crave a more in depth debate.
I think the government should provide services that humans are entitled to. The rest are luxuries, and those luxuries should be provided to companies. These are thing an individual person should have.
The government should provide healthcare, education (this includes money for universities), water, electricity, waste management, parks, and roads.
There should be a 40% tax on anyone who make $25 000 or more annually. That means, if you make $25 000, you don't pay taxes. If you make $26 000 annually, you have to pay 40% tax.
Here is a scenario. The average man makes around $50 000, no? If you make $50 000, then you get to keep $30 000.
With those $30 000, you only have to pay for your mortgage, car, food, and family.
The rule of thumb for paying a house, is five times your annual salary, or five years worth of income. A person who makes $50 000, should buy a house that is around $200 000. If you take out a mortgage for twenty years, you have to pay $10 000 a year. Right there, you only have $20 000 to spend.
Now, an average car that costs $12 000 lasts about six years. If gas costs $50 a month, then in one year, you spend $600 in one year. Right there, you have spent $22 600 and have $ 7 400 to spend.
Food for one month costs around $300 a month. In one year, that is $3 600. So now you have spent $26 200.
Television, phone, internet costs around $100 a month, so in one year, you spend $1 200 on that. Now, you have spent $27 400. The rest, $2 300, can go to your savings.
In your second year, since you already have a car, you have $12 000 extra. Furniture in total costs around $10 000. So, you have spent $25 400 on basic things. The rest of that, $4 600, can go to your savings.
So now you have a car, furniture and beds, a home, television, phone, internet, food, and gas in two years, without going over your budget.
In your third year, since you have another $12 000 to spare, since you already bought your car and furniture. Now, you if you always put $5 000 for every year, on savings, you have $7 000 to spend on whatever else you want. I think that's a pretty good deal. You can collect shoes, buy toys and games for your children, and actually live your life.
Now, for Libertarians, they would do other things. Everything would be privatized.
If the average person makes $50 000, they get to almost all of it. Let's see how that works out.
So, education costs around $9 000 a year. Healthcare costs $10 000 a year. Utilities, such as water, lighting, electricity, etc. costs around $9 000. Water costs $250 a month, so annually, $3 000. Electricity costs monthly, $350 a month, so annually $4 200. Gas costs $600 you have. Internet, phone, and television costs $1 200.
So all that costs, $28 000. That's more than what you would spend in taxes. Taxes only cost $20 000.
Even if you have no children, or conserve your money wisely, you only have, at most, $5 000 extra. Now, wouldn't you miss parks, roads, public transportation, and other things?
And I do sorry for not clarifying that. Obviously I don't want something just for the sake of having it. But in the case of the candy bar, I will eat the extra candy bars at some point. And even if I don't, I can still sell the candy bars, or *gasp* save my money and buy myself a better candy bar.
Now, If I just replace candy bar with healthcare I get:
And I do sorry for not clarifying that.
It's okay.
Obviously I don't want something just for the sake of having it.
Okay.
But in the case of healthcare, I will use the healthcare at some point.
Exactly.
And even if I don't, I can still sell the healthcare, or *gasp* save my money and buy myself better healthcare.
Well, the government provided healthcare will be the best because it can afford the best. It will cover everything from dental check ups to open heart surgery. Health insurance companies will provide what is cheaper.
But anyway, why would I want to barely scrape by when I have enough resources to live like a King?
With $25 000 you don't live like a king. You are actually quite poor.
Well, the government provided healthcare will be the best
I honestly have no idea what you're talking about with this. Government health care will be the best. Wait I have an idea, let's replace health care with school systems. So now it reads
Government provided schooling will be the best
Oh wait, that didn't work out like that did it.
With $25 000 you don't live like a king. You are actually quite poor.
I never said I had $25,0000. I said it doesn't make sense that people who can live like kings (making $200,000) shouldn't be allowed to.
Well, the government provided healthcare will be the best
[quote]I honestly have no idea what you're talking about with this. Government health care will be the best. Wait I have an idea, let's replace health care with school systems. So now it reads
[quote]Government provided schooling will be the best
[quote]Oh wait, that didn't work out like that did it.
[/quote][/quote][/quote]
What I am saying, is that given the proper funding, it will be the best. Like I said before, government funded education currently is terrible because it has such poor funding.
I never said I had $25,000. I said it doesn't make sense that people who can live like kings (making $200,000) shouldn't be allowed to.
If you make $200 000, then you get to keep $120 000. If you can live comfortably with $30 000, like I planned out in the OP, then imagine how you will live with $120 000.
When did you become an expert on my comfort level? And either way I'd prefer not to give up $80,000 for a reason that I derive no benefit from.
What I am saying, is that given the proper funding, it will be the best. Like I said before, government funded education currently is terrible because it has such poor funding.
So what you're saying is that the government doesn't have it's priorities straight correct? In that case, why should I trust them with even more money than I do already?
When did you become an expert on my comfort level?
Comfortably is when you can afford all your necessities and more without having to worry about going into debt.
And either way I'd prefer not to give up $80,000 for a reason that I derive no benefit from.
Do you know how much $120 000 is?
So what you're saying is that the government doesn't have it's priorities straight correct? In that case, why should I trust them with even more money than I do already?
I am saying, that currently, we have a bad education because the government is in debt. You think that with two wars, deregulated bank, a sluggish economy, unemployed workers, and thousands of foreclosures across the country, the government can afford that?
I do not have a solution for this economy. I am just proposing that with a stable economy, socialism will work.
I am just proposing that with a stable economy, socialism will work
Except for people like me. :P
Those taxes are going to benefit the society as a whole. So as long as you are part of that society you are benefiting from it.
Son you have no clue how taxes work do you? Come have a seat on daddy's leg and he'll tell you all about it. But in all seriousness, this is not necessarily the case. For example, taxes that go towards Medicare don't effect me.
Comfortably is when you can afford all your necessities and more without having to worry about going into debt.
Pardon me while I laugh. I'll just ignore this statement.
Do you know how much $120 000 is?
Yes, do you know how much $80,000 is? Because you seem to have no appreciation for that amount of money.
and in a flashback to your original post.
I think the government should provide services that humans are entitled to
Well sex is something necessary for humans. But I don't see the government paying for that. I don't mean that they have to pay for a prostitute but at least a subscription to some form of adult entertainment. I can take care of the rest myself *cough* reference to another post you made *cough*
Son you have no clue how taxes work do you? Come have a seat on daddy's leg and he'll tell you all about it. But in all seriousness, this is not necessarily the case. For example, taxes that go towards Medicare don't effect me.
Medicare wouldn't need to be provided since universal healthcare would replace it. As long as you are human, you have healthcare.
In my world, anyone who pays taxes benefits. Your children get universal education, you get universal healthcare, you don't have to worry about utilities, and you just need to worry about your dwelling and food.
Pardon me while I laugh. I'll just ignore this statement.
Well, you recognized the post, but avoided the argument it posed to you.
Yes, do you know how much $80,000 is? Because you seem to have no appreciation for that amount of money.
It is a lot of money, but you wouldn't spend it on anything anyway. Anything useful, at least.
and in a flashback to your original post.
I think the government should provide services that humans are entitled to
The things I posted in the OP are the thing the government should provide.
I did not read the other posts, and I don't care to because im going to throw a ignornat comment out...
Norway had adopted socialism, and there doing just fine, better then the USA, better then China, better then France... Of cource there not huge, and have a limited population so that may be a reason.
I did not read the other posts, and I don't care to because im going to throw a ignornat comment out...
That's fine with me.
Norway had adopted socialism, and there doing just fine, better then the USA, better then China, better then France... Of cource there not huge, and have a limited population so that may be a reason.
Thank you for this wonderful example of socialism at its best.
Norway had adopted socialism, and there doing just fine, better then the USA, better then China, better then France... Of cource there not huge, and have a limited population so that may be a reason.
better how... because in terms of GDP, USA, China, and France is higher than Norway
It is a lot of money, but you wouldn't spend it on anything anyway. Anything useful, at least.
Economics, Watson. Because when I buy stuff the money I spend just disappears. Except for the fact that it goes into the pockets of workers who make the product or provide the services I buy.
Necessities and entitlements are different
I laughed when you implied that sex isn't a necessity.
They don't have lots of resources, how are they supposed to pump out money? They have the highest standard of living, which is what people want, right?
They don't have lots of resources, how are they supposed to pump out money? They have the highest standard of living, which is what people want, right?
You do realize that GDP is an indicator of a countries standard of living right?
