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thepyro222
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thepyro222
2,150 posts
Peasant

I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done.
I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please

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Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

Wasn't this Christianity FTW?


Yes it was, but someone transposed the last 3 letters.
Nurvana
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Nurvana
2,520 posts
Farmer

Who? I'm sure it wasn't an atheist moderator...

Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

Who? I'm sure it wasn't an atheist moderator...


No idea who did it, I only know when - which was the 21'st of May pretty much right after everyone had 100% concluded the world wasn't going to end. I thought it had something to do with that at first, but who knows?
Nurvana
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Nurvana
2,520 posts
Farmer

I thought it had something to do with that at first, but who knows?


I doubt it. Anyone who has the brains to be in the situation to change titles in the first place wouldn't be dumb enough to directly connect christianity with the crapture.
Kasic
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Kasic
5,552 posts
Jester

Anyone who has the brains to be in the situation to change titles in the first place wouldn't be dumb enough to directly connect christianity with the crapture.


Well, I originally thought it was just a joke, as in, "The rapture didn't happen, WTF" Oh well.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

Anyone who has the brains to be in the situation to change titles in the first place wouldn't be dumb enough to directly connect christianity with the crapture.


I the whole idea of the rapture came out of Christianity. In fact Christian detractors weren't arguing against the rapture happening but the fact Camping gave a specific date. The whole people just disappearing, zombies walking around, devil showing up and the world ending. That's all going to happen, your not crazy for thinking that. But pin a specific date on it and your a nut job. >_>
dair5
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dair5
3,371 posts
Shepherd

Well the idea was the world would end. But in the bible it says only the father would know when. So it seems pretty far fetched to say you can put a date on it.

MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

Well the idea was the world would end. But in the bible it says only the father would know when. So it seems pretty far fetched to say you can put a date on it.


That pretty much proves my point. And so what, given how the can be interpreted small verses are often ignored. For instance maybe he figured information like when the rapture would happen could be derived from the Bible, given it came from the only being who does know when it will happen.
vesperbot
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vesperbot
955 posts
Nomad

Why does God show himself in these miracles but not in more obvious ways?
I am not to say why God does this and not that. And I have already said this before. You just don't listen. However, this can provide some answers: "Being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God was coming, (Jesus) answered them, "The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed; nor will they say, `Lo, here it is!' or `There!' for behold, the kingdom of God is in the midst of you."" Lk 17:20-21. The same is with the signs of God.
This is however something that could be verified, but I doubt the church would allow a non bias party enough access to do so.
Well, you might request this, and the party that should request should be atheistic or at least unbelieving, since you and those like you wouldn't accept the weighing confirmation should this be done by a believer, claiming we're biased.
Telling you to show proof and saying your ideology is retarded is not bigoted.
All us atheists are doing is simply calling bull****
No it is, because when we start speaking about spiritual, you either say "there is none" ignoring evidence that supports our case, or use "mental gymnastics" argument. This is bigotry, and you're accusing us with it while doing the same.
That's all going to happen, your not crazy for thinking that. But pin a specific date on it and your a nut job. >_>
Yes, exactly. After all, Jesus said "But of that day or that hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." Mk 13:32. Also there is another verse speaking about times: "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be in the days of the Son of man. hey ate, they drank, they married, they were given in marriage, until the day when Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. Likewise as it was in the days of Lot -- they ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built, but on the day when Lot went out from Sodom fire and sulphur rained from heaven and destroyed them all -- so will it be on the day when the Son of man is revealed." Lk 17:26-30, similarly Mt 24:36-39. So everything will be just as normal, then bam, surprise. "Blessed is that servant whom his master when he comes will find so doing. Truly, I say to you, he will set him over all his possessions." Mt 24:46-47. Just imagine, being set over all the universe... And I believe even this isn't as big as what God holds for those who will enter Heaven.
sprooschicken
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sprooschicken
1,143 posts
Nomad

if god really had any brains he wouldnt send atheists to hell, hed sned us to heaven, where wed all be bitter and resentful for all eternity

MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

I am not to say why God does this and not that.


Why not? Christians seem to do an awful lot of speaking for God.

Well, you might request this, and the party that should request should be atheistic or at least unbelieving, since you and those like you wouldn't accept the weighing confirmation should this be done by a believer, claiming we're biased.


Just someone who doesn't care one way or the other beyond the facts. Even still while it would be very odd I don't think the weight of it alone is enough to prove it a miracle and definitely not the claim of how it came into existence.

No it is, because when we start speaking about spiritual, you either say "there is none" ignoring evidence that supports our case, or use "mental gymnastics" argument. This is bigotry, and you're accusing us with it while doing the same.


If your talking about all those subjective claims you keep dragging out then it haven't provided anything worth while evidence to acknowledge. We have no reason to accept your baseless claims at face value while denying others.


Yes, exactly. After all, Jesus said "But of that day or that hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." Mk 13:32. Also there is another verse speaking about times: "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be in the days of the Son of man. hey ate, they drank, they married, they were given in marriage, until the day when Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. Likewise as it was in the days of Lot -- they ate, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they built, but on the day when Lot went out from Sodom fire and sulphur rained from heaven and destroyed them all -- so will it be on the day when the Son of man is revealed." Lk 17:26-30, similarly Mt 24:36-39. So everything will be just as normal, then bam, surprise. "Blessed is that servant whom his master when he comes will find so doing. Truly, I say to you, he will set him over all his possessions." Mt 24:46-47. Just imagine, being set over all the universe... And I believe even this isn't as big as what God holds for those who will enter Heaven.


Done preaching? That really comes across as just plain stupid.
vesperbot
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vesperbot
955 posts
Nomad

Even still while it would be very odd I don't think the weight of it alone is enough to prove it a miracle
Well, unless you will be able to provide a plausible scientific explanation of how a part of an object can weigh as the whole, this is a miracle by definition.
Why not? Christians seem to do an awful lot of speaking for God.
Like what? If someone said "God might do this and this" or "God did this and this", it's pretty normal by Christian standards, however might be true or false in regard of "this" being different. I have attended an astronomy lecture about a week ago, and an interesting info appeared there, that when life on Earth appeared at ~3b years ago, it did not evolve into multicellular structures up to 800m years ago, that's twice the period for the rest of the evolution. The lecturer was a professor of astronomy, and he claimed that there was a great gamma-ray flash of a supernova, which was directed at Earth so this planet was hit by an unprecedented gamma-ray radiation which caused numerous mutations in living forms, which in turn caused multicellular life to appear. So a Christian could say "God did make this flash happen in order to instill an evolution", and won't be far from truth. But a Christian cannot say "God did this because (any reason)" since God's reasons are inperceivable, and can only be revealed, in which case it is normally declared as a vision, investigated, tested against morale given by Jesus and apostolic teaching, and probably rejected as self-proclaim or otherwise. In case of a true vision (that passed the entirety of the tests the Church makes in such a case, the vision should end before being named as "constat de supernaturalitate&quot this is accepted as a valid source.
Done preaching? That really comes across as just plain stupid.
Hmm. Whoever has ears, let him hear.
MageGrayWolf
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MageGrayWolf
9,462 posts
Farmer

Well, unless you will be able to provide a plausible scientific explanation of how a part of an object can weigh as the whole, this is a miracle by definition.


Unless this claim is verified outside the church it's not evidence. Further more we would have to establish a supernatural cause which is a task in itself. Just because we might end up pinning a "we don't know" on it doesn't automatically give magic a free pass.

While I would find it interesting it wouldn't be conclusive of anything.

Like what?


As exampled with the joke image.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/MageGrayWolf/atheistjokes/understanding.jpg

I have attended an astronomy lecture about a week ago, and an interesting info appeared there, that when life on Earth appeared at ~3b years ago, it did not evolve into multicellular structures up to 800m years ago, that's twice the period for the rest of the evolution. The lecturer was a professor of astronomy, and he claimed that there was a great gamma-ray flash of a supernova, which was directed at Earth so this planet was hit by an unprecedented gamma-ray radiation which caused numerous mutations in living forms, which in turn caused multicellular life to appear.


That sounds pretty sketchy. A gamma ray burst like that would cause a mass extinction. A short gamma ray burst may have happened blowing off most of the Earth's ozone and causing an extinction event, but this occurred in the Ordovician period. Multicellular life would have been around for a while by then. Listening to a professor in astronomy on biological evolution is a bit like listening to a podiatrist on oral care.

"God did make this flash happen in order to instill an evolution"


But this statement gives a reason why.

Hmm. Whoever has ears, let him hear.


Whoever has brains, let them think.
vesperbot
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vesperbot
955 posts
Nomad

"God did make this flash happen in order to instill an evolution"

But this statement gives a reason why.
Well, yes indeed. It's possible that I have missed the main point of why people state "God did it because (a reason concerning human behavior)". This one is forbidden. Like one of our local Orthodox priests said "The earthquake of Fukushima is a sure sign of wrath of God against Japanese" IIRC, this is plain wrong and actually goes in line with that trial you mentioned somewhere above, where a Jesuit said "this is for your sins" and caught fire execution. However, it is possible that I too have treaded past the line with that one.
A gamma ray burst like that would cause a mass extinction.
Well, it's quite possible that a mass extinction happened at that time. It looks like you're referring to this, and given my ineptitude at correct geohistoric periods, it is possible that the lecturer spoke about some earlier event at about 800-1000M years ago. Can't say with more detail. Okay, let it be dropped, I don't have enough data to argue properly.
Unless this claim is verified outside the church it's not evidence.
Well, since this is verifiable, you have the right to ask for verification. But this is already an evidence.
Further more we would have to establish a supernatural cause which is a task in itself. Just because we might end up pinning a "we don't know" on it doesn't automatically give magic a free pass.
In case of this proven true, logic starts to work leading to something above mundane. Still, in order to have someone outside the Church to prove this, unbelievers have to either consider it needed and request to conduct another research, or initiate some other movement, probably involving priests, to do the same, while maintaining access to verification procedure. We are satisfies with belief and provided evidence.
HahiHa
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HahiHa
8,253 posts
Regent

Like what? If someone said "God might do this and this" or "God did this and this", it's pretty normal by Christian standards, however might be true or false in regard of "this" being different.

What about all the people who preach that god said this and this, and will do this and this (without any "might&quot? What about the people who kill in god's name? Also, how can one stay a true believer knowing that noone can know what god thinks, and therefore not being sure to even be a true christian anyway?

That is the B-2 Stealth Bomber, what they saw were the running lights.

Test flights of the F-117A are also suspected to have been the origin of sighting of triangular UFOs, at least I've read. Bit off-topic, but interesting^^
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