I grew up atheist for 16 years. I had always kept an open mind towards religion, but never really felt a need to believe in it. My sister started going to a Wednesday night children's program at a church. Eventually, I was dragged into a Christmas Eve service. Scoffing, I reluctantly went, assuming that this was going to be a load of crap, but when I went, I felt something. Something that I've never felt before. I felt a sense of empowerment and a sense of calling. Jesus called upon my soul, just like he did with his disciples. he wanted me to follow him. Now, my life is being lived for Christ. He died on the cross for my sins, and the sins of everyone who believes in him. He was beaten, brutalized, struck with a whip 39 times, made to carry a cross up to the stage of his death. This I believe to be true, and I can never repay him for what he has done. I still have my struggles with Christianity, but I've found this bit of information most useful. Religion is not comprehensible in the human mind, because we cannot comprehend the idea of a perfect and supreme being, a God, but we can believe it in our heart, and that's the idea of faith. Faith is, even though everything rides against me believing in Jesus, I still believe in him because I know that it's true in my heart. I invite my fellow Brothers and sisters of the LORD to talk about how Jesus has helped you in your life. No atheists and no insults please
God is just. He is also loving, but don't forget he is fair and just.
The equivalent of going "LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU LA LA LA LA LA"
How is God loving if all our free will does is give us the option of eternal ****ation? How is God loving if he eternally tortures us for simply not believing in him because he has failed to provide adequate proof for his own existence? How is God loving if he kills millions of people for exerting their free will? How is God loving if he made us imperfect and punishes us for being so?
God is just. He is also loving, but don't forget he is fair and just.
Could you at least explain why he is just and loving despite of this? Why it is loving to allow someone to be tortured for an eternity for not believing in his existence?
God is just. He is also loving, but don't forget he is fair and just.
Hum this is starting to piss me off I look behind all the pages and every 5 pages this pops up not too original any more use a different line for once.
Hum this is starting to piss me off I look behind all the pages and every 5 pages this pops up not too original any more use a different line for once.
Of course it's unoriginal, that is pretty much all you can expect from group think. We are dealing with people who have been told what to think and have gladly given up independent thought for a conman's promise.
1). Free will allows for sin, yes, by its very nature; it doesn't breed it. Free will is not sin; the ability to disobey is not disobedience itself.
Is disobeying God is sin, then it's the equivalent of having a gun pointed at your head and saying "Give me your money. You have a choice."
When it comes to redemption, it really doesn't matter how good or bad a person you are. Christ still paid your payment of sin.
So God doesn't really care if we're a good or bad person. He just wants us to revel in his blood sacrifice. Wonderful.
Really, if God had only wanted to create a world where nothing ever went wrong, He wouldn't have created humans,
No. It's pretty simple what he could have done. Not made the freaking tree inside the garden of Eden.
Sin requires death, yes.
And this is loving how...? My kid throws a tantrum. I must kill him now. This is insane.
A holy God would make that so.
How do you know what a Holy God would do? Did he come down and tell you that he couldn't have made it some other way?
A holy God would make that so.
However, God allowed a substitute to take the place of people, so that they would not have to die. A loving God would make this so.
This is not loving. Love wouldn't mandate that you kill your own son, especially when you're all powerful and could, by definition, achieve the same result in an infinite number of ways.
God did not create "man as he is". God did not create people with a sinful nature. God created people with a free will, so they could choose to obey or not. Your argument of punishing fish for swimming, etc., would only fit if God were punishing people for choosing.
God created everything. God knew what they would do if they were created like that. Thus, God created man to sin.
You CAN'T argue this point, unless you're willing to concede that God is either not all powerful, not all knowing, or not all loving. His actions prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is NOT all three of these.
and there will be rewards lost in Heaven as well.
Where are you getting this from?
What would be "loving"?
Having us truly have free will and realizing that without divine guidance we can't possibly make the right choices and upon death enlightening us and then forgiving us.
That would foster people's hatred and resentment for God
Really? Because he already does that by having created us imperfect, not stopping horrible events, and ignoring prayers.
Let's see, not doing what God wants you to do is in your words a sin. Sin as you say here requires death. So not doing what God wants requires death. This God is a monster.
What would be "loving"? Not giving us free will at all? That would be controlling; love does not place people in chains.
Having to do what you're told under penalty of death and torture isn't loving, it isn't allowing for free will. That is controlling and putting people in chains. These are the actions of a dictator.
But since you guys keep wanting to bring up free will please point me to the part of the Bible where God says he is giving us this freedom.
Okay then heres my opinion christianity is messed up. Do some research on the old catholic churches there was a whole lot of corruption going on. In my beliefs im more of an indipendantd for everything I believe slightly in what was talked about but not enough to fully convert.
Some of the things and teachings catholics believe are different then what most Christians believe.
So what? Catholics are Christians too, any bad blood on their side translates to bad blood for Christians too, not in general, but it proves that Christianity itself can be corrupt.
And this is loving how...? My kid throws a tantrum. I must kill him now. This is insane.
Look, God's standards are very high. If it weren't for Jesus, none of us will be good enough to go to heaven. God is also just.
God created man to sin.
Yes. Just give a baby a machine gun and see what happens...
Let's see, not doing what God wants you to do is in your words a sin. Sin as you say here requires death. So not doing what God wants requires death. This God is a monster.
God in the first place didn't create man with a sinful nature. Man chose to sin and then sin came into the world. God is not a monster. He is kind and loving, but he will punish evil. God is just and fair.
God in the first place didn't create man with a sinful nature. Man chose to sin and then sin came into the world. God is not a monster. He is kind and loving, but he will punish evil. God is just and fair.
God is not fair. What kind of supernatural being condemns everyone to a default ****nation if we don't believe just because the first man and woman sinned? I haven't sinned, so why should I be paying for what two poor sods did in the past?
I don't know about that. Some things they teach go directly against the Bible. Especially the Roman Catholics. The Pope is not a replacement for Jesus. They shouldn't call the pope father because the Bible teaches that only God is the Father (don't get confused with your parent father. This is more like for a God title). Just look up what they believe. It will shock you.
If it weren't for Jesus, none of us will be good enough to go to heaven
In other words, we'd all be in Hell. Eternal torture and all. How does that make God just?
Yes. Just give a baby a machine gun and see what happens...
Lmao. Great. So you admit God gave the baby the metaphorical machine gun? He should be sent to prison for child endangerment. Plus a few mental checkups...
God in the first place didn't create man with a sinful nature.
Bull. God is all knowing. He knew that if he created man like that, man would develop this sinful nature. Thus, he created it.
If I set up the chain of dominoes, but someone else sets them off and they end up landing on the big red button which sets off a nuke, who's at fault? The 2 year old who bumped the first one, of the person who intentionally set the whole **** thing up?
According to the Bible, God is just framing us all. He made the conditions for us to sin and then punishes us for it so that he can guilt us into worshiping him to satisfy his blasted ego.
God is just and fair.
He is most certainly not. He has killed more people individually than any other person in history. He has condemned more people than are on this planet currently to eternal torture. His paradise is eternal worship towards him. Those are the actions of an insane, tyrannical, diabolical monster.
