Forums → WEPR → Theism and Atheism
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I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done.
I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please
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If you do not believe in God through the bible, you are talking about another religion entirely, and cannot claim to be a Christian. Perhaps you made this point earlier, but I didn't even attempt to skim over the 188 pages within this thread.
No, you're wrong. Just because I don't believe every word in the bible doesn't make me unchristian. I believe that Jesus Christ was God in skin and came down to suffer so that we may live. Being a Christian is not about going to church every Sunday, being a Christian is not about mindlessly believing every word of the Bible, Being a Christian is not about telling other religions they are false. Being a Christian is about believing that Jesus is God in skin and he came down to Earth to set an example for people of how to live their lives, and also to die on the cross to absolve everyone of their sins. That's it.
^ So you you believe the god from the bible, but not in the bible? Right. I'll just end this there.
^ So you you believe the god from the bible, but not in the bible? Right. I'll just end this there.I believe God's bigger than the Bible
I believe God's bigger than the Bible
I agree with you.
G-D is the faith you have in yoursef.
Well, I joined this pretty late, but I wanted to quick say one thing (yes, I know it is one page old).
[/quote]You get both of these ideas from the bible. And if you chose to believe them, you chose to believe the entire bible. Thus, you must believe God created the universe in 6 days, and on the 7th day rested. And thus the universe is about 10,000 years old.[quote]
The book of Genesis is more of a poetic book. I believe in God and the Bible, but I also believe that the six days were representative. God's time is different than our time - so the six days could have been hundreds of thousands of years, or older. So I believe the earth is millions of years old, and God made it - not the big bang.
Nowhere will you see the words warm and fuzzy. For comfort yes.
warm and fuzzy as in a good feeling, comfort as in a good feeling... -_-
Your term is still wrong, an emotional plea is a request made on emotion. I am not requesting anything.
Okay maybe I am using the wrong term, appeal to emotion is not though.
"Instead of facts, persuasive language is used to develop the foundation of an appeal to emotion-based argument. Thus, the validity of the premises that establish such an argument does not prove to be verifiable."
Instead of facts to believe in God you claim to believe based on that it makes you feel comfortable to believe it. Thus using this stance to justify the validity of your belief.
Unless I'm totally off base on what you mean by comfort here.
I have a very open mind and you have not provided me with any new information - when new information is presented i do take it on board, and as stated, would admit i was wrong.
So you don't see how basing a belief on no proof is flawed? Which you have clearly admit to doing? Before you yet again try to trot out how this is in science I have already covered how it's not!
You clearly haven't bothered reading where i've stated if science produces 100% concrete evidence i would change my mind and accept i was wrong.
We can't get 100% as it has to remain falsifiable in order to to revise improving or if need be discarding outdated and false views. However what we do have is you accepting something with 0% evidence then turning around and demanding 100% evidence to stop believing it.
Happen to see something just a bit off here?
The "Big Bang" is a generally-accepted leap of faith also.
No it's not. It's based on evidence that can be observed and tested for.
Show me 100% evidence for the big bang theory - that it is indisputably correct, and i will admit you're right.
Demonstrating how religious views result in the denial of science.
I'm confused, so you can only be one or the other? You can't be a critical thinker at sometimes and a beliver in other times? As long as you don't mix the two then what's the problem?
Why be so inconsistent and use double standards?
I believe two things... and these I know for sure, is that 1: God created the universe and 2: Jesus Christ died to show sacrifice and absolve people from their sins. Everything else, I'm still trying to figure out
There is no objective evidence for them so you don't know for sure, you just believe you do.
You have no videotape or other recorded medium of the Big Bang because humanity was not around then. We only have a good presumption that the Big Bang actually occurred based on astronomical evidence after-the-fact.
We can use such information to come to such a conclusion. Because multiple people have been able to independently do this it's accepted as such.
It's like how we don't need to be present or see footage at the time a car accident happened to deduce that the two cars we see smashed in got into an accident with one another.
We don't have evidence even of this sort that can be independently observed and tested and have that independent viewer come to the conclusion of there being a God.
You can show me provisional evidence*
What we have is objective evidence.
What i don't understand is why does someone have to be right?
We'll know when we know - when one proves itself.
We are gaining knowledge based on observation and experimentation but your denying it based on an unobtainable goal which you clearly do not apply to what you do believe.
I accept and respect those who believe in the big bang theory.
& I'd like to think they'd respect those who believe in God.
I can respect those who believe in God, the belief is another matter.
those doubting religion will continue to doubt it and those doubting science will continue to doubt it.
Those doubting science don't seem to understand it.
No, you don't have to believe the entire bible. That statement is ignorant. Were they spawned by the bible? yes, but there are many things about the bible that I find wrong, or I believe that they were put there by people, Not God.
What makes you think these two things you picked out of the Bible are correct while others aren't? Just a subjective feeling perhaps? Maybe you had some subjective experience that can't be verified that what your accurately evaluating that experience?
With science we discard these things in order to arrive at a more accurate view.
You don't have to believe the entire bible. God is not within the bible, God lives outside the bible, you're putting God in a little box. The God I believe in is too big for your little box.
Your God appears to be a little box giving you a skewed view of the actual world around you.
^ So you you believe the god from the bible, but not in the bible? Right. I'll just end this there.
It's not a requirement to believe or even follow everything in the Bible. However the Bible isn't providing evidence but a claim, which then is claimed as evidence from an admittedly poor source.
^
Scoff and cry for and at you. I bet you think very highly of yourself.
Message to atheists... Why can't you guys leave Christians alone? there's a difference to someone who doesn't believe and someone who is an Atheist. An Atheist is somebody who is against belief in any religion. Do Christians ridicule Gay people who don't believe in God? Not really with the exception of very few. Being Gay is a sin, and having a religion isn't a legit sin. Yes, in countries people can be punished, but its not a sin. And yes you don't want to believe there is a God because Satan has taken control of your lives
To Mage Wolf:
Science is a series of Theories and Facts and Opinions.
Christianity is a belief.
^
I agree!
And what I truly don't understand about atheists, is their lack of reason. Sure, they will simply say everything they believe is 100% backed by evidence, that they cannot hope to understand how it was obtained, but they don't understand the risk involved. Neither side can give absolute proof displaying they are correct. But if atheists are right, when we die we are both bodies in the ground or ashes in the wind, with the same chance to be remembered by the world as the next guy. But if Christians are right, Atheists lose. Forever.
So what is the reasoning behind being an atheist? Are you striving to feel like being certain of something? Are you obsessed with worldly things? Why must you be so obsessed with proof? Have you never had an impulse in your life? De Ja Vu? Is nothing in your life really without explanation? Why not just kill yourself and remove all the hard work that you have to do to live? How can you understand anyone doing a good thing?
By being an atheist, you are simply betting whether you will go to hell or go to a coffin in the ground. Nothing be self gratification comes from the belief.
Scoff and cry for and at you. I bet you think very highly of yourself.
What I'm saying has nothing to do with what I think of myself. Why the personal attack instead of debating my points?
Message to atheists... Why can't you guys leave Christians alone?
Stop trying to make laws based on your religious views, remove it from the money I use, trying to suppress science and teach your religion in schools, treating people as evil for not sharing your views, trying to suppress medical breakthroughs, ...
...Pretty sure I forgot something in that.
Why do atheists care about religion?
Why Atheists Care About YOUR Religion
Anyway I'm more against faith which religion relies on. Like this girl, The True Enemy
To Mage Wolf:
Science is a series of Theories and Facts and Opinions.
Christianity is a belief.
Your point?
Why can't you guys leave Christians alone?
Because religious people can't leave non-religious people alone. You force your beliefs on us all, bother us with them, try to convert us, call us sinners and attack us for it. We're simply saying what you believe doesn't make sense, you're saying we're evil.
An Atheist is somebody who is against belief in any religion.
*BZZZZZZRTTTT* Wrong! An Atheist is someone who does not have a belief in any sort of god/deity. That's where it ends.
Do Christians ridicule Gay people who don't believe in God?
Yes.
Being Gay is a sin, and having a religion isn't a legit sin.
And why is it a sin? Because a 2000 year old book of bigotry and sheepherder myths says so?
And yes you don't want to believe there is a God because Satan has taken control of your lives
You go ahead and believe that, I know you're just saying that because the magical pink unicorn in the sky is making you.
Christianity is a belief.
Christianity, and all other religions, are baseless. Hence why "Faith" is required.
And what I truly don't understand about atheists, is their lack of reason.
Orly? Because it takes a whole lot of reason to believe in some magic deity and his holy book with absolutely no proof at all for it.
Sure, they will simply say everything they believe is 100% backed by evidence,
All of it is at least backed by something, maybe not strongly in some cases, but it's far better than something not backed at all.
But if atheists are right, when we die we are both bodies in the ground or ashes in the wind, with the same chance to be remembered by the world as the next guy. But if Christians are right, Atheists lose. Forever.
Fail wager. What if the Muslims are right? Or Hindus? Or Buddhism? Or any other of the millions of religions out there? You're assuming that it's a 50/50 shot, when really, even if there is a correct religion, it's more of a 1/10000000 shot. And that's if any religion we currently have is even correct in the first place.
So what is the reasoning behind being an atheist?
Why do you not believe in unicorns, or fairys or magic potatoes?
Are you obsessed with worldly things?
No moreso than you most likely, if not less.
Why must you be so obsessed with proof?
I'm a 266 foot tall purple giant that lives on a giant ice cream cone in the sky and whenever I dance, it rains. Since you don't need proof, I see we're in agreement.
Why not just kill yourself and remove all the hard work that you have to do to live?
Because I don't want to? Why don't you just go piss off a muslim and have him kill you so you can get into heaven if that's what you believe?
How can you understand anyone doing a good thing?
Because we, as a whole, decide what is right and wrong. There are certain things that we as a species have wired into us. For example, protected an infant. A random person who sees an infant in trouble will very likely have a strong urge to help, even if they have no idea who that infant is.
By being an atheist, you are simply betting whether you will go to hell or go to a coffin in the ground
By being an Atheist, i'm refuting the ridiculous notion of religion and all the bull it claims, plus all the issues it causes.
What makes you think these two things you picked out of the Bible are correct while others aren't? Just a subjective feeling perhaps?
Speculation on the structure of the atom caused controversy for thousands of years. It was changed many times, and may even change again when our technology improves. Observers would pick and choose parts of others theories and see which ones made sense to them.
With science we discard these things in order to arrive at a more accurate view.
In science, people based their statements on personal experiences and observances subjectively all the time (most famously "Spontaneous Generation". There have been generally accepted theories about things in science that have been only recently proven wrong and were considered fact for thousands of years.
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